Jobell & Orchestra De Salsa

[Peter99]

soulboy1957, on 27 Apr 2014 - 4:10 PM, said:

JOBELL & THE ORCHESTRA DE SALSA "NEVER GONNA LET YOU GO" VG++ OR ABOVE PLEASE JAN OR PYE ISSUE

Two different presses of this on Jan I think.

 

 

Peter

[Steve G]

yes one longer than the other...

[Ben Summers]

I'm pretty sure both are the same, but the two sides of each pressing are different lengths of the same song, one being an 'edit' and one a 'disco' version! They were both released in 1976, not too far apart - the darker green label one being first, but the second, slighter lighter green one is a legitimate release too. (At least, I must have read all that somewhere or other...)  

[Kjw]

Lots of presses in various shades of green and different fonts

 

Simple to tell the original from the re-issues

 

The re-issues have the words 'Yukon Music' at the bottom of the left hand credits and the originals don't

[Ernie Andrews]

The original press has abreak after 18 seconds the 2nd press does not.

The 12 Inch is much longer and mich rarer. I sold an original acetate of the 12" last year

I might know where a Monarch test press of the 2nd press is!

[Steve Plumb]

Lots of presses in various shades of green and different fonts

 

Simple to tell the original from the re-issues

 

The re-issues have the words 'Yukon Music' at the bottom of the left hand credits and the originals don't

Here's what i believe to be details of the variations of Jobell & the Orchestra de Salsa-

The olive green 45 is the original with 'arranger Louis Ramirez' written on the label from 1975 ('75 date scratched in run out)

The two darker green variations from 1976 ('76 dates scratched in run out) do not have 'arranger Louis Ramirez' on the label

The more common darker green second issue has 'Yukon Music' on the label but the other variation does not have 'Yukon Music' on the label (neither does the olive green original)

The 12" I suspect came after the olive green original 45 as that's from 1976 as i think it's the same length as the second issue 'disco side' (and possibly the same mix?)

The times of the two original olive green sides are different to the two second issue sides AND are a slightly different mixes too!

The UK Pye 45 came out in 1977

 

If anyone wants to add owt else or if you think i may have got summat wrong, please let me know?

 

Cheers

Steve

[Kjw]

Here's what i believe to be details of the variations of Jobell & the Orchestra de Salsa-

The olive green 45 is the original with 'arranger Louis Ramirez' written on the label from 1975 ('75 date scratched in run out)

The two darker green variations from 1976 ('76 dates scratched in run out) do not have 'arranger Louis Ramirez' on the label

The more common darker green second issue has 'Yukon Music' on the label but the other variation does not have 'Yukon Music' on the label (neither does the olive green original)

The 12" I suspect came after the olive green original 45 as that's from 1976 as i think it's the same length as the second issue 'disco side' (and possibly the same mix?)

The times of the two original olive green sides are different to the two second issue sides AND are a slightly different mixes too!

The UK Pye 45 came out in 1977

 

If anyone wants to add owt else or if you think i may have got summat wrong, please let me know?

 

Cheers

Steve

 

 

That sounds right Steve - I've had two copies without Yukon Music in the credits and one had the arranger's name on, the other one didn't.

 

All are pressed in styrene  - the sound quality on the 12" is much better

[Stillsoulin]

there is also a version of the instrumental on united artists called heavy together, by the real thing, sounds almost identical to  the jobelle track. just as an aside.

[Steve Plumb]

there is also a version of the instrumental on united artists called heavy together, by the real thing, sounds almost identical to  the jobelle track. just as an aside.

Yes, i forgot to mention that too, nice one 

[Dave Pinch]

the real thing track is about 5 years prior to the jobell track also

[Kjw]

I'm sure there's another version  aside to the one mentioned - an album track. Can't remember the artists name but it was a disco LP.

[Val (Chunky)]

Original

[Goldsoul]

File this under Kev's Use(ful?)less trivia no.962........

Morty Craft owned the Jan(his wife) label. I was given the first copies of the single which were promptly given to Ian Levine at the Mecca.

Oddly enough, I was at Morty's appartment buying quantity of Gene Burks-You Got It on Chris-Craft a single MC had released years earlier.

I also sent copies of Jobell to my friend Dave McAleer at Pye hoping it would get a release. 

Jan by the way was nicknamed 'Red' for the stunning hair....Morty was a lucky and interesting man. 

 

KR

[Ringleader]

"Land Of Love" by the Moon People - Speed Records from 1968 has the same piano riff - this was also produced by Morty Craft

[Dean Rudland]

"Land Of Love" by the Moon People - Speed Records from 1968 has the same piano riff - this was also produced by Morty Craft

 

Looking at the credits of the that Real Thing record it looks like a Speed Records session, with all the same names involved as the 'Land Of Love' record, except Bobby Marin, who was incidentally A&R at UA Latino at the time of the Real Thing record.

