Never Had It So Good

[Mattbolton]

Like many on here pretty much all of my adult life has been dedicated to dancing to, travelling for or collecting these wonderful records we revere so dearly.

Whilst there's been some incredible tunes played in my past I genuinely believe that the quality of soul music being passed around at present is the most exciting I've listened to in 17 years.

This of course is down to a hardcore of relentlessly hardworking, tastemaking DJ's but I honestly feel really grateful that I'm going through this period of soulful discoveries.

Although I acknowledge that many in their own right have likely been played in venues way before my 17 years on the scene I believe the amalgamated quality of genuinely 'soulful' records that are turning up way surpass the seemingly halcyon days of the likes of Wigan etc. Thats in no way a rebuff of the fantastic records that the likes of those many big 70's & 80's clubs gave us. They're incredible and we would probably not even be here without them.

But I feel we've finally reached the face of the goldmine (pardon the pun). Where these records have been hiding all my life I'm not sure but I'm glad they've shown their face.

What I guess I'm trying to say is that if the quality of music continues to develop in the way it does we're all in for one hell of a ride!

Thanks to all who have stayed at it with the shovels and dusty faces. The future looks brighter..

[Peter99]

mattbolton, on 27 Aug 2014 - 4:31 PM, said:

Like many on here pretty much all of my adult life has been dedicated to dancing to, travelling for or collecting these wonderful records we revere so dearly.

Whilst there's been some incredible tunes played in my past I genuinely believe that the quality of soul music being passed around at present is the most exciting I've listened to in 17 years.

This of course is down to a hardcore of relentlessly hardworking, tastemaking DJ's but I honestly feel really grateful that I'm going through this period of soulful discoveries.

Although I acknowledge that many in their own right have likely been played in venues way before my 17 years on the scene I believe the amalgamated quality of genuinely 'soulful' records that are turning up way surpass the seemingly halcyon days of the likes of Wigan etc. Thats in no way a rebuff of the fantastic records that the likes of those many big 70's & 80's clubs gave us. They're incredible and we would probably not even be here without them.

But I feel we've finally reached the face of the goldmine (pardon the pun). Where these records have been hiding all my life I'm not sure but I'm glad they've shown their face.

What I guess I'm trying to say is that if the quality of music continues to develop in the way it does we're all in for one hell of a ride!

Thanks to all who have stayed at it with the shovels and dusty faces. The future looks brighter..

Hi Matt

 

Good to hear your in such a good soul place. It could be a good thread this - give us a few examples to get the thread going.

 

Thanks

 

Peter

 

[Mattbolton]

I can start but wouldn't know where to finish.

Prime examples....

United Sounds

Sugar boy & Shades Of Black

Young Mods

Rideout

Emulations

Sag Warfare (the 'arguably' better side)

Salt & Pepper

John Harris

Edited August 27, 2014 by mattbolton

[sir cumference]

This should provoke some interesting responses!

[Mattbolton]

I reckon.

[Peter99]

sir cumference, on 27 Aug 2014 - 4:58 PM, said:

This should provoke some interesting responses!

Could be a good thread.

 

 

 

Nice

 

[Lovemusic]

When I saw the thread title i thought you were talking about the Other Brunswick single from Walter Jackson. This record could sum up your comments easily. I played it in the Jim Wray lounge a couple of Soul Essences ago and got some amazing comments from some of my peers. Most seemed to be unaware of its existence, possibly because it sits on the knife edge between Deep soul Ballad and frantic dancer. It's neither, yet both.  Since then I've been seeing it on a few club playlists, like the marvellous Just Soul doo's in Retford. A proper soul record with light and shade. Also Clarence Mann with Mans Temptation. It's a dancer! Who knew. More importantly is a fantastic soul record that would put to shame many overplayed classics.  So if they're playing records like those two out then I'm in agreement with you there. We Never Had it So Good. Just need the handbag soulies to get into them too!

[Lucky One]

Great to read such a positive and up beat post on here well done Matt.

[Peter99]

lovemusic, on 27 Aug 2014 - 5:16 PM, said:

When I saw the thread title i thought you were talking about the Other Brunswick single from Walter Jackson.

Wow! What a tip - that's one hell of a soul record. Just bagged a nice black and white demo of  tinternet.

 

https://youtu.be/enShKzlubxI

 

Brilliant stuff - thanks.

 

Peter

[Guest Dave Turner]

I can start but wouldn't know where to finish.

Prime examples....

