Sag War Fare & Wanda Mcdaniels

[The Milk Man]

Looking for:

Sag War Fare on Libra

Wanda McDaniels on Appleray

All conditions considered, excellent trades or cash waiting.

Thanks

Edited November 5, 2013 by The Milk Man

[Liljimmycrank]

'If you don't ask......' and all that!

[The Milk Man]

Exactly mate! No harm in asking as they'll eventually come along one way or another..

[Paul-s]

Looking for:

Sag War Fare on Libra

Wanda McDaniels on Appleray

All conditions considered, excellent trades or cash waiting.

Thanks

 

 

For Sag War   Pester  Marco,  doubt he will part but worth a try if the offers right and all that!  

[Corbett80]

'If you don't ask......' and all that!

If anyone is gonna snag 'em it'll be this man!

[The Milk Man]

Tried Marco, didn't seem like it was going to happen but like you said, you never know! Also onto the Florida connection so hopefully that will come up with something.

 

Still holding out for that copy on here to make an appearance!

[Paulb]

Wonder how much sag warefare would go for now? Well over 1k I'd have thought.

[Glynthornhill]

Would have thought more than that . It 's value has actually increased following the Chicago Numero 's reissue on Libra as part of the Eccentric Soul Set .

The tracks have been brought to a wider audience , and hence it's popularity has rocketed. Funny that this is one example of many records around twenty years back that zilch collector' s wanted. And no the surviving group members don't have any copies for sale. Some of them still working the Florida circuit.

[Steve G]

It was never around in quantity tho. I originally bought it for the other side back in the 90s 

Edited November 8, 2013 by Steve G

[Guest just mo]

for wanda try dave raistrick, think he's maybe turned another copy up  

[The Milk Man]

To spice things up, I have a Doc Peabody here waiting to be traded

[Jordirip]

Wonder how much sag warefare would go for now? Well over 1k I'd have thought.

 

I would think about 2K+ each. I'm sure I heard the last Wanda was near 3K inc. trades.

[NEV]

I would think about 2K+ each. I'm sure I heard the last Wanda was near 3K inc. trades.

Hi mate ,would'nt disagree with those prices ,but sadly for me ..the magic of both tunes was when they were not so in vogue or well known ,but obscure and almost marmite records .

When the likes of you and Dave and Butch and a few others had copies and nobody was making a fuss about em .

In fact ,although they are now very sought after ,they are not really dancers are they ?

Last time I heard both was when brother Dave played both copies and only me & Mo were on the floor

They will always remain two of my favourite wow factor 45's but sadly now priced outta the water and too expensive for limited appeal records IMHO

P.s

Like the Murphy ,I'm not bitter

[Jordirip]

Hi mate ,would'nt disagree with those prices ,but sadly for me ..the magic of both tunes was when they were not so in vogue or well known ,but obscure and almost marmite records .

When the likes of you and Dave and Butch and a few others had copies and nobody was making a fuss about em .

In fact ,although they are now very sought after ,they are not really dancers are they ?

Last time I heard both was when brother Dave played both copies and only me & Mo were on the floor

They will always remain two of my favourite wow factor 45's but sadly now priced outta the water and too expensive for limited appeal records IMHO

P.s

Like the Murphy ,I'm not bitter

 

Hi Nev, As I don't go out or DJ much any more I don't really know what's in or out of vogue, however they are both tunes that I personally love to dance to if I do hear them. They both go down (or did) a storm in Euro gigs and at the ones I went to I would say they were very well recieved on the dancefloor. I agree that they probably are a bit trickier to dance to if you want to slide around in a northern style.

[The Milk Man]

Nev, come down south and/or go to Europe and hear them out, there won't be much room left to dance

[NEV]

Hi Nev, As I don't go out or DJ much any more I don't really know what's in or out of vogue, however they are both tunes that I personally love to dance to if I do hear them. They both go down (or did) a storm in Euro gigs and at the ones I went to I would say they were very well recieved on the dancefloor. I agree that they probably are a bit trickier to dance to if you want to slide around in a northern style.

Hi Jordi ,in vogue or well known ..as in under the radar.

