Djing

[Guest turntableterra]

im going to play an hour of funk,.................. and clear the floor wtf. not at my soul nights, if they haven't danced for 2 records they come and let me know. and believe me technical knowledge is a must particularly with a tech 1200 mixer. you cant, as many do, just put on a record and ramp up the volume, every tune is different. or is it just me wanting people to have a good time?

[Guest]

Interesting thread but imo the club dance seen its always going to work and looking for any new mixing formats and has to happen for djs to get there name up there but as for 60's northern I cant see that it would work after all I used to mainly travel only to hear new tracks by upfront dj's who played them - the last thing I want to hear is 60's tracks mixed in some way but the modern side is a different story I would be up for anyone giving it a go but its going to be a hard one to change when many probably me included are as they say set in there ways from years gone by but who's got the balls to try it have you ?

Only one way to find out but good luck !

[Mark R]

Interesting thread but imo the club dance seen its always going to work and looking for any new mixing formats and has to happen for djs to get there name up there but as for 60's northern I cant see that it would work after all I used to mainly travel only to hear new tracks by upfront dj's who played them - the last thing I want to hear is 60's tracks mixed in some way but the modern side is a different story I would be up for anyone giving it a go but its going to be a hard one to change when many probably me included are as they say set in there ways from years gone by but who's got the balls to try it have you ?

Only one way to find out but good luck !

It already happens to an extent on the modern scene. ......

Cheers,

Mark R

[Scotters]

For what it's worth, I have high respect for a lot of Northern / Rare Soul and general soul DJ's that I've seen and danced to their sets up and down the country, especially those who make an effort to make the sound as best they can, but got to say I have equal respect to the thousands of jobbing DJ's that do their best to get things right in pubs and clubs and out the back of vans every other weekend. It's hard work but rewarding when you see people enjoying themselves and I'm loving being able to have a go at "DJing" across a wide range of nights....for now anyway

 

Cheers, Steve

Edited April 26, 2014 by 71 Steve

[Guest]

It already happens to an extent on the modern scene. ......

Cheers,

Mark R

Hi Mark -Northern modern events agree to an extent but its not like club djs

[Mark R]

Hi Mark -Northern modern events agree to an extent but its not like club djs

I understand what you're saying, but the point is they're not mutually exclusive, there is some crossover, if I can use that word without totally confusing everyone!! LOL

Cheers,

Mark R

[Daved]

Well I do agree that the NS scene has to evolve or it will fade out completely in the next 10 years or so. It's incredible that it's lasted so long. I'm in my 40s and I don't really care about it so much these days. I go to very few events even though I still love the music.

[Guest Byrney]

What would be helpful would be an example of how Northern Soul could be played in a new format of Djing, say beat mixed; technically I could do it although it would be a boring as it only last about 30 seconds until you're into the other track and I just don't think it would enhance the records.

Personally if someone's beat mixing I like to hear a 2 records mixed for a least a minute and in some cases 5 to 8 minutes chopping in and out of each, Eq-ing up and down and in some cases a drum machine or effects banged over the top. But that's house and Detroit techno which is made for that kind of caper.

So - to bring Northern up to date Rob how should it be technically played?

Edited April 26, 2014 by Byrney

[barney]

kinnell whats wrong with just putting on and playing good records leave the music for the artists .. cant get any emoticons so : )

[Guest Byrney]

kinnell whats wrong with just putting on and playing good records leave the music for the artists .. cant get any emoticons so : )

Until I'm persuaded otherwise I agree for Northern, but for music made with extended intros / outros they're made for mixing so why not.

[Mark R]

For me, any change in terms of the Northern scene would not necessarily relate to the technical side of DJ'ing, but would be more about thinking outside the box in terms of choices, style and the like.

The best DJ's have an edge, or something different about them.....Soul Sam is a perfect example in a variety of ways.......enthusiasm, going out on a limb to risk things......playing a full modern set at Wigan etc.....in some ways he's loathed by as many that love him......but he will be remembered more than most for both reasons.

It can sometimes be too predictable and safe.......too concerned with what people think short term at the expense of ploughing a furrow. Look at the furore of Happy getting a spin at Prestatyn.......why not!! Not necessarily that record, but you get my drift......

Just one point......earlier someone said why change a record with EQ or a different mix etc........well what do you think an alternate take from the tape vaults or on an acetate is? Oh, but that's alright because it's rare and no-one else has got it......and that's all that matters! !

Cheers,

Mark R

[Labeat]

For me, any change in terms of the Northern scene would not necessarily relate to the technical side of DJ'ing, but would be more about thinking outside the box in terms of choices, style and the like.