United Sounds

Sugar boy & Shades Of Black

Young Mods

Rideout

Emulations

Sag Warfare (the 'arguably' better side)

Salt & Pepper

John Harris

 

Nice set of tunes. My kinda thing but perhaps not everyone's cuppa and certainly not one for the dance floor but I really like the flip to United Sounds.

 

[Pete S]

That lot against

 

Eddie Daye

Don Gardner

Lou Ragland

Marvelous Ray

The Sheppards

Jimmy Robins

The Magnetics

The Masqueraders

 

or 20,000 other records from the past...never in a million years

 

" IN MY OPINION "

[Guest Dave Turner]

That lot against

 

Eddie Daye

Don Gardner

Lou Ragland

Marvelous Ray

The Sheppards

Jimmy Robins

The Magnetics

The Masqueraders

 

or 20,000 other records from the past...never in a million years

 

" IN MY OPINION "

 

All good sounds Pete but for me and it seems others it's not a matter of comparing. Musically there's good and shite in all phases of "the scene" as it's progressed in time. 

 

I'd rather listen to what I think are good "newies" than some of what in my opinion are crap oldies ... and of course vice versa

[Pete S]

All good sounds Pete but for me and it seems others it's not a matter of comparing. Musically there's good and shite in all phases of "the scene" as it's progressed in time. 

 

I'd rather listen to what I think are good "newies" than some of what in my opinion are crap oldies ... and of course vice versa

 

Sorry Dave but the first post IS comparing and saying todays music is better than that which I grew up with.

[Mattbolton]

I see your point Pete and rightly so, my initial post was opinion as was yours. Fundamentally it's a taste thing, I guess. The thing is the records I cited ARE all records from the past but either no-one found them or gave a shit about them enough to hammer them. Perhaps if we HAD found them or given them a chance they would be etched on the tablets of soul history.

Dave's remarks go some way to describing my point. Some of them oldies you mention are great. Really great. Dazzling even. I'll say that some for me would be throw away records, not least the Shrine 45. Again a taste thing. But for a scene that has been ferociously turning up records for over 40 years I find it incredible that the records that are now surfacing (resurfacing?) are as stunning, if not more so, as those which for four decades constituted the musical canon of the scene.

[Pete S]

I see your point Pete and rightly so, my initial post was opinion as was yours. Fundamentally it's a taste thing, I guess. The thing is the records I cited ARE all records from the past but either no-one found them or gave a shit about them enough to hammer them. Perhaps if we HAD found them or given them a chance they would be etched on the tablets of soul history.

Dave's remarks go some way to describing my point. Some of them oldies you mention are great. Really great. Dazzling even. I'll say that some for me would be throw away records, not least the Shrine 45. Again a taste thing. But for a scene that has been ferociously turning up records for over 40 years I find it incredible that the records that are now surfacing (resurfacing?) are as stunning, if not more so, as those which for four decades constituted the musical canon of the scene.

 

They were just the first things that jumped into my head Matt.

I just don't think that anything can hold a candle to the 'old stuff' - I've not heard anything anyway - I think the John Harris record is great and I bought a copy of the reissue but just can't compare with even something as worn out as I Can take Care Of Myself.

[Mak]

I can start but wouldn't know where to finish.

Prime examples....

United Sounds

Sugar boy & Shades Of Black

Young Mods

Rideout

Emulations

Sag Warfare (the 'arguably' better side)

Salt & Pepper

John Harris

You have taste sir .

[Mattbolton]

If only to have just one of em, MAK.

[Mattbolton]

'I just don't think that anything can hold a candle to the 'old stuff' - I've not heard anything anyway - I think the John Harris record is great and I bought a copy of the reissue but just can't compare with even something as worn out as I Can take Care Of Myself.'

Yep, we'll definitely have to agree to disagree. ;)

[Pete S]

'I just don't think that anything can hold a candle to the 'old stuff' - I've not heard anything anyway - I think the John Harris record is great and I bought a copy of the reissue but just can't compare with even something as worn out as I Can take Care Of Myself.'

Yep, we'll definitely have to agree to disagree. ;)

 

Hardly any of this 'new' stuff would have been considered good enough in the 70's Matt - it is what it is - most sound like B sides - and we got into Northern to get away from funk, why would we want to embrace it?   If you can tell me one current record as good as Spyder Turner I can't make it anymore, I'll concede defeat

[Labeat]

OMG.... There are 10,000,000 better current tunes than Spyder Turner, skipfuls are being found all the time of quality Soul

[Mattbolton]

You're definitely picking the wrong oldies for comparison i think. If you were to pull out The Delites or Jimmy Raye I'd in some way concede perhaps. In terms of songwriting, vocal talent and arrangement every single one on that list makes ICMIA sound like Pinky and Perky.