Don't doubt for a moment the Euro crowd filling the floor ,but the majority of copies of both are here in UK,so my experiences are just taken from that .

Poggo ...not all of us are members of the jet set like you ;)

[Ted Massey]

Heard both at life line and well received on the floor I even danced to Sag ware when Butch played it lol

[Steve G]

Heard both at life line and well received on the floor I even danced to Sag ware when Butch played it lol

 

Hi Ted, I've noticed that with loads of records that have been around years, they are STILL popular on the floor. Elipsis, Joseph Webster are other examples of records that perpetually fill the dance floor….slower records too have always had their place….Ironically I can still remember when Searling cleared the floor at the Casino with Judy Freeman one night..,..

Edited November 9, 2013 by Steve G

[The Milk Man]

EasyJet setter Nev, you can't beat it!

[Paulb]

Nev, I think don't be so jive is a great dancer. Went down a storm at hamburg on the sat night.

Always thought this record epitomised rare soul. The recent re issue has killed it slightly, but no doubt this will always remain a special record.

[NEV]

Heard both at life line and well received on the floor I even danced to Sag ware when Butch played it lol

Ok ,if Ted Massey is dancing to " don't be so jive " .. i have to concede and agree ,it is a great dancer

 

  But then again ,i dance to it every time i hear it and i must be going to the right places to be hearing it ,but the two times ive heard it played ,sadly i was pretty much on my own ,both times by different dj's too and both top dj's in my estimation .

 

 The truth is ,i missed out to Dave for the first copy i went for and it was a good price ,but now both records have gone massive and so has the price ,so it's a case of unless i find either myself , i wont be buying em in todays market

 

  The flip of Sag War Fare is my fave of the three songs in question ,so the next question to the more upfront venue goers out there ,how does that go down on the floor then

[NEV]

Nev, I think don't be so jive is a great dancer. Went down a storm at hamburg on the sat night.

Always thought this record epitomised rare soul. The recent re issue has killed it slightly, but no doubt this will always remain a special record.

 Hi Paul ... interesting you say the re-issue has killed it slightly

 

 Butch , Sam ,Marco ,Dave Ripolles  and Marc Forrest all with copies and playing the European circuit .. a few people have privately said to me that for the same reason ,John Harris is now dead ,so i wonder if the same applies to Sag war fare ?

 

 I also contacted a guy on ebay about a yr or so back ,who listed a copy of Gangster boy ,that got pulled before i got a chance

 He told me that he was made a very big offer ,but not to worry because it will soon be getting re-issued and i'll be able to grab one for myself without paying mega bucks !

 

 He refused to say who got it ,but as it was a good bit back .. so who knows ...could he have been duped or is there a thread of truth in that

[Paulb]

Re issues absolutely spoil rare records. Why anyone would make do with a £6 lookalike copy is beyond me.

[Steve G]

 Hi Paul ... interesting you say the re-issue has killed it slightly

 

 Butch , Sam ,Marco ,Dave Ripolles  and Marc Forrest all with copies and playing the European circuit .. a few people have privately said to me that for the same reason ,John Harris is now dead ,so i wonder if the same applies to Sag war fare ?

 

 

 

 

Ok ,if Ted Massey is dancing to " don't be so jive " .. i have to concede and agree ,it is a great dancer

 

  But then again ,i dance to it every time i hear it and i must be going to the right places to be hearing it ,but the two times ive heard it played ,sadly i was pretty much on my own ,both times by different dj's too and both top dj's in my estimation .

 

 The truth is ,i missed out to Dave for the first copy i went for and it was a good price ,but now both records have gone massive and so has the price ,so it's a case of unless i find either myself , i wont be buying em in todays market

 

  The flip of Sag War Fare is my fave of the three songs in question ,so the next question to the more upfront venue goers out there ,how does that go down on the floor then

 

Let's put a few of these comments to bed for once and for all eh Nev?

 

-The first copies surfaced as far as I can tell in the mid 90s, Butch and myself had it back then I am sure, I got it from Soul Bowl for £300 at a Victoria Record fair whenever they were - about 95/96 I think. 

 

-"Don't be so jive" does well on the dance floors whenever I've played it, works every time and was popular at places like Letchworth here some years ago now. Still get requests for it now and it's certainly great enough to play still. The shine hasn't gone off it.

 

The flip side of Sag War Fare was played first at crossover venues in the 90s, but sad to say it wasn't as popular as it should have been. It doesn't really work with the dance floor, I am sorry to say.

 

Marco and Butch were the first to play "Don't be so jive" so credit to them.

 

Right, feel better now for putting that right.

 

Edited November 9, 2013 by Steve G

[The Milk Man]

Surely to response to the question of any records integrity after beig reissued is through observing the reaction of a crowd (or individual) when it gets played.

 

Its also your choice as a punter as to which events/DJs you go to see and also if it bothers you if others are vibing.

Edited November 9, 2013 by The Milk Man

[NEV]

Let's put a few of these comments to bed for once and for all eh Nev?

 

-The first copies surfaced as far as I can tell in the mid 90s, Butch and myself had it back then I am sure, I got it from Soul Bowl for £300 at a Victoria Record fair whenever they were - about 95/96 I think. 

 

-"Don't be so jive" does well on the dance floors whenever I've played it, works every time and was popular at places like Letchworth here some years ago now.

 

The flip side of Sag War Fare was played first at crossover venues in the 90s, but sad to say it wasn't as popular as it should have been. It doesn't really work with the dance floor, I am sorry to say.

 

Marco and Butch were the first to play "Don't be so jive" so credit to them.

 

Right, feel better now for putting that right.

 

Thanks Steve ... what time do you want waking up in the morning

 

  So what about the copy Richard sold to Sam ,when did he get that and did he ever play it ,if not it does'nt count eh

  I am of course running the risk of another tongue lashing for not doing my own research ,but im sitting comfy and would rather let you do the leg work

[Ted Massey]

Ok ,if Ted Massey is dancing to " don't be so jive " .. i have to concede and agree ,it is a great dancer

 

  But then again ,i dance to it every time i hear it and i must be going to the right places to be hearing it ,but the two times ive heard it played ,sadly i was pretty much on my own ,both times by different dj's too and both top dj's in my estimation .

 

 The truth is ,i missed out to Dave for the first copy i went for and it was a good price ,but now both records have gone massive and so has the price ,so it's a case of unless i find either myself , i wont be buying em in todays market

 

  The flip of Sag War Fare is my fave of the three songs in question ,so the next question to the more upfront venue goers out there ,how does that go down on the floor then

Don't feel to bad Nev cause you wouldn't have them now if you had bought them at the time   sorry mate couldn't resist

[Steve G]

Thanks Steve ... what time do you want waking up in the morning

 

  So what about the copy Richard sold to Sam ,when did he get that and did he ever play it ,if not it does'nt count eh

  I am of course running the risk of another tongue lashing for not doing my own research ,but im sitting comfy and would rather let you do the leg work

 

Sam from Richard? - goodness Nev, that was much later, Sam was one of the last to get this……about 2 years ago. I remember Sam trying to get together Richard's shopping list of "original oldies" for the trade - Judy Street type big NW oldies….Tell you when it was, it was a few weeks before Northern Soul filming was done at King Georges Hall, because it was being talked about that day at Blackburn. But good point about Richard he would have got it from Soul Bowl as well, and may well have had it before anyone else!  I don't know whether he ever played it, or if he did which side. Certainly don't remember him playing it, but he might have done at Parkers or somewhere.

Edited November 9, 2013 by Steve G

[NEV]

Surely to response to the question of any records integrity after beig reissued is through observing the reaction of a crowd (or individual) when it gets played.

Its also your choice as a punter as to which events/DJs you go to see and also if it bothers you if others are vibing

 I agree James ... the re-issuing of records usually occurs because the record is indemand and creating a buzz and that demand can't be met by original copies .

I  think the death of any record is caused by over kill ... probably more so at longer venues ,allnighters /weekenders ..

 

  But that really should'nt be happening on the rare scene should it ?

 

  Mick H played Hopkins bros at RAFA club last week and i think thats only the second time it's been played in the North east ,let alone the RAFA club ,so in my opinion ,it's still a fantastic record despite being re-issued .. fact is ..if you only attend venues that support original vinyl ,it does'nt matter if it's available on a copy for £10

 

 Another thing i've observed over the yrs is ,rare soul records that appeal to those of us who like them ,somehow don't have the same desired effect on the more mainstream punter

 ,infact a lot of the things i like or own that  are'nt even expensive and are not hard to find ,don't appeal to my friends on the mainstream circuit

[The Milk Man]

Update: anyone who has read this thread and instantly got bored of their copy, please get in touch

[NEV]

Sam from Richard? - goodness Nev, that was much later, Sam was one of the last to get this……about 2 years ago. I remember Sam trying to get together Richard's shopping list of "original oldies" for the trade - Judy Street type big NW oldies….Tell you when it was, it was a few weeks before Northern Soul filming was done at King Georges Hall, because it was being talked about that day. But good point about Richard he would have got it from Soul Bowl as well, and may well have had it before anyone else!  I don't know whether he ever played it, or if he did which side. Certainly don't remember him playing it, but he might have done at Parkers or somewhere.

I'm not asking about Sam playing it and am fully aware it's pretty new in his box ,im  asking ,how long ago did Richard pick it up and did he ever bother to play it out ?

 

Ted , you've been around since the war and there's plenty of things you could have had for less ,

  but  being able to buy something that nobody else has played ,yet you believe in your heart is a winner ,now that's the secret of a top dj eh

[The Milk Man]

I agree with you Nev, although I cannot confess to going to nights up north as I'm stuck in this overpriced capital city which makes these questioned records seem cheaper than a bus ride from one end of London to the other!

 

I don't understand it when people re-issue tunes which are f*cking amazing and just got the air of light, it all seems like their getting involved to make a quick penny. Then in their defense all they can say is 'who are you to keep this music for yourself' when that isn't the intended point & is the exact reason WHY they re-issued it! There's plenty of artists who have created amazing music so if they also focused on the ones that weren't currently in 'vogue' as much as the ones that are then that would be a more noble statement and that's why I really respect Numero as a label. Also, the Sag War Fare issue being part of that box set is a fantastic and interesting way to bring these tunes to light and get a greater following. I spent the afternoon with my girlfriend in a local pub spinning tunes, her from the her Numero box set and mine from original. No one cared what was played as they didn't have a clue but to be honest I was more interested in what she had in her box of tunes that I weren't so familiar with.

 

Looking forward to the day that people get bored of their great tunes from all the bootlegging going on, I'll happily purchase them from you

Edited November 9, 2013 by The Milk Man

[Mal C]

I remember seeing a scan the label in the 9ts, but I didn't know the tune, that said you could have got Flowers - For Real from John Doe for £2 back then, I kid ye not....so in the same fashion, I just bought Lady L — Loves Master Plan, for £8 of Jason on here... happy days...

 

As for who spins it, and when, seriously who cares?

 

Malcolm

[Glynthornhill]

While on ' fact ' subjects .

Richard did not purchase this from Soul Bowl from what I remember .

 

He played it out @ Dunk All Dayer last year he said ' first time played out ' so never saw an airing @ Parkers from what I remember Steve.

 

Sold  / traded to Soul Sam last year .

 

Yes , he's owned it since the 1990 's but purchased from another dealer not J A me thinks.

[Glynthornhill]

I remember seeing a scan the label in the 9ts, but I didn't know the tune, that said you could have got Flowers - For Real from John Doe for £2 back then, I kid ye not....so in the same fashion, I just bought Lady L — Loves Master Plan, for £8 of Jason on here... happy days...

 

As for who spins it, and when, seriously who cares?

 

Malcolm

Yep as I have said one dealer had a 200 count of Flowers , and was a front page focus on certain dealer lists £8 or so  

[Glynthornhill]

Re issues absolutely spoil rare records. Why anyone would make do with a £6 lookalike copy is beyond me.

Prob cos we are not all cheque book Charlie's - some punters just want vinyl not bothered whether it' s an original copy.

I also prefer og s - however we all have limits to our spending.

The secret is to hoover these up when none else is searching for them .

Not easy but that' s the way to build a collection of quality - believe in records not the prices and hyped cheque book collectors scurrