Darrell Banks 45 In The Guardian

[Philly]

But he posted it on here and gave us all photographs of it, and asked for people to verify it, because he didn't want anyone to know he'd got it?

Within 60 seconds it was worldwide news.

 

Posting on here for verification in my book is not an open invitation to publicise it all over the internet or in the newspapers ... as far as I am aware he did none of this, other people did.  It is obvious the guy wants no publicity and wants to be left alone, otherwise he would respond on the thread or to the I imagine hundreds of PMs that are sitting in his in box .. how he came about ownership has been confirmed by himself, he bought from the estate of an ex Decca pressing plant employee  ... why can't you all just be happy with that ?

[Pete S]

Posting on here for verification in my book is not an open invitation to publicise it all over the internet or in the newspapers ... as far as I am aware he did none of this, other people did.  It is obvious the guy wants no publicity and wants to be left alone, otherwise he would respond on the thread or to the I imagine hundreds of PMs that are sitting in his in box .. how he came about ownership has been confirmed by himself, he bought from the estate of an ex Decca pressing plant employee  ... why can't you all just be happy with that ?

 

So the most important record discovery ever should be kept to a web forum and no one else should know about it?

He only wanted no publicity in that he didn't want to talk to a journalist, he exposed himself and the record in the first place, not me or The Guardian.

[Philly]

So the most important record discovery ever should be kept to a web forum and no one else should know about it?

He only wanted no publicity in that he didn't want to talk to a journalist, he exposed himself and the record in the first place, not me or The Guardian.

Well Pete, the way I see and read it is like this ...... he puts up a post about the record looking for verification that it is the real deal ... as it turns out he has found one of the most important discoveries of all time, he does not post anywhere else on internet or go to any other forms of media with this find ... but within minutes you have posted on every forum that you are a member of, without even asking him if you could do so .. I am not disputing the fact that the find is immense but surely it is up to him alone to make any comments to media and press about HIS find ... or am I missing something here, are you his representative and he gave you permission to discuss it, also this has taken away his anonymity within the general population....  You mention that your friend from the Guardian asked you for permission to use YOUR quotes, did you offer Nick the same ie permission to go to the media in the first place?

[Pete S]

Well Pete, the way I see and read it is like this ...... he puts up a post about the record looking for verification that it is the real deal ... as it turns out he has found one of the most important discoveries of all time, he does not post anywhere else on internet or go to any other forms of media with this find ... but within minutes you have posted on every forum that you are a member of, without even asking him if you could do so .. I am not disputing the fact that the find is immense but surely it is up to him alone to make any comments to media and press about HIS find ... or am I missing something here, are you his representative and he gave you permission to discuss it, also this has taken away his anonymity within the general population....  You mention that your friend from the Guardian asked you for permission to use YOUR quotes, did you offer Nick the same ie permission to go to the media in the first place?

 

Yeah I did actually, and if you read the original thread, I also asked him if I could use his photos, as did the people from 45 Cat, and he said yes, so get down off your high horse for goodness sake

[Philly]

No high horse ... only questions .. questions are good .. aren't they?

[Pete S]

No high horse ... only questions .. questions are good .. aren't they?

 

They are good but you keep asking the same one which I already answered, and the answers are all over the original thread as well.

[spot]

Nice one Pete, a media piece that makes us look normal everyday people with a passion, instead of loony freaks bouncing about in clown suits and being on the edge of humanity, well done mate, at last sensibleness (If that's a word).  

Spot.  

[Pete S]

Nice one Pete, a media piece that makes us look normal everyday people with a passion, instead of loony freaks bouncing about in clown suits and being on the edge of humanity, well done mate, at last sensibleness (If that's a word).  

Spot.  

 

Sanity?

[KevH]

Nice one Pete, a media piece that makes us look normal everyday people with a passion, instead of loony freaks bouncing about in clown suits and being on the edge of humanity, well done mate, at last sensibleness (If that's a word).

Spot.

Agree with my learned friend. Great article Pete.

[Jaco]

Well Pete, the way I see and read it is like this ...... he puts up a post about the record looking for verification that it is the real deal ... as it turns out he has found one of the most important discoveries of all time, he does not post anywhere else on internet or go to any other forms of media with this find ... but within minutes you have posted on every forum that you are a member of, without even asking him if you could do so .. I am not disputing the fact that the find is immense but surely it is up to him alone to make any comments to media and press about HIS find ... or am I missing something here, are you his representative and he gave you permission to discuss it, also this has taken away his anonymity within the general population....  You mention that your friend from the Guardian asked you for permission to use YOUR quotes, did you offer Nick the same ie permission to go to the media in the first place?