[Guest eddiep]

Hardly any of this 'new' stuff would have been considered good enough in the 70's Matt - it is what it is - most sound like B sides - and we got into Northern to get away from funk, why would we want to embrace it?   If you can tell me one current record as good as Spyder Turner I can't make it anymore, I'll concede defeat

 Pete I think the point of this "new stuff" is that to many people it's exciting to hear and sounds "fresh".

As good as the old classics and standard "Northern Soul Top 500" are...some people including myself need to hear "new" sounds to keep the enthusiasm and interest going.

 

I've heard all the "old" stuff so many times now it no longer has the same effect on the old musical senses and dare I say....some stuff that I absolutely loved as a younger soul fan even bores me to tears now.   

If people prefer the oldies then that's great and long may they continue to enjoy them!

If it feels good.....and all that.... 

Live and let live....etc. 

 

But the small list of tunes Matt put up at the beginning of the post is really where the current soul scene is at for those that care to venture further than the oldies room. It's just another facet of this scene we all love I think, Some prefer the R&B thing, 70's and Modern, Out n out Northern etc,

 

I think all have their place in our world. 

 

It's just some styles of music are better than others!    (Hee He!)

[Pete S]

OMG.... There are 10,000,000 better current tunes than Spyder Turner, skipfuls are being found all the time of quality Soul

 

What utter rubbish.

[Eddie Hubbard]

I loved the old scene , and I'm equally loving the new scene .It's way more diverse than ever before ,and there are venues and styles of music for everyone .Feel very lucky to still be able to enjoy , attend  the venues and collect the music , who would have thought it after 40 odd years .Great uplifting post Matt .....

[Pete S]

You're definitely picking the wrong oldies for comparison i think. If you were to pull out The Delites or Jimmy Raye I'd in some way concede perhaps. In terms of songwriting, vocal talent and arrangement every single one on that list makes ICMIA sound like Pinky and Perky.

 

If you're referring to me, it's just a random group of titles that came into my head, all of which are better than anything played in the last 20 years, people who weren't at Wigan or Mecca or Cleethorpes cannot know what it was like, therefore cannot compare it.  Most of the records on your list are not Northern Soul.  Jimmie Raye and Delites are.  

[Mattbolton]

What I find comforting is that many of the new young faces have no spiritual link to those old venues and are free to discover their own sounds and develop their own '500' unencumbered by the past. And the quality is still top notch.

[Labeat]

What utter rubbish.

 

I went to an oldies night in Sheffield last week and thoroughly enjoyed it but the newer stuff to me is dynamite

[Mattbolton]

It's very probable that those 'sweet memories' of the Casino and Cleethorpes have tainted our vision of what is actually soulful. The Carstairs tore the scene apart but you'd be hard pressed to find a generic Northern Soul compilation today without it on.

[Pete S]

What I find comforting is that many of the new young faces have no spiritual link to those old venues and are free to discover their own sounds and develop their own '500' unencumbered by the past. And the quality is still top notch.

 

Everybody's got their own top 500 - I had mine long before anyone thought of making a book about it...don't make the mistake that everyone likes the same old 'oldies' - I refer you to my series of compilations Thinking Man's Oldies, over half of which are post Wigan and not in the 500 book.

[Pete S]

Come on lads, I'm on me own here

[Guest]

Pete I think the point of this "new stuff" is that to many people it's exciting to hear and sounds "fresh".

As good as the old classics and standard "Northern Soul Top 500" are...some people including myself need to hear "new" sounds to keep the enthusiasm and interest going.

 

I've heard all the "old" stuff so many times now it no longer has the same effect on the old musical senses and dare I say....some stuff that I absolutely loved as a younger soul fan even bores me to tears now.   

If people prefer the oldies then that's great and long may they continue to enjoy them!

If it feels good.....and all that.... 

Live and let live....etc. 

 

But the small list of tunes Matt put up at the beginning of the post is really where the current soul scene is at for those that care to venture further than the oldies room. It's just another facet of this scene we all love I think, Some prefer the R&B thing, 70's and Modern, Out n out Northern etc,

If there were still great 1960's discoveries cropping up, maybe things would be different, and people would not have to diversify into different styles of music!

I hope as people get older, they don't get too middle of the road and into easy listening music!

Edited August 27, 2014 by Guest

[Mark R]

I need to NOT follow this thread......and certainly not comment or I'll be accused of being vindictive again......

Dear oh dear.......

.......but well done on the outlook Matt......a nice attitude whatever I may or may not think of the specific choices.