The best DJ's have an edge, or something different about them.....Soul Sam is a perfect example in a variety of ways.......enthusiasm, going out on a limb to risk things......playing a full modern set at Wigan etc.....in some ways he's loathed by as many that love him......but he will be remembered more than most for both reasons.

It can sometimes be too predictable and safe.......too concerned with what people think short term at the expense of ploughing a furrow. Look at the furore of Happy getting a spin at Prestatyn.......why not!! Not necessarily that record, but you get my drift......

Just one point......earlier someone said why change a record with EQ or a different mix etc........well what do you think an alternate take from the tape vaults or on an acetate is? Oh, but that's alright because it's rare and no-one else has got it......and that's all that matters! !

Cheers,

Mark R

 

All that matters is that a simple music is kept simple!!!

[Mark R]

All that matters is that a simple music is kept simple!!!

But that's already not true in so many other ways, so "complicating" it in the way I'm saying would hardly be a crime!!

Cheers,

Mark R

[Labeat]

But that's already not true in so many other ways, so "complicating" it in the way I'm saying would hardly be a crime!!

Cheers,

Mark R

 

You can't beat hearing music in it's "natural" form.... 4 beats to the bar stuff.... EQ or IQ don't change a lifetimes habit

[Pete S]

Why do people always want to try to fix something that's not broken?

You have to dj like this or the scene can't evolve.

You have to play records that sound like this otherwise you're stuck in a time warp.

Just go away and leave us to it.

[Dave2]

I try, whenever possible, not to be rude to people unless they really deserve it. When adults are talking children should be seen and not heard. If you do not understand simply ask and I will try to explain further, but it might be wise to consider that your level of understanding might simply need some development in order to keep up.

 

Rob Alias

 

 

Actually, Rob, he's kind of taking the piss. 

Fallen on deaf ears, John. 

 

Rob, it might be wise to consider that your level of understanding humour might simply need some development in order to keep up.

 

[Dave2]

Rob, is your post aiming to extract lots of views to support a book or academic paper on the subject? 

 

The context of your posts suggest to me, you're in dire need of material to support something you're working on academic wise?   If you need material you should say so, it could illicit more positive responses.

 

Would like to contribute more on the actual post topic, actually.  (Remember it  - but I'd need to do some more 'research')   But your attitude to the whole thread has made me reluctant as it's developed into a bit of a piss poor farce with false pretentions. 

 

ATB

Dave

[Sunnysoul]

An early pioneer without a doubt. I just re-checked him out and I didn't realise he was as early as he was. First DJ to use headphones by all accounts too, so he deserves a lot of credit........

 

Good call mate!

 

Ian D

 

 

Ian , while Francis Grasso was indeed a DJing pioneer , guys like London mod/soul DJ Jeff Dexter were using heaphones years before Grasso.

 

Here's Jeff Dexter in action from 1966 at Tiles in London ... double decks ... and headphones:

 

[Heisenberg]

wow - MOD-ERNISM in full effect

 

nowadays mod mostly means going / fleeing back in time

Ian , while Francis Grasso was indeed a DJing pioneer , guys like London mod/soul DJ Jeff Dexter were using heaphones years before Grasso.

 

Here's Jeff Dexter in action from 1966 at Tiles in London ... double decks ... and headphones:

 

 

[Guest Rob Alias]

Rob, is your post aiming to extract lots of views to support a book or academic paper on the subject? 

 

The context of your posts suggest to me, you're in dire need of material to support something you're working on academic wise?   If you need material you should say so, it could illicit more positive responses.

 

Would like to contribute more on the actual post topic, actually.  (Remember it  - but I'd need to do some more 'research')   But your attitude to the whole thread has made me reluctant as it's developed into a bit of a piss poor farce with false pretentions. 

 

ATB

Dave

 

 

Hi Dave.

 

As I have indicated earlier I very much hate to be rude but occasionally, as a response, it is quite necessary. Under those circumstances let us undertake a quick review of this thread. I introduce a clip of a DJ set from 1986 from a DMC World Champion to illustrate the apparent discrepancy between the discussions with NS regarding DJing and beyond. By post #19 (Mark S) the suggestion is made that this thread is sinking, by post #48 my use of language has attracted comment and a question is posited regarding my subscribing to a magazine of 'sociological' interest. This is quickly taken up by post #61 (Pow Wow Milk) asking for the use of 'plain English' and an accusation that the thread was a wind up. Ian Dewhirst enters the fray at post #122 with the view that the DJ techniques required within NS are very different from those developed elsewhere, and that they will remain so. By way of support he reminds us of his having listened to and heard (apparently) all of the great DJs since 1969, whilst acknowledging that NS DJs would not be represnted within any such technically considered list (a point worthy of further consideration).

