Djing

[Guest Rob Alias]

www.youtube.com/watch?v=2yxnhoLQ_hk

 

From 1986 DJ Cheese performing his Disco Mix Club (DMC) Championship routine. This is clearly evidence of how the technical aspects of DJing had changed, and I think helps to put some of the discussions regarding DJing here in to some perspective.

 

Rob Alias

[Tlscapital]

www.youtube.com/watch?v=2yxnhoLQ_hk

 

From 1986 DJ Cheese performing his Disco Mix Club (DMC) Championship routine. This is clearly evidence of how the technical aspects of DJing had changed, and I think helps to put some of the discussions regarding DJing here in to some perspective.

 

Rob Alias

Hand-cuffed scratcher DJ ! Indeed I can't wait to see any "young" (cos they have to be) Northern soul" DJ's do their action scratching...   

[Guest Dave Ward]

DJs Needed For DJ Work

 

DJs required for work across the UK Established in 2004. Apply today!

 

Whatever next ? Welders required for welding work ?

[Guest Gogs]

With the price of records i don't want them scratched.

[Guest Rob Alias]

You see this puts much of the discussion regarding what constitutes 'Djing' in to a very useful context. At least after Froggy's experiences with Larry Levan and the slow introduction of the Technics 1200 (and later 1210), the techical apsects of DJing changed in some musical forms, indeed in Hip Hop and Electro Funk this particular skill constituted a particular aspect of credibility. The days of just fading from one record to another and talking were over. This kind of DJing had been predominat prior to the early 1980s but it is clear that it was soon not enough and that technical ability mattered.

 

Within this context, the concentration of original vinyl only (ovo) could be sustained only in so far as the technical horizon was delimited by practical accessibility. This was a development which was positive and negative, and would ultimately result in the 'goatee scratching self interested musical navel gazing' that can sometimes be seen in certain quarters. However, if DJing is about engaging with a crowd and developing a musical dynamic then DJs such as Jazzy Jeff et al remain pre-eminent. Yet despite such developments over the last 30 odd years some of you here appear to want to concentrate on the issue of whether the vinyl being played is original or not. This is nonsensical and ignores the fact that audience expectations have changed in this time, talking and fading from A to B is simply not enough, and as a potential paying punter I would find it simply unacceptable if this was how the evening developed. I expect, if not demand, musical knowledege, musical empathy and technical skills, not pre-1980 self-mythologising attempts at authenticity (whatever that actually means). As a DJ I expect more than a simple A-B mixer, without a decent cross fade etc. 

 

In my very humble view there are some apparent 'big name' DJs out there whose understanding of DJing as a technical skill remains rooted in the past, despite many of the innovations that have taken place over the subsequent years. Their reputations are based on the past, within a modern contextual narrative (all things being equal) they would not survive more than five minutes. The only reason for their apparent predominance is 'age' and 'who you / they know'.No wonder that for some the re-edit scene provided a lifeline that empowered them to appear to remain relevant and knowledgeable about current developements. The fact is they have no technical ability of their own and have to seek continuing legitimation through the work of others.

 

Looking at the bigger picture is it any reason that some sections of 'the scene' (not limited to 'Northern') are on their knees? Poor presentation against modern expectations are particularly relevant in passing the musical flame on, unless you want to criticize modern DJs for not using original vinyl or worshipping at the feet of Wigan etc. This is a spectatcular case of musical onanism.

 

And this is without considering the wider contextual narratives of class and race, especially in respect of 'Northern Soul', predicated on a black musical art form.

 

It reaally makes for a depressing situation, and some of you are responsible for this with your posturing regarding an imagined authenticity.

 

Rob Alias   

[Guest john s]

Ha ha, excellent!

[Guest Rob Alias]

With the price of records i don't want them scratched.

 

I understand that, and that is why mp3 / Serato is useful. If we widen the discussion to consider vinyl as a social and historical artifact (we might consider Walter Benjamin and the issue of 'authenticity') then it makes sense to preserve the original heritage and use alternatives where available.

 

Rob Alias

[Guest john s]

As I said, excellent! 