No more from me......

Cheers,

Mark R

Edited August 27, 2014 by Mark R

[Guest Chris61]

Just because it's an 'Oldie' doesn't mean it's suddenly become crap music guys. Sorry to say. Yes you might have moved on and your tastes change. But, if a thread gets started that quotes ' the Wigan era' then the presumption is you are talking Northern?? Post 81 music doesn't stack up. I'll only make a fool of myself so I'll just use one example. On another thread someone mentioned not knowing the Mello Souls was a soul sin, so as I didn't I went and had a listen. OMG it's mediocre at best and tbh it's probably just crap. Rare does not mean good, expensive yes but not good. Just the opinion of a punter, not a collector,dealer, promoter, or DJ. Perhaps a large % of todays music was around years ago and the guys playing the music then just didn't think it was good enough. There is nothing wrong with 'Soul' music even todays. But keep it in the right box. Better get my coat before the nurses come, past my bedtime don't you know..

[Mattbolton]

For the benefit of diplomacy, before this thread gets out of control, I want to clarify my view.

What I find amazing, and for this I am thankful, is that after 17 years of doing niters and events I can stand in a club for 7 hours and not hear a single record I've listened to more than 4 years previously. Not once compromising quality of sound.

This is simply testament to the incredible heritage of black music and the efforts we have taken to seek it out.

[Len]

Hi Matt (again) I totally understand Pete’s view, and I think everyone will have a different one (depending on age / era) but ‘to add to the pot’ - I am constantly astounded at the tunes that the likes of Ion were playing through the 80’s, known to very few people, that are still in need of more recognition - I personally salute Ion ‘and the like’, because these are the tunes that I am now discovering (and sharing)

 

Yes, the future’s bright - if it’s the music that gets ya!

 

All the best,

 

Len  

 

P.s - All threads 'get out of control' - It's part of the fun  

Edited August 27, 2014 by LEN

[Guest Soultown andy]

Come on lads, I'm on me own here

oh no your not pete, these days very average and pretty poor records are touted as classics  . 

[Tattoodave]

I'm with you Pete, a confirmed oldies fan of the Casino tradition, I still have a wants list of oldies, and still get the hairs on the back of my neck raise when I hear them.  Some newer stuff might interest, but there's so much that has been embraced and held on tightly to for the right reasons in the past that will keep me happy for a very long time.

[Len]

I know some presume that people who are ‘hungry’ for the next big thing have written off the Classic Oldies, well everyone I know of that ilk do not - of course they recognise a great record! They are wanting more that’s all……In saying this; I also know some that are plainly tone deaf  

 

Len  

[Jkpnefc]

with Pete on this...............and still finding good oldies  I've never heard before

[Labeat]

with Pete on this...............and still finding good oldies  I've never heard before

 

Oldies Newies, Newies Oldies.... all the same really.... 60's&70's

[Pete S]

Oldies Newies, Newies Oldies.... all the same really.... 60's&70's

 

All I was trying to say was that I don't think the 'newies' of today are as good as the 'newies' of the 70's and 80's.

[Pete S]

OMG.... There are 10,000,000 better current tunes than Spyder Turner, skipfuls are being found all the time of quality Soul

 

Name one.  Thats better than Spyder Turner.  

or don't, I'm going to watch the football anyway...

[Labeat]

All I was trying to say was that I don't think the 'newies' of today are as good as the 'newies' of the 70's and 80's.

 

I respect your views

[Labeat]

Name one.  Thats better than Spyder Turner.  

or don't, I'm going to watch the football anyway...

 

ok, now you've forced me.... Pervis Lee "You don't care" (Arsenal will get knocked out)

[Markw]

Come on lads, I'm on me own here

And it's flipping well staying that way!!!

[JOHNNYBETCHA]

You have taste sir .

no he don't!!

[Pete S]

And it's flipping well staying that way!!!

 

We'll see

[Stubbsy]

Come on lads, I'm on me own here

 

 

oh no your not pete, these days very average and pretty poor records are touted as classics  .

Ok, I'll throw my hat in the ring! I'm with you Andy and Pete here. Lot of the "new" stuff being played nowadays on the Northern scene just doesn't cut the mustard with me.

Edited August 27, 2014 by Stubbsy

[Quinvy]

ok, now you've forced me.... Pervis Lee "You don't care" (Arsenal will get knocked out)

 

My god that's ghastly. 

[Kevinkent]

ok, now you've forced me.... Pervis Lee "You don't care" (Arsenal will get knocked out)

 

 Not bad....in a mediocre sort of way.

 

 - Kev