 

Post #128 sees Pow Wow Milk venture again that I should be nominated (sarcastically or otherwise) for a plain English award, suggesting that the terminology used was unhelpful. Further, in post #129 Pow Wow Milk suggests that the original poster (me) has no idea what the thread is about.

 

I do not respond directly to Pow Wow Milk until post #131, which some might argue illustrates a remarkable degree of patience, ultimately resulting in Pow Wow Milk apparently discovering his / her inner intellectual by post #148. It might be worth considering if such prior dissembling on his / her part was deliberate, or part of a wider embarassment in respect of working class autodidacticism....

 

And now you.

 

Frankly, reviewing this thread, I would suggest that there is a recognition in some quarters that the NS scene could engage with the opportunities offered by new technology and DJ techniques, despite the opposition of some who appear to subscribe to the narrative of 'keep things as they are and have always been'. You appear to suggest that my thread was motivated by a desire relating to a book or some other intellectual pursuit. I say clearly NO but I do think that NS offers a particularly ripe ground for sociological and wider critical exploration, given the numerous narratives at play within the NS dynamic. Greg Wilson is another DJ who has recognised the potentialities at work, especially with regard to the discourse of race, class and sexuality, subjects painfully missing from Paul Mason's feature on the BBC's 'Newsnight'. One poster opined that the views of white journalists do not matter, but I would suggest that given the position of the BBC, as a national organisation able to validate or challenge wider social narratives, such pieces matter greatly (note also that Ian Dewhirst / Richard Searling have engaged with the BBC and contributed to such a discourse). For every attempt to present a dominant narrative the question always should be raised, 'why?'. Why is the story being told in this way, who is telling the story, and to what end? Moreover, who is the audience for any such narrative construct? Rather more tellingly, one could ask 'what voices appear to be absent from this discourse, and why?

 

Given that NS appears to consist almost entirely of black American music I would have thought that the validity of such questions would be self-evident? There are some that would attempt to suggest that music is just music, and that any other consideration (beyond the merits of danceability etc) is irrelevant, or that such questions are uneccesarily abstract or perverse, quite separate from any kind of sociological or discursive framing. Taking that response, and developing it, the Euopean symphonic form might be presented as an ultimate articluation of such an abstraction at work. Is anyone here, therefore, going to seriosuly suggest that Beethoven's No 9 'Choral Symphony', or the work of Wagner (particularly 'The Ring' cycle), or Bruckner, or Mahler et is just music, embodying nothing more?

 

I doubt that very much.

 

Being polite and with best regards.

 

Rob Alias

 

The Beats & Pieces Show

Starpoint Radio         

Edited April 27, 2014 by Rob Alias

[Mark S]

As for my post #19 the paper model was my gift to you to keep you occupied instead of the above rubbish

 

Look mate the Northern soul scene has for the last 42 years of my life been about dancing to great music and having a laugh and thats it

 

As for DJ,s .....well as long as they can get the needle in the groove without to much mither then I,m a happy chappy as are most on the scene , as for embracing technology why ? we are playing old music by old artists out of respect and deference to them it s only right that its played in the original format .

Edited April 27, 2014 by Mark S

[Markw]

Hi Dave.

 

As I have indicated earlier I very much hate to be rude but occasionally, as a response, it is quite necessary. Under those circumstances let us undertake a quick review of this thread. I introduce a clip of a DJ set from 1986 from a DMC World Champion to illustrate the apparent discrepancy between the discussions with NS regarding DJing and beyond. By post #19 (Mark S) the suggestion is made that this thread is sinking, by post #48 my use of language has attracted comment and a question is posited regarding my subscribing to a magazine of 'sociological' interest. This is quickly taken up by post #61 (Pow Wow Milk) asking for the use of 'plain English' and an accusation that the thread was a wind up. Ian Dewhirst enters the fray at post #122 with the view that the DJ techniques required within NS are very different from those developed elsewhere, and that they will remain so. By way of support he reminds us of his having listened to and heard (apparently) all of the great DJs since 1969, whilst acknowledging that NS DJs would not be represnted within any such technically considered list (a point worthy of further consideration).

 

Post #128 sees Pow Wow Milk venture again that I should be nominated (sarcastically or otherwise) for a plain English award, suggesting that the terminology used was unhelpful. Further, in post #129 Pow Wow Milk suggests that the original poster (me) has no idea what the thread is about.