 

Morty must have gotten the tapes to the Speed label when Stan Lewis lost the rights and sold it to Maurice Levy, as I think he was responsible for most of the reissues that occurred of that catalogue down through the years. He eventually sold his non-existent rights to Tuff City who have tried and failed to exert ownership ever since.

[Ringleader]

Looking at the credits of the that Real Thing record it looks like a Speed Records session, with all the same names involved as the 'Land Of Love' record, except Bobby Marin, who was incidentally A&R at UA Latino at the time of the Real Thing record.

 

Morty must have gotten the tapes to the Speed label when Stan Lewis lost the rights and sold it to Maurice Levy, as I think he was responsible for most of the reissues that occurred of that catalogue down through the years. He eventually sold his non-existent rights to Tuff City who have tried and failed to exert ownership ever since.

I just listened to the Real Thing track - Morty Craft obviously thought that riff was worth using at least 3 times

[Sebastian]

The times of the two original olive green sides are different to the two second issue sides AND are a slightly different mixes too!

 

The original issue is slower too. The later issues have been speeded up.

[Nocker]

What about the UK PYE issue which of the two green issues it that, first or second?

Cheers John

[Steve Plumb]

What about the UK PYE issue which of the two green issues it that, first or second?

Cheers John

Good question!

I don't have the UK version to hand unfortunately but i'm sure others will?

The UK copies that are on discogs say the UK 45 times are 3:03 & 4:56 but i couldn't see the times actually on the label, just in the listing. If this is right, this would mean they are the same versions as the reissue?

[Steve Plumb]

File this under Kev's Use(ful?)less trivia no.962........

Morty Craft owned the Jan(his wife) label. I was given the first copies of the single which were promptly given to Ian Levine at the Mecca.

Oddly enough, I was at Morty's appartment buying quantity of Gene Burks-You Got It on Chris-Craft a single MC had released years earlier.

I also sent copies of Jobell to my friend Dave McAleer at Pye hoping it would get a release. 

Jan by the way was nicknamed 'Red' for the stunning hair....Morty was a lucky and interesting man. 

 

KR

Great info Kev   

One question for you, where the copies you originally brought to the UK, the olive green originals OR had Morty Craft already remixed it and repromoted it by then, thus giving you the dark green copies? Did he have the 12" at the time too, as it looks like this was done from the second issues?

 

Sorry to ask such detailed questions about stuff from nearly 40 years ago but you know what we are all like? 

 

Cheers

Steve

[Goldsoul]

Great info Kev   One question for you, where the copies you originally brought to the UK, the olive green originals OR had Morty Craft already remixed it and repromoted it by then, thus giving you the dark green copies? Did he have the 12" at the time too, as it looks like this was done from the second issues? Sorry to ask such detailed questions about stuff from nearly 40 years ago but you know what we are all like?   CheersSteve

Can't remember to be honest. I met Morty at Downstairs records in the Times Sq subway in 1975. He mentioned he had old records and his involvement with Rock n Rollers Johnny and the Hurricanes.

Upon visiting his apartment, he didn't have too much apart from boxes of Gene Burks. I took around 50 of those and left several hundred.

He then played me Jobell and gave me several copies. As I had just left Wigan at the time, new releases were not of much use so I passed them onto Ian, Colin and others.

That's where my recollection ends on this one.

[Andybellwood]

Can't remember to be honest. I met Morty at Downstairs records in the Times Sq subway in 1975. He mentioned he had old records and his involvement with Rock n Rollers Johnny and the Hurricanes.

Upon visiting his apartment, he didn't have too much apart from boxes of Gene Burks. I took around 50 of those and left several hundred.

He then played me Jobell and gave me several copies. As I had just left Wigan at the time, new releases were not of much use so I passed them onto Ian, Colin and others.

That's where my recollection ends on this one.

one of so many fascinating stories Kev - its about time you wrote them all down as would make a great book about northern soul record collecting...

[Steve Plumb]

Can't remember to be honest. I met Morty at Downstairs records in the Times Sq subway in 1975. He mentioned he had old records and his involvement with Rock n Rollers Johnny and the Hurricanes.

Upon visiting his apartment, he didn't have too much apart from boxes of Gene Burks. I took around 50 of those and left several hundred.

He then played me Jobell and gave me several copies. As I had just left Wigan at the time, new releases were not of much use so I passed them onto Ian, Colin and others.

That's where my recollection ends on this one.

Hi Kev

I think you may have answered it yourself, as the date of the mastering on the reissue is 26/08/1976 and the 12" is 19/08/1976 whilst the original is dated a full year before at 27/08/1975. So, as you met him in 1975, it's likely it was the original 45's he gave to you?

Many thanks

Steve