[Guest john s]

.

Edited April 22, 2014 by john s

[Guest Rob Alias]

"The next time a 'Northern Soul' discussion occurs at which the apparent merits of DJing are discussed, and what actually constitutes DJing (original vinyl only, two turntables and no use of the cross fade) take some time to listen to this. It really helps to understand why so many discussions belong to the ear prior to Froggy hearing Larry Levan. So, over 30 years ago! "

www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fusf7njrcP4 

 

That illustrates my point nicely, 2014 and the music and technical skills blend together to present an involving and musically engaging narrative. Present that challenge to some folks here and I imagine only one word: FEAR.

 

Rob Alias   

Edited April 22, 2014 by Rob Alias

[Guest john s]

I'd imagine it does illustrate your point nicely, I took it from your Facebook page!

[Guest Rob Alias]

I'd imagine it does illustrate your point nicely, I took it from your Facebook page!

 

I know John, I'm still trying to work out your position regarding these issues?!

 

Rob Alias 

[Dave2]

www.youtube.com/watch?v=2yxnhoLQ_hk

 

From 1986 DJ Cheese performing his Disco Mix Club (DMC) Championship routine. This is clearly evidence of how the technical aspects of DJing had changed, and I think helps to put some of the discussions regarding DJing here in to some perspective.

 

Rob Alias

 

Curtis Blow - Party Time

Doug E Fresh & The Get Fresh crew - the Show

 

Remember Chad Jackson leading the way for the UK mid/ late 80's.  Robbie Vincent covered such events after the Radio 1 top 40 every Sunday night!  The diverse range of 'themed mixing' eventually competing against 'newer' turntable skills that constituted... well, just noise really.  and the gimmicks...  :-)

[Guest Rob Alias]

Curtis Blow - Party Time

Doug E Fresh & The Get Fresh crew - the Show

 

Remember Chad Jackson leading the way for the UK mid/ late 80's.  Robbie Vincent covered such events after the Radio 1 top 40 every Sunday night!  The diverse range of 'themed mixing' eventually competing against 'newer' turntable skills that constituted... well, just noise really.  and the gimmicks...  :-)

 

 

That will be Kurtis Blow, and Doug. E Fresh & The Get Fresh Crew was @1985.

 

So what is your point? Robbie Vincent was not involved within the evolving world of technical DJing, nor would he ever claim to be a practitioner. Chad Jackson didn't win until 1986 (with a techically poor set that simply failed to acknowledge the influence of 'Transforming'). 

 

So I ask again, what is your point?

 

Rob Alias

[Guest john s]

Well to be honest I have no idea what point you're making. If you're suggesting that 'Northern Soul' DJs need to attain the skill levels of a Kentaro or Q-Bert, or even a Dave Lee or Kerri Chandler, I'd say you're missing the point really. It's not about that. 

 

I'd also say that your suggestion that "audience expectations have changed in this time, talking and fading from A to B is simply not enough, and as a potential paying punter I would find it simply unacceptable if this was how the evening developed" is largely irrelevant in the context - which is about the tunes themselves, and not the transitions. 

 

I would also imagine that the chances of your being a "paying punter" at any events featured on this site are fairly slim, as your tastes and musical direction seem rather different!

 

Nice Walter Benjamin name-drop, though!

[Tlscapital]

Don't know where this is going, (new posts in betweens before i go t bed) but (and but is not an excuse) this is pointless to oppose the "scratchers", "mixers" and "IN-novators" to "the selectors" as such. Being from the last bunch and I won't change, I am fascinated and enjoying such a show only a little less by discovering or hearing well a loved TUNE in a spot. Call it whatever, but I'm for the music first and beyond sound & effect there should be music (tunes) and what makes music is a tune for me. That's an IMHO but I sing, dream and live with music. And I choose my tunes. Too many DJ's are listening to music as a 'is it something I can place (use) in a set or not'. Music should, don't take my word for grudge full or anything like that, be free.  It's more than materialistic. I dig other peoples stuffs and I've got my own. Indeed great DJ Cheese spot !