 

Taken away his anonymity?

 

Does anybody actually know who he is? I'm sure there are a few who do but to everybody on here he is Nickw.

 

Sounds pretty anonymous to me.

 

And besides he put this up on a PUBLIC forum. If he wanted to keep this absolutely outside the public domain he could have consulted with many dealers and experts without resorting to putting information on a forum.

[Liamgp]

Think the article is a decent effort.

At least they didn't put your age Pete :-)

 

Or your vital statistics...

[Guest MBarrett]

he bought from the estate of an ex Decca pressing plant employee 

 

Allegedly.

 

Come on Nickw give us more info and more proof. Pretty please!

 

MB

 

P.S. Showing my ignorance here - but were the pressing plants owned by Decca or privately run?

[ricticman]

Before I get slagged off for this, firstly the journalist in question asked me to put him in touch with Nick, but Nick declined to speak to him.  Secondly, I don't actually use the phrase "half inched" so there is some poetic license there.  But it's a good plug for Soul Source and at least one person in the comments section has followed the link and come on here.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/music/musicblog/2014/jun/27/souls-holy-grail-why-the-rarest-record-in-the-world-is-causing-so-much-fuss

 

Good job Pete

Edited June 28, 2014 by ricticman

[Guest theblackflash]

Coupla things...

Firstly I'm concerned about the automatic assumption that the original owner 'half-inched' it. There is no evidence of this and, as well as being insulting, it could cause problems and questions that are unnecessary. How do we know he wasn't allowed to buy it? When I was a young working man firms would often let employees help themselves to that which was considered 'scrap' or 'waste'. It was seen as a way, in part, of justifying often very low wages.

'Lovejoyesque but more like Tinker'? Interesting choice of words. Sort of Ian McShane but lower class?

Am I the only person who thought this article portrayed record collectors as cranks?

Maybe I'm just having a bad day.

[Labeat]

the guys a member!

why are you talking about him as if he's not ?

have you pm'd him or asked him via this or the other thread

he was online 3 mins ago

 

people need to start treating this site and its members real world instead of these  lazy almost stirring type posts

 

Mike, there is so much uncertainty, speculation etc regarding this topic which can go on and on.

Would/could you make contact with the member (unless you already have done) privately to

provide some form of response, what is his intention? Hopefully this will be a genuine & happy outcome.

Thanks

[Pete S]

Coupla things...

Firstly I'm concerned about the automatic assumption that the original owner 'half-inched' it. There is no evidence of this and, as well as being insulting, it could cause problems and questions that are unnecessary. How do we know he wasn't allowed to buy it? When I was a young working man firms would often let employees help themselves to that which was considered 'scrap' or 'waste'. It was seen as a way, in part, of justifying often very low wages.

'Lovejoyesque but more like Tinker'? Interesting choice of words. Sort of Ian McShane but lower class?

Am I the only person who thought this article portrayed record collectors as cranks?

Maybe I'm just having a bad day.

 

What does it matter, nobody knows who he was, or is, the original post says that he took one copy of every record, we don't know if he was given permission to take it or just took it, but seeing as this was 1966 and it's in a defunct factory which no longer exists, and most of the employees and bosses are dead, who actually cares?

And if you think record collectors aren't in some way eccentric...

it's a great article and it does the record and Darrell Banks justice.

Edited June 28, 2014 by Pete S

[Labeat]

What does it matter, nobody knows who he was, or is, the original post says that he took one copy of every record, we don't know if he was given permission to take it or just took it, but seeing as this was 1966 and it's in a defunct factory which no longer exists, and most of the employees and bosses are dead, who actually cares?

And if you think record collectors aren't in some way eccentric...

it's a great article and it does the record and Darrell Banks justice.

Pete, some members will be intrigued to know of any past employee's input! A task for the Soul detective

[macca]

The very nature of this thread demonstrates we're all a bit two stops before Dagenham, but don't you just love it! 

[Guest MBarrett]

What does it matter, nobody knows who he was, or is, the original post says that he took one copy of every record,

 

Pete,

 

Surely it's called provenance. Some serious collectors as you will know (not just vinyl) are fanatical about provenance.

 

So and so said such and such on an internet forum ain't provenance. :no:

 

MB

[MrsWoodsrules]

Or your vital statistics...

Pete S from Wolves said... (aged 50 odd with a spreading mid drift)....

[Agentsmith]

conspiracy theorists, hypothesists and innuendo spinners........got em all on here...my god, story of the century, pictures of verification before you very eyes, item acquired from a deceased estate, whose employ would probably be made public at auction.......the recipient dosn't want all the baggage that is being slung his way.........WHY DON'T YOU TYPES ALL BUGGAR OFF ON HOLIDAY, safe in the knowledge it's a 100% kosher real deal story with a happy ending...in other words what was thought to never exist actually does, nick now owns it...and you all wish you had been in that unique position...YOU WEREN'T, SO GET OVER IT...there is absolutely nothing more in depth to this revelation..it smacks of sheer brilliance in its own right..its gone viral to great acclaim....ACCEPT THE FACT already!.

[paultp]

I thought it was a really good article; understandable if you are a record collector and understandable if you're not. one of the very few articles that doesn't show record collecting and/ or Northern soul in a bad light.

 

I hope someone eventually gets to verify the existence of this record, it's a great discovery.

 

Cheers

Paul

[Frankie Crocker]

What's the fuss about? Good piece of journalism from the Grauniad. Two decent tracks that are well passed their play-by date but still OK for an Oldies night, just. Does anyone get excited collecting UK sixties soul? Not me. They're generally US tracks on admittedly superior vinyl but almost always best on US labels, the original format and easier to handle with the centres pushed out. Holy grail is a term becoming far too commonplace, a marketing term aimed at pushing up prices rather than the best sounding record ever.

[Guest son of stan]

Nice article but Bob Stanley was rather rude to me once so he can shove it up his arse

Amazing find but the plant ran out of labels or the guy who pressed it up was messing about is my best guess.I have a single sided demo of Ying Tong Song by the Goons pressed up as a London American demo. Found in a charity shop. Other side as a separate record on a completely different label. Anyone want to offer me 10,000 quid?

Edited June 28, 2014 by son of stan

[Guest son of stan]

PS Does anyone know the background to why both Decca and EMI thought they had the rights to it? Sounds like, at best, flaky business practice by Revilot.

Happened a lot with Jamaican recordings ...

Edited June 29, 2014 by son of stan

[Tattoodave]

I want to believe, so until someone comes along with evidence that it isn't right I'm still saying "well done Nick", and "Well done Pete", the right type of publicity for once.

[Guest Polyvelts]

Nice one Pete, a media piece that makes us look normal everyday people with a passion, instead of loony freaks bouncing about in clown suits and being on the edge of humanity, well done mate, at last sensibleness (If that's a word).  

Spot.  

paying £10,000 for a piece of round plastic is normal behaviour ! 

[KevH]

Isn't this just typical.A rare record is found,on a UK label after 40 years of looking,and out come the knockers.

Its a played out oldie,i want to know the provenance,why would you unless you're buying.? ..etc etc.......sound engineer's and plant workers often had records given them,but some want to know who he was,what shoe size he took,what he had in his sarnies.

Can't we as a group just be glad its come to light at all.?? £10,000 for a piece of plastic is far from unusual on this scene.

[NEV]

Personally i wouldn't ask the guy on ebay, who is selling the Willie kendricks black issue, to sell it for you Nick ;)

[Guest Rob Alias]

This one...

 

 

You are being ironic here surely (in a Soul II Soul sort of way)?

 

:rofl: 

[Guest theblackflash]

What does it matter, nobody knows who he was, or is, the original post says that he took one copy of every record, we don't know if he was given permission to take it or just took it, but seeing as this was 1966 and it's in a defunct factory which no longer exists, and most of the employees and bosses are dead, who actually cares?

And if you think record collectors aren't in some way eccentric...

it's a great article and it does the record and Darrell Banks justice.

First of all, I didn't think what I posted was that contentious but was just a matter of opinion. It isn't that big a deal but...

If it was stolen, it is still the legal property of the original owner. Large corporations don't die - their assets are simply transferred.

Do I think record collectors are a bit eccentric?

 Some of them I guess. You, maybe, Pete ;-) I also think some of them show a dedication to the genre that is rarely exceeded outside of it. I also think they are a valuable primary historical resource. I also think they are mostly well rounded people.

I just object to lazy stereotypes. Stereotyping is how things like racism are born. I believe you should treat people with respect until they have demonstrated to you that they are not worthy of it.

Was it a great article? It was an OK article. The Lovejoy reference was strained and the Tinker reference was just bad manners. As if Lovejoy was concerned with items of real significant interest and record collecting is in some way inconsequential by comparison.

The stuff about Darrell Banks was nice. That was good karma. It was good to see it out there, and this forum getting referenced (as the soul scene has done far more than this article to keep his name alive). It was a little 6th form in style. Maybe undergraduate at best. But it was OK.