 

I do not respond directly to Pow Wow Milk until post #131, which some might argue illustrates a remarkable degree of patience, ultimately resulting in Pow Wow Milk apparently discovering his / her inner intellectual by post #148. It might be worth considering if such prior dissembling on his / her part was deliberate, or part of a wider embarassment in respect of working class autodidacticism....

 

And now you.

 

Frankly, reviewing this thread, I would suggest that there is a recognition in some quarters that the NS scene could engage with the opportunities offered by new technology and DJ techniques, despite the opposition of some who appear to subscribe to the narrative of 'keep things as they are and have always been'. You appear to suggest that my thread was motivated by a desire relating to a book or some other intellectual pursuit. I say clearly NO but I do think that NS offers a particularly ripe ground for sociological and wider critical exploration, given the numerous narratives at play within the NS dynamic. Greg Wilson is another DJ who has recognised the potentialities at work, especially with regard to the discourse of race, class and sexuality, subjects painfully missing from Paul Mason's feature on the BBC's 'Newsnight'. One poster opined that the views of white journalists do not matter, but I would suggest that given the position of the BBC, as a national organisation able to validate or challenge wider social narratives, such pieces matter greatly (note also that Ian Dewhirst / Richard Searling have engaged with the BBC and contributed to such a discourse). For every attempt to present a dominant narrative the question always should be raised, 'why?'. Why is the story being told in this way, who is telling the story, and to what end? Moreover, who is the audience for any such narrative construct? Rather more tellingly, one could ask 'what voices appear to be absent from this discourse, and why?

 

Given that NS appears to consist almost entirely of black American music I would have thought that the validity of such questions would be self-evident? There are some that would attempt to suggest that music is just music, and that any other consideration (beyond the merits of danceability etc) is irrelevant, or that such questions are uneccesarily abstract or perverse, quite separate from any kind of sociological or discursive framing. Taking that response, and developing it, the Euopean symphonic form might be presented as an ultimate articluation of such an abstraction at work. Is anyone here, therefore, going to seriosuly suggest that Beethoven's No 9 'Choral Symphony', or the work of Wagner (particularly 'The Ring' cycle), or Bruckner, or Mahler et is just music, embodying nothing more?

 

I doubt that very much.

 

Being polite and with best regards.

 

Rob Alias

 

The Beats & Pieces Show

Starpoint Radio         

 

I still don't know WTF you're on about............. :g:But thanks for popping in........

Edited April 27, 2014 by markw

[Geeselad]

rob I find it a little odd that you only choose to talk about the technical aspects of the music rather than to focus on the music itself, particularly why the scene continues to be looks towards the 1960's and earlier. Many might say that the NS scene by its nature is defined by its association with the 60's, I and many others would disagree. I think its worthy raising because the possibilities of the scene moving along a timeline may be linked to its technical advancement. 

[Sunnysoul]

In my very humble view there are some apparent 'big name' DJs out there whose understanding of DJing as a technical skill remains rooted in the past, despite many of the innovations that have taken place over the subsequent years. Their reputations are based on the past, within a modern contextual narrative (all things being equal) they would not survive more than five minutes. The only reason for their apparent predominance is 'age' and 'who you / they know'.No wonder that for some the re-edit scene provided a lifeline that empowered them to appear to remain relevant and knowledgeable about current developements. The fact is they have no technical ability of their own and have to seek continuing legitimation through the work of others.

 

It reaally makes for a depressing situation, and some of you are responsible for this with your posturing regarding an imagined authenticity.

 

Rob Alias 

 

Rob Alias, you appear to make some quite damning comments about "big name" DJs on the soul scene, not to mention members on this forum whom you accuse of being responsible with their "posturing" for the "depressing situation" that you believe the soul scene finds itself in.

 

For you to make those comments,  it would be fair to ask whether you have ever actively been involved in the rare soul scene ... ever had any first hand experience of the rare soul scene to any degree ... whether as a DJ or promoter or simply by attending events  ? 

[Dave Rimmer]

Rob,

 

Let's do this the simple way.

 

If you think a NS set could be improved by using all the 'technological' improvements that us old buggers know nothing about, prove it. Do a podcast, post it up, and then we can all hear how much better you think it could be. Or if you've got the records, get yourself booked at an allnighter and I'll come and listen to you do it live.

 

Until then, I'm happy to continue doing what I do.

[Steve S 60]

I still don't know WTF you're on about............. :g:But thanks for popping in........