Edited April 22, 2014 by tlscapital

[Guest Rob Alias]

Well to be honest I have no idea what point you're making. If you're suggesting that 'Northern Soul' DJs need to attain the skill levels of a Kentaro or Q-Bert, or even a Dave Lee or Kerri Chandler, I'd say you're missing the point really. It's not about that. 

 

I'd also say that your suggestion that "audience expectations have changed in this time, talking and fading from A to B is simply not enough, and as a potential paying punter I would find it simply unacceptable if this was how the evening developed" is largely irrelevant in the context - which is about the tunes themselves, and not the transitions. 

 

I would also imagine that the chances of your being a "paying punter" at any events featured on this site are fairly slim, as your tastes and musical direction seem rather different!

 

Nice Walter Benjamin name-drop, though!

 

Frankly 'Kentaro' and 'Q-Bert' represent the extremes of turntabalism which could be argued to place their skills as a fetish. Would it work on a dance floor? Probably not as most would get bored and leave - and for that very reason I cited Jazzy Jeff as a DJ with supreme technical ability and the willingness to work with a dancefloor. If it is simpy about the tunes, that is about programming, which all DJs really ought to have some idea of (based on chord progression or otherwise).

 

I am quite happy to be a paying punter (or DJ) but I am not willing to pay to attend a pre-1980s style disco. As for Walter Benjamin, I see you missed the Michel Foucault.

 

Rob Alias 

[Dave2]

That will be Kurtis Blow, and Doug. E Fresh & The Get Fresh Crew was @1985.

 

So what is your point? Robbie Vincent was not involved within the evolving world of technical DJing, nor would he ever claim to be a practitioner. Chad Jackson didn't win until 1986 (with a techically poor set that simply failed to acknowledge the influence of 'Transforming'). 

 

So I ask again, what is your point?

 

Rob Alias

I believe these are in the mix of the youtube address clip in your post.   Robbie Vincent first brought the attention of turntable skills to a wider audience . i.e. broadcasting events to the UK Radio 1 audience and the general public - I'd say that was being involved, because unless you were actually @ the world championship mixing events, you wouldn't know the what the best djs at the time were capable of.

 

By the way, I don't have a point, I was just trying to join in....

[Mark S]

Turntableism great new word

 

Hey you have won a prize  a rather clever paper model

 

The day when the skills of the dj become more important than the real musical ability of the artists it will be a sad day for music .

[Sutty]

this 'argument' is irrelevant to the soul scene. The music is not generally made to be beat mixed, its sounds rubbish when someone starts trying to scratch over/with it, and by the same argument I could say anyone playing reggae out is no good because they're not employing either of those methods and mostly use one deck and a mic. Certain methods of presenting music as a DJ work with certain styles of music and not always with others, do what suits at the time and in the environment and stop trying to compare or impose rules, as there is the dichotomy, by attempting to break the rules you are in effect making rules again. A good DJ wil do what is best in the environment to best present the music they are playing, beyond that what else should they be doing?

 

cheers Sutty

Edited April 22, 2014 by Sutty

[TOAD]

Are you on the right forum rob !

[Tlscapital]

We are a selectors scene (far of being the only one BTW) when DJ and I'm very proud to have only one turntable home. So I can switch from one sound to another without having to wonder about what to put on next that can be mix in a transition to follow. It's fun to watch and hear for a while those crazy scratchers and mixers, so is snooker I guess. Only I'm in the music for the music and when I buy a 7" or rarely a 12" I can totally freely buy with saving me all the trouble of wondering if it's mixable or not... I know a lot of people who are sometimes buying/trading with me wondering "can I mix that and with what and how... ?". Sometimes even to hear "it's a shame cos I like it but it's un-mixable". WTF ?! Good Lord I'm sparing myself those bother and fully enjoy the sound coming out of my speakers. And by the way, I totally dissed out of my home those MK 1200-10 some 15 years ago and got me an old Thorens TDS 160 belt drive turntable. And what a sound improvement. I gained much more depth in sound. Those MK 1200 are maybe bare-able on a loud sound system but those direct drive turntable really do flatten the sound spectrum to dullness. Compare if you get the chance to. But those direct drive Start/Stop are just convenient to DJ with. True. Good luck with your evangelization Sir Alias.

[Jordirip]

It's like these guys who can do millions of keepy-ups with a football and do all kinds of juggling circus skills with the ball while they climb a ladder and take their shirt off while still keeping the ball up. Yep, great to watch for a bit, but it doen't make them a good footballer. I'd certainly rather see someone who was passionate about their music, present it in a well thought out way and look like they were enjoying themselves rather than an extreme circus knob twiddling act who prioritised 'skillz' over content.

Edited April 22, 2014 by jordirip

[Raremusicdirect]

Far as I can tell the dancer just wants a smooth transition from record A to B.

 

Mixing, scratching and general high end technical djs that you describe just aren't required in this scene imho.....If you are looking for them I doubt you will find many (with respect).  I do agree skills could be better, mine certainly could be..............

 

Of course there is crowd engagement and some do it better than others, but ultimately its still about the music and the dj as a "personality" comes second.......

 

[Pete S]

You don't need any techincal skills whatsoever to be a "Northern Soul" dj, you just have to learn how to cue in a record.  The skill is putting together the right set, in the right order, for the right audience.  That's it.  You could DJ off an old Dansette, it wouldn't make any difference.

[Tailormade Gaz B]

A nice example of Dj'ing that you can only do in Europe, and I can certainly speak from experience. 
Shows fairly good technical skills and befitting of the era too, I'd say. 

 

 

Bamburg

 

There is also a video somewhere on YouTube from one of the Manchester Soul Weekender sessions where Malayka is DJ'ing with Soul Sam and the beat matching is great; they've even got B-Boys doing breaks in front of them to it. 

I think a little technical ability goes a long way in this 'scene'. I mean Sam and Dave are at the older scale of this movement and they're pioneering what think should have been well established and ubiquitous techniques. Equally, they've got the collections and taste to do it.

I try and do it, and I think it works well,. You can't do it with every record, and it'll never be seamless unless you get a pre-mediated set together, but you can't do that in this scene, you need to be responsive to the floor so I wouldn't advocate every record goes beat-for-beat into the next...

As a parting comment, I've seen and booked some big collectors who are awful DJ's - but the flip side is some people just want to hear the big, rare records.

Edited April 22, 2014 by TailorMade Gaz B

[Pete S]

 

 

There is also a video somewhere on YouTube from one of the Manchester Soul Weekender sessions where Malayka is DJ'ing with Soul Sam and the beat matching is great; they've even got B-Boys doing breaks in front of them to it. 

 

 

But what's that got to do with Northern Soul?

[Tailormade Gaz B]

But what's that got to do with Northern Soul?

What an awful question!

typical SS one liner!

Both DJs who play northern soul...

Playing at an event that is northern soul orientated...

Playing at an event where the vast majority of attendees are northern soul fans and collectors...

 

But playing in such a way that is not atypical of the scene in general. 

And since its a video...you can see it and make a judgement on it.

And it was to add value and a visual reference to the thread, in hope to further the discussion?

 

Edited April 22, 2014 by TailorMade Gaz B

[Len]

 

DJs Needed For DJ Work

 

DJs required for work across the UK Established in 2004. Apply today!

 

Whatever next ? Welders required for welding work ?

 

 

I wish - Try finding a decent welder that's looking for work.......and as for a young decent welder - impossible!

 

........These young welders don't seem to realise they need to start from the bottom completing their apprenticeship, before they're gonna get any of the good jobs

 

All the best,

 

Len  

Edited April 22, 2014 by LEN

[Pete S]

What an awful question!

typical SS one liner!

Both DJs who play northern soul...

Playing at an event that is northern soul orientated...

Playing at an event where the vast majority of attendees are northern soul fans and collectors...

 

But playing in such a way that is not atypical of the scene in general. 

And since its a video...you can see it and make a judgement on it.

And it was to add value and a visual reference to the thread, in hope to further the discussion?