There are people on here whose research far exceeds that which would be necessary for a degree.

I'm genuinely pleased to see you getting your name referenced as some kind of authority particularly by someone you clearly regard as some kind of idol. I don't want to p**s on that bonfire but (and please don't overreact) I am struggling to see how it has anything to do with you to be honest. Is the elusive Nick not capable of writing an email for himself?

Don't get me wrong. I am not mortally offended by the article. All publicity can be good publicity. I just think it was a bit disrespectful and demonstrates how Soul people are regarded by the wider community. Perhaps as a result of the godawful coverage on the BBC and the current film that everyone is talking about.

It's just an opinion.

Edited June 29, 2014 by theblackflash

[KevH]

I do not see my post as lazy.He is a member.The search engine would have given him the answer in seconds.A google search would have given the answer in seconds.If this was to remain private then why the post?? This would have been a major scoop for the Guardian.I have sent a pm asking him when this find is going to he verified by an expert.I hope the holy grail has been found but until it has been verified it still remains a myth.

 

Major scoop for the Guardian.? Lets not get too carried away.This find only means anything to maybe 1000 people.

[KevH]

First of all, I didn't think what I posted was that contentious but was just a matter of opinion. It isn't that big a deal but...

If it was stolen, it is still the legal property of the original owner. Large corporations don't die - their assets are simply transferred.

Do I think record collectors are a bit eccentric?

 Some of them I guess. You, maybe, Pete ;-) I also think some of them show a dedication to the genre that is rarely exceeded outside of it. I also think they are a valuable primary historical resource. I also think they are mostly well rounded people.

I just object to lazy stereotypes. That is where things like racism are born. I believe you should treat people with respect until they have demonstrated to you that they are not worthy of it.

Was it a great article? It was an OK article. The Lovejoy reference was strained and clumsy and the Tinker reference was just bad manners. As if Lovejoy was concerned with items of real significant interest and record collecting is in some way inconsequential by comparison.

The stuff about Darrell Banks was nice. That was good karma. It was good to see it out there, and this forum getting referenced (as record collectors have done far more than this article to keep his name alive). It was a little 6th form in style. Maybe undergraduate at best. But it was OK.

I'm genuinely pleased to see you getting your name referenced as some kind of authority particularly by someone you clearly regard as some kind of idol.. I don't want to p**s on that bonfire but (and please don't overreact) I am struggling to see how it has anything to do with you to be honest. Is the elusive Nick not capable of writing an email for himself?

Don't get me wrong. I am not mortally offended by the article. All publicity can be good publicity. I just think it was a bit disrespectful and demonstrates how Soul people are regarded by the wider community. Perhaps as a result of the godawful coverage on the BBC and the current film that everyone is talking about.

It's just an opinion.

 

Racism.? Wondered when that would rear its head again.FFS.

[Guest Rob Alias]

Racism.? Wondered when that would rear its head again.FFS.

 

No accusation of racism is being made, just an observation regarding part of the myriad processes which inform it. Maybe you are being a tad too sensitive?

 

Rob Alias   

[Pete S]

You are being ironic here surely (in a Soul II Soul sort of way)?

 

:rofl:

 

I am deadly serious.

[Pete S]

 

I'm genuinely pleased to see you getting your name referenced as some kind of authority particularly by someone you clearly regard as some kind of idol. 

 

Could you just exaggerate a little bit more please?

I was giving some kind of background info on a writer that most people on here won't have heard of.

Honestly, people coming from nowhere under aliases just to try and make a decent article sound like a hatchet job.

What's the point?

p.s. I'm afraid I've been an "authority" on British releases for 30 years, I didn't just award myself a title.

Edited June 29, 2014 by Pete S

[Pete S]

conspiracy theorists, hypothesists and innuendo spinners........got em all on here...my god, story of the century, pictures of verification before you very eyes, item acquired from a deceased estate, whose employ would probably be made public at auction.......the recipient dosn't want all the baggage that is being slung his way.........WHY DON'T YOU TYPES ALL BUGGAR OFF ON HOLIDAY, safe in the knowledge it's a 100% kosher real deal story with a happy ending...in other words what was thought to never exist actually does, nick now owns it...and you all wish you had been in that unique position...YOU WEREN'T, SO GET OVER IT...there is absolutely nothing more in depth to this revelation..it smacks of sheer brilliance in its own right..its gone viral to great acclaim....ACCEPT THE FACT already!.

 

Well said Rob.

[Pete S]

Closing this as I do not want a really good thread turning into a personal argument.  The Guardian article was spot on in my opinion.  Not sure why people have to get personal.  Original thread is still open here