 

My sentiments exactly.  I think a little bit of wee came out when I read your witty riposte.

[KevH]

Rob,

 

Let's do this the simple way.

 

If you think a NS set could be improved by using all the 'technological' improvements that us old buggers know nothing about, prove it. Do a podcast, post it up, and then we can all hear how much better you think it could be. Or if you've got the records, get yourself booked at an allnighter and I'll come and listen to you do it live.

 

Until then, I'm happy to continue doing what I do.

 

So long as it doesn't include any Mahler.

[Guest Bearsy]

Hi Dave.

 

As I have indicated earlier I very much hate to be rude but occasionally, as a response, it is quite necessary. Under those circumstances let us undertake a quick review of this thread. I introduce a clip of a DJ set from 1986 from a DMC World Champion to illustrate the apparent discrepancy between the discussions with NS regarding DJing and beyond. By post #19 (Mark S) the suggestion is made that this thread is sinking, by post #48 my use of language has attracted comment and a question is posited regarding my subscribing to a magazine of 'sociological' interest. This is quickly taken up by post #61 (Pow Wow Milk) asking for the use of 'plain English' and an accusation that the thread was a wind up. Ian Dewhirst enters the fray at post #122 with the view that the DJ techniques required within NS are very different from those developed elsewhere, and that they will remain so. By way of support he reminds us of his having listened to and heard (apparently) all of the great DJs since 1969, whilst acknowledging that NS DJs would not be represnted within any such technically considered list (a point worthy of further consideration).

 

Post #128 sees Pow Wow Milk venture again that I should be nominated (sarcastically or otherwise) for a plain English award, suggesting that the terminology used was unhelpful. Further, in post #129 Pow Wow Milk suggests that the original poster (me) has no idea what the thread is about.

 

I do not respond directly to Pow Wow Milk until post #131, which some might argue illustrates a remarkable degree of patience, ultimately resulting in Pow Wow Milk apparently discovering his / her inner intellectual by post #148. It might be worth considering if such prior dissembling on his / her part was deliberate, or part of a wider embarassment in respect of working class autodidacticism....

 

And now you.

 

Frankly, reviewing this thread, I would suggest that there is a recognition in some quarters that the NS scene could engage with the opportunities offered by new technology and DJ techniques, despite the opposition of some who appear to subscribe to the narrative of 'keep things as they are and have always been'. You appear to suggest that my thread was motivated by a desire relating to a book or some other intellectual pursuit. I say clearly NO but I do think that NS offers a particularly ripe ground for sociological and wider critical exploration, given the numerous narratives at play within the NS dynamic. Greg Wilson is another DJ who has recognised the potentialities at work, especially with regard to the discourse of race, class and sexuality, subjects painfully missing from Paul Mason's feature on the BBC's 'Newsnight'. One poster opined that the views of white journalists do not matter, but I would suggest that given the position of the BBC, as a national organisation able to validate or challenge wider social narratives, such pieces matter greatly (note also that Ian Dewhirst / Richard Searling have engaged with the BBC and contributed to such a discourse). For every attempt to present a dominant narrative the question always should be raised, 'why?'. Why is the story being told in this way, who is telling the story, and to what end? Moreover, who is the audience for any such narrative construct? Rather more tellingly, one could ask 'what voices appear to be absent from this discourse, and why?

 

Given that NS appears to consist almost entirely of black American music I would have thought that the validity of such questions would be self-evident? There are some that would attempt to suggest that music is just music, and that any other consideration (beyond the merits of danceability etc) is irrelevant, or that such questions are uneccesarily abstract or perverse, quite separate from any kind of sociological or discursive framing. Taking that response, and developing it, the Euopean symphonic form might be presented as an ultimate articluation of such an abstraction at work. Is anyone here, therefore, going to seriosuly suggest that Beethoven's No 9 'Choral Symphony', or the work of Wagner (particularly 'The Ring' cycle), or Bruckner, or Mahler et is just music, embodying nothing more?

 

I doubt that very much.

 

Being polite and with best regards.

 

Rob Alias

 

The Beats & Pieces Show

Starpoint Radio         

Which one are you ? Smash your nicey ? 

 

Seriously though I would love to see your styrene copies after giving them a good ol scratch and sniff 

 

I have heard the saying on the scene that goes something like this "you either get it or your don't"   I feel you are more the latter of the 2 but hey I've enjoyed reading your posts it's helped me sleep at night 

[manus]

It really isn't an issue on the Soul scene as I know it - it's all about the records not the technical skill. I wouldn't travel to an event because someone boasted high technical expertise but I would travel if someone listed Soul records I wanted to hear and I would want to hear the records as they are without someone's interference.

[davidwapples]

I Think it happens on the breaks / funk scene but dont think mixing of northern tunes would go down too well

[Guest Byrney]

Rob, I'm genuinely interested as someone who loves the technical aspects of Djing, can you answer my previous question: to bring Northern up to date Rob how should it be technically played?

Can you outline an example say take two copies of the same record and mix it in and out so it's elongated for the dance floor?

Also do you think a DJ applying various techniques as demonstrated by some dance genres is a critical success factor of new or emerging audience? A counter position is that that current approach offers an alternative to mainstream culture by adopting a style to suit the format, this may convey an alternate identity to potential newbies. Let's be honest your local pub DJ can mix now so hardly underground and novel as it once was.

My personal view at this point is that applying these techniques to Northern Soul cannot work, you'd be limited to tracks that offer an opportunity to mix, extend whatever. but I'm open to your guidance.

I'd also urge you when responding to take into account the variety of audiences you have on Internet forums and how they consume; quick to the point with well though arguments hit the spot.

[Mark R]

My personal view at this point is that applying these techniques to Northern Soul cannot work, you'd be limited to tracks that offer an opportunity to mix, extend whatever. but I'm open to your guidance.

And that's exactly the danger of mixing.........being more concerned with what goes with what, rather than how good the "what" is!!

Cheers,

Mark R

Edited April 28, 2014 by Mark R

[Guest Matt Male]

I still don't know WTF you're on about............. :g:But thanks for popping in........

 

 

I tell you what, he's getting some use out of that thesaurus he got for Christmas.

 

Although verbosity is obviously missing from his dictionary.

Edited April 29, 2014 by Matt Male

[Guest Rob Alias]

Rob, I'm genuinely interested as someone who loves the technical aspects of Djing, can you answer my previous question: to bring Northern up to date Rob how should it be technically played?

Can you outline an example say take two copies of the same record and mix it in and out so it's elongated for the dance floor?

Also do you think a DJ applying various techniques as demonstrated by some dance genres is a critical success factor of new or emerging audience? A counter position is that that current approach offers an alternative to mainstream culture by adopting a style to suit the format, this may convey an alternate identity to potential newbies. Let's be honest your local pub DJ can mix now so hardly underground and novel as it once was.

My personal view at this point is that applying these techniques to Northern Soul cannot work, you'd be limited to tracks that offer an opportunity to mix, extend whatever. but I'm open to your guidance.

I'd also urge you when responding to take into account the variety of audiences you have on Internet forums and how they consume; quick to the point with well though arguments hit the spot.

 

Hi Byrney.

 

Firstly I would say that my intention would not be to suggest bringing the particular music associated with the 'Northern Soul Scene' (NSS) up to date (I have used this term quite deliberately to make clear the non-Northern England origins of the music). Given that most (if not all) of the original vinyl NSS music appeared on 7" vinyl I would suggest that experience would indicate that attempting to extend a particular break or 'needle-dropping' would not quite work (although it would not be impossible - depending on the technical skills of the DJ). Similarly any attempt to 'scratch' or 'cut' would be similarly limited but would not be impossible.

 

Where I think there could be scope would be in elongating particular parts of a record, which can be done live via a sample box, which would allow the DJ to record short 'snaps' of a particular record, and allow them to replay them 'live' to the audience. This could work very well in extending the parts of a record that are especially loved, or in helping the DJ if they did want to attempt a mix in to another NSS record. In this way, once recorded and looped, the DJ can then explore further options as they see fit.

 

The use of edits could be considered to extend a favourite track, to extend a break, prolong the intro, increase the outro, repeat the intro or middle eight. There is a huge scene existing outside of the NSS with some very talented individuals who are able to edit a record sympathetically without alienating the original audience whilst making the track more 'user friendly' for DJs. This doesn't appear to have caught on massively (as far as I am aware) within NSS - why?

 

I fully appreciate your point regarding the introduction of new techniques, to be honest that is a question be addressed off the forum (before any further sarcasm is invited). With local DJs at pubs etc, and even with a few big 'name' DJs, I have been shocked at the level of mixing that can be heard - at a time when, arguably, given the tools at hand (especially in the digita domain) a 'mixing by numbers' approach has never been easier - courtesy of a 'sync' or bpm display. Again, this might be generational, but there is a cohort of DJs out there that had to learn to ride the pitch control on a Technics deck (including me), where making a 'long' mix (beyond a simple outro A + intro B approach) took effort, time, imagination and some skill.

 

If your interest is genuine then contact me via pm. Starting this thread (and listening to something in the car today) has given me an idea.

 

Love and respect

 

Rob Alias

 

The Beats & Pieces Show

Starpoint Radio

[Guest Rob Alias]

And that's exactly the danger of mixing.........being more concerned with what goes with what, rather than how good the "what" is!!

Cheers,

Mark R

Mark.#

 

In fairness, any DJ worth their salt would almost certainly have considered the 'how good what is' before initiating the mixing process? Or would even be engaged in that process as they mixed (I say this as someone who mixes live with no pre-recorded mixes used). The failure to do so is often reflected in the a+b mixing approach heard in some quarters. The purpose of a dancefloor mix is to keep the pulse of the mix interesting, inspiring, original and emotionally engaging. Which is why (I assume) the DJ Spen youtube clip appealed to you so much.

 

Love and Respect.

 

Rob Alias

 

The Beats & Pieces Show

Starpoint Radio

[Dave Rimmer]

Rob,

 

Let's do this the simple way.

 

If you think a NS set could be improved by using all the 'technological' improvements that us old buggers know nothing about, prove it. Do a podcast, post it up, and then we can all hear how much better you think it could be. Or if you've got the records, get yourself booked at an allnighter and I'll come and listen to you do it live.

 

Until then, I'm happy to continue doing what I do.

 

 

Rob,

 

You appear to have completely disregarded my post.

 

Let's see if you can do what you claim, or is it all just hot air........

Edited April 29, 2014 by Dave Rimmer

[Sutty]

Not all music needs looping and extending, some of it is perfect the way it is, extending it doesn't make it any better. You have Rob as Dave has said only answered the questions you feel like answering that allow you to expound your own theories on the way the scene should develop and conveniently dropping in how great you are technically in the process. You accuse others of being stuck in some sort of safety zone, try stepping outside yours and take on board and give some answers to the valid questions instead of picking and choosing.

 

Will any of this happen? I doubt it but willing to believe it might. Let's start by you showing everyone what the future should hold, as  requested? And how about answering the questions about what events do you go to hear this limited style to back up your posts, or have you just read about it?

[Guest Rob Alias]

Not all music needs looping and extending, some of it is perfect the way it is, extending it doesn't make it any better. You have Rob as Dave has said only answered the questions you feel like answering that allow you to expound your own theories on the way the scene should develop and conveniently dropping in how great you are technically in the process. You accuse others of being stuck in some sort of safety zone, try stepping outside yours and take on board and give some answers to the valid questions instead of picking and choosing.

 

Will any of this happen? I doubt it but willing to believe it might. Let's start by you showing everyone what the future should hold, as  requested? And how about answering the questions about what events do you go to hear this limited style to back up your posts, or have you just read about it?

 

Dear Sutty.

 

It isn't a simple 'yes / no' dichotomy, some tracks might be made better by being extended or re-worked, building the tension for the dancers and audience. As regards 'how great I am technically', I would simply claim competence, your reading of my posts appears to be quite skewed, and working according to a particular agenda. As regards events etc, do you have a radio show that I can listen to, live, to prove YOUR mettle or technical competence? Can you mix? Put up your tracklists. provide details of your LIVE mixes?

 

You can check back over mine, mixes and otherwise, they are viewable and available. Or better still, let me know your availability and you can be a guest on my show, submit a mix, or come and DJ LIVE exhibiting your unique skills.

 

Rob Alias

 

The Beats & Pieces Show

Starpoint Radio

Edited April 29, 2014 by Rob Alias

[Dave Rimmer]

You've still ignored my post.

[Guest Rob Alias]

Dave.

 

I assume you refer to post #175?

 

First I would not use the term 'old buggers' - this says more about you than me. In respect of playing, if you want me to play contact me and I'll quote rates and agree prices. I suspect, howewer, that my approach to music would not work for the vinyl only pursists.

 

However, if you want to 'talk the talk' then 'walk the walk' and come on my show. Show me what you can do LIVE as a DJ, technically or otherwise. Show me how you think it should be done.

 

Simples.

 

Rob Alias

 

The Beats & Pieces Show

Starpoint Radio 

[Mark S]

Rob Alias AKA Jive bunny FFS

[Dave Rimmer]

Dave.

 

I assume you refer to post #175?

 

First I would not use the term 'old buggers' - this says more about you than me. In respect of playing, if you want me to play contact me and I'll quote rates and agree prices. I suspect, howewer, that my approach to music would not work for the vinyl only pursists.

 

However, if you want to 'talk the talk' then 'walk the walk' and come on my show. Show me what you can do LIVE as a DJ, technically or otherwise. Show me how you think it should be done.

 

Simples.

 

Rob Alias

 

The Beats & Pieces Show

Starpoint Radio 

 

You've adroitly managed to avoid answering my question. It's not about me. I'm quite happy with my abilities as a DJ. I've DJ'ed all over the UK, Europe and the States, at nearly 100 weekenders over the last twenty years, several hundred of allnighters, and probably close to a thousand club nights. I must be getting it right because people keep booking me, and I happily admit I've never done any mixing or scratching !

 

It's about your claims that you could do better because of your technical abilities as a DJ.

 

So, the challenge is, you've talked the talk, now prove it. Let's hear you DJ using all your technical abilities playing Sixties Northern Soul. You're happy to criticise the way I do it, but offer nothing as an improvement.

 

Well I suggest you either put up, or shut up at this point.

 

So, a podcast featuring all your skills and tricks, and technical abilities please. I'll even let you use CDs, because I suspect you won't have the original vinyl that you would need to succeed as a DJ on the Northern scene (Forgive me if I'm wrong though)

 

Or just quietly slink away.

Edited April 30, 2014 by Dave Rimmer

[Twoshoes]

Just a few thoughts from a simple minded punter,no aspirations to be a Dj, this might be an age thing but I'd be happy if some Dj' s just turned down the volume a tad,volume just does not equate with increased enjoyment of the music ,I don't feel I should have to leave the room or use a megaphone to carry on a conversation,maybe that's just me. As with a couple of others I'd be interested to know Rob' s pedigree on the scene as with each post the only things that spring to mind concerning the scene are "arse and elbow" .I can picture it now and by the way I like and often dance to the record but I can only imagine the reaction from some quarters if over the mike a Dj announces "and now for my specially extended double mixed ,scratched dubbed ,sequenced or whatever the technical jargon is (I should know but to be honest I lost interest half way through some of the posts) 15 min version of Bob Sinclair's Tribute. I struggle to get to the end of The Brothers without collapsing in a heap so for me play the records as intended don't faff about with something that aint broken

I'll put my head back in the sand now.

[Guest SoulBroRecs]

Dave's got a point Rob: knock up a 60 minute mix of 60s northern tunes that you've extended/mixed - I don't think he or anyone else said they could do it: they've all said give us an example because they can't/won't/don't want to do it. I'd be intrigued to hear it. Bet most others would too. 

[Steve S 60]

The only extended cuts I'm interested in is those laid down by the original artists at the time, although I am partial to an extended cut of sirloin.

[Sutty]

 

Once again completely avoiding the issue and questions, it's not about MY technical competency, I never mentioned that and it's irrelevant - you're the one saying the northern souls scene has to change to survive. Clearly this is a waste of time so i'll bow out, you're not going to answer what events you've been at to back up your statements as the likelihood is you haven't, you'relikely to be relying on 2nd hand information you've probably read about or that others have told you in conversation. As such, you have no valid points as you offer no response or evidence that you even know the scene you are talking about. Next time you decide you want to revive a dying luddite scene and bang on about yourself with your own ideas, at least do your background. This topic isn't about the northern scene, it's about you,

 

 

Edited April 30, 2014 by Sutty

[KevH]

Scratching,mixing or whatever has its place.For me its in the world of hip hop,new rnb,etc.The soul records i'm interested in are just fine and dandy the way they are,in the main.

Here's a thought for radical NS dj's.Why not just "mix" in an Instrumental and vocal track.Boom! your very own extended mix.

Or better still ...leave well alone.

 

Kev ( change is not good ) H.

[Dave Rimmer]

Scratching,mixing or whatever has its place.For me its in the world of hip hop,new rnb,etc.The soul records i'm interested in are just fine and dandy the way they are,in the main.

Here's a thought for radical NS dj's.Why not just "mix" in an Instrumental and vocal track.Boom! your very own extended mix.

Or better still ...leave well alone.

 

Kev ( change is not good ) H.

Oh I've done that at Rugby, with Rose Batistte and Doni Burdick. Please keep up !

[KevH]

Oh I've done that at Rugby, with Rose Batistte and Doni Burdick. Please keep up !

 

That's my trouble Dave,can't keep up.

[Ian Dewhirst]

Oh I've done that at Rugby, with Rose Batistte and Doni Burdick. Please keep up !

 

I did it with Duke Browner Voc and Inst in the 70's. I used a 'chop-segue' technique on the Moog breakdown.....

 

Ian D