 

 

Sorry but when you talk about B-Boys and beat matching...I ask again, what's that got to do with Northern Soul?

[Tailormade Gaz B]

Sorry but when you talk about B-Boys and beat matching...I ask again, what's that got to do with Northern Soul?

Ok forget the B-Boys, that's secondary. 

The point is you can be technically skilled as a DJ, playing northern soul, blending records without huge gaps and if anything, it adds to the atmosphere.

And they're both very good DJ's for it. 

[Mark R]

It's all largely irrelevant on the Northern scene, but the fact that some can't even cue up to avoid the intro "wind-up" or struggle to keep the levels under control is very relevant anf there's no excuse for that.

There's more to it than just putting a rarer record than the next blome on the turntable.

Out of interest, do you think the sequencing of records is so important on this scene.....especially the oldies/top 500 side of it?? I've never thought so, but I've only ever been on the dance floor, not behind the decks........

Cheers,

Mark R

[Pete S]

Ok forget the B-Boys, that's secondary. 

The point is you can be technically skilled as a DJ, playing northern soul, blending records without huge gaps and if anything, it adds to the atmosphere.

And they're both very good DJ's for it. 

 

I'm sure they are but you can't do that with the typical mid 60's archetypal Northern sound, and why would anyone want to?  70's, 80's, 90's music you can, and it works - wouldn't like to hear it done with 60's records as I like to be told what they are for a start!

[Jordirip]

It's all largely irrelevant on the Northern scene, but the fact that some can't even cue up to avoid the intro "wind-up" or struggle to keep the levels under control is very relevant anf there's no excuse for that.

There's more to it than just putting a rarer record than the next blome on the turntable.

Out of interest, do you think the sequencing of records is so important on this scene.....especially the oldies/top 500 side of it?? I've never thought so, but I've only ever been on the dance floor, not behind the decks........

Cheers,

Mark R

 

I agree with what you say Mark, there's nothing worse than hearing the scrape of needle on slipmat or half an hour wait for the 'cued' record to come in. I think the sequencing and 'light and shade' is important with the selection, knowing which records have similar grooves and feel, to bracket them and create moods within a set. But like you I don't really think it's that important on the Nostalgia 500 side of things.

[Mark R]

The whole things irrevalent when a scene becomes more obsessed with showing the upcoming record on a big screen to prove it's authenticity, rather than letting the dancers suddenly hear a killer intro.

Now that's losing sight of what music was made for........

Cheers,

Mark R

[Pete S]

Ok forget the B-Boys, that's secondary. 

The point is you can be technically skilled as a DJ, playing northern soul, blending records without huge gaps and if anything, it adds to the atmosphere.

And they're both very good DJ's for it. 

 

I love to hear DJ mixing, I even do it myself (cheating, obviously) but as I said, just wouldn't like to hear it done with 60's tracks

[Tailormade Gaz B]

 

I think a little technical ability goes a long way in this 'scene'. I mean Sam and Dave are at the older scale of this movement and they're pioneering what think should have been well established and ubiquitous techniques. Equally, they've got the collections and taste to do it.

 

 

 

I'm sure they are but you can't do that with the typical mid 60's archetypal Northern sound, and why would anyone want to?  70's, 80's, 90's music you can, and it works - wouldn't like to hear it done with 60's records as I like to be told what they are for a start!

'Ok lets leave this with another segment of my first response, and on a bit of a lighter note. 

And as for mid 60's archetypal northern, I think it could be done. Why would you want to...well you wouldn't because I guess you wouldn't like it, but done right it sounds good. It just can't be done every time!

I guess i'm canvasing for the 'occasional' bit of 'effort' not even skill. Catching that last beat of a 60's northern record with the following thud of the next single sounds ok if done right.

Dave T again, does it at Hamburg 2011, and thats on youtube too. 

G. Davis & R. Tyler - Hold On, Help Is On The Way mixed with philly dog around the world. And it keep the place bouncing.

Paul Grant does it too, but with uptempo 60's. 

[Tailormade Gaz B]

I love to hear DJ mixing, I even do it myself (cheating, obviously) but as I said, just wouldn't like to hear it done with 60's tracks

Mixing is a different kettle of fish, I don't think anyone would wants that...let the record more or less finish! I'm just saying, folk just try, if possible to keep the music playing in a seamless fashion...but more or less, letting one record finish and the other start. 

mixing would be awful 

Edited April 22, 2014 by TailorMade Gaz B

[KevH]

 

'Ok lets leave this with another segment of my first response, and on a bit of a lighter note. 

And as for mid 60's archetypal northern, I think it could be done. Why would you want to...well you wouldn't because I guess you wouldn't like it, but done right it sounds good. It just can't be done every time!

I guess i'm canvasing for the 'occasional' bit of 'effort' not even skill. Catching that last beat of a 60's northern record with the following thud of the next single sounds ok if done right.

Dave T again, does it at Hamburg 2011, and thats on youtube too. 

G. Davis & R. Tyler - Hold On, Help Is On The Way mixed with philly dog around the world. And it keep the place bouncing.

Paul Grant does it too, but with uptempo 60's. 

 

 

Isn't the DT clip just spot on cueing.?

[Quinvy]

Don't they cheat anyway by pitching the next tune up or down to get the same BPM, then pitch it back after it's been faded in? 

[Mellorful]

I don't mind when a DJ makes a minor mistake, it makes them human and causes me smile followed by the word oops.

This is a hobby so we don't need to be too analytical or anal on the subject.

KTF

[Ernie Andrews]

Ok forget the B-Boys, that's secondary. 

The point is you can be technically skilled as a DJ, playing northern soul, blending records without huge gaps and if anything, it adds to the atmosphere.

And they're both very good DJ's for it. 

Utter B*llocks! Ian Levine to me was the best DJ in the world when I was young and he only used one deck- The way he introduced a record  got the hairs on your neck standing up with sheer anticipation of what was about to blast out of the speakers - ASk anyone who went to the Mecca and hear Otis Blackwell s - Its all over me for the first time. Its got nothin to do with any technicalities of mixing beats etc. OH and guess what he used only one deck because the other was broken.

P.S heres a record that would destroy any technicality of Djing in an instant! M - Pop Musik original first press  twelve inch. especially if you had no time to cue!

Edited February 7, 2015 by pikeys dog
swearing - workplace filters

[Len]

I think the timing between records is very important, and when to talk / not to talk (just enough) or a set can come across as stilted. A few times at my own events, I've rushed up to the decks because I thought they had broken down.......That'll teach me not to give mates spots (It was the pressure they put me under I tell you!)

 

All the best,

 

Len  

Edited April 22, 2014 by LEN

[Mark S]

Typical Martyn Ellis cock up   Propper DJ,n

[Len]

Utter B*llocks! Ian Levine to me was the best DJ in the world when I was young and he only used one deck- The way he introduced a record  got the hairs on your neck standing up with sheer anticipation of what was about to blast out of the speakers - ASk anyone who went to the Mecca and hear Otis Blackwell s - Its all over me for the first time. Its got nothin to do with any technicalities of mixing beats etc. OH and guess what he used only one deck because the other was broken.

P.S heres a record that would destroy any technicality of Djing in an instant! M - Pop Musik original first press  twelve inch. especially if you had no time to cue!

 

Coincidently, last night I had a long conversation about D.J's that me and my mate thought great - They all had one thing in common, and that is they were 'quirky'. The records don't D.J, they do, they have a skill and an attraction that stands them apart from the rest (Infectious is the word I think)

 

All the best,

 

Len  

Edited February 7, 2015 by pikeys dog
swearing - workplace filters

[Mark R]

Don't they cheat anyway by pitching the next tune up or down to get the same BPM, then pitch it back after it's been faded in?

LOL......hardly cheating.......just standard practice! !

Cheers,

Mark R

[Labeat]

I just wish BUB was still around, tune out of box, quick rub on his pullover, a quick witted joke then stick it on.... Who needs technical input?

[Philt]

www.youtube.com/watch?v=2yxnhoLQ_hk

 

From 1986 DJ Cheese performing his Disco Mix Club (DMC) Championship routine. This is clearly evidence of how the technical aspects of DJing had changed, and I think helps to put some of the discussions regarding DJing here in to some perspective.

 

Rob Alias

 

Rob

 

Do you subscribe to the Sociological Association's quarterly ... 'Contexts'? I hear ya mate but think they're quite important here, aren't they?

 

Incidentally, their claim to be "the public face of sociology" is a bold one indeed. Nonetheless, I've rushed off a cheque already. Here's hoping it delivers on its promise of a literary roller-coaster ride through that quasi-academic quagmire so  joyously and repeatedly travelled by music 'journos', and 'serious' folk with a tad too much time on their hands, since the year dot.  

 

I'm not entirely sure what the Foucauldian 'take' on it would be but, Michel ...  ... someone puts old records - OVO, naturally - on some decks and some - mostly old and knackered - people might dance to some of em if you're really, really lucky. 

 

It's all good mate, but quantum physics it ain't.

 

Atb

Phil

[Markw]

You see this puts much of the discussion regarding what constitutes 'Djing' in to a very useful context. At least after Froggy's experiences with Larry Levan and the slow introduction of the Technics 1200 (and later 1210), the techical apsects of DJing changed in some musical forms, indeed in Hip Hop and Electro Funk this particular skill constituted a particular aspect of credibility. The days of just fading from one record to another and talking were over. This kind of DJing had been predominat prior to the early 1980s but it is clear that it was soon not enough and that technical ability mattered.

 

Within this context, the concentration of original vinyl only (ovo) could be sustained only in so far as the technical horizon was delimited by practical accessibility. This was a development which was positive and negative, and would ultimately result in the 'goatee scratching self interested musical navel gazing' that can sometimes be seen in certain quarters. However, if DJing is about engaging with a crowd and developing a musical dynamic then DJs such as Jazzy Jeff et al remain pre-eminent. Yet despite such developments over the last 30 odd years some of you here appear to want to concentrate on the issue of whether the vinyl being played is original or not. This is nonsensical and ignores the fact that audience expectations have changed in this time, talking and fading from A to B is simply not enough, and as a potential paying punter I would find it simply unacceptable if this was how the evening developed. I expect, if not demand, musical knowledege, musical empathy and technical skills, not pre-1980 self-mythologising attempts at authenticity (whatever that actually means). As a DJ I expect more than a simple A-B mixer, without a decent cross fade etc. 

 

In my very humble view there are some apparent 'big name' DJs out there whose understanding of DJing as a technical skill remains rooted in the past, despite many of the innovations that have taken place over the subsequent years. Their reputations are based on the past, within a modern contextual narrative (all things being equal) they would not survive more than five minutes. The only reason for their apparent predominance is 'age' and 'who you / they know'.No wonder that for some the re-edit scene provided a lifeline that empowered them to appear to remain relevant and knowledgeable about current developements. The fact is they have no technical ability of their own and have to seek continuing legitimation through the work of others.

 

Looking at the bigger picture is it any reason that some sections of 'the scene' (not limited to 'Northern') are on their knees? Poor presentation against modern expectations are particularly relevant in passing the musical flame on, unless you want to criticize modern DJs for not using original vinyl or worshipping at the feet of Wigan etc. This is a spectatcular case of musical onanism.

 

And this is without considering the wider contextual narratives of class and race, especially in respect of 'Northern Soul', predicated on a black musical art form.

 

It reaally makes for a depressing situation, and some of you are responsible for this with your posturing regarding an imagined authenticity.

 

Rob Alias 

WTF are you on about???

Edited April 22, 2014 by markw

[Mal C]

Laughs... I wondered too Mark, this whole thread has left the earth, and now its residing in outer space!!!!

 

I haven't read every post, I know I should, but do you know what, does it really matter?  the whole idea is you pay some bloke (said megalomaniac D.j) to take care of all that so you can practice your Benny Hill impressions at the bar!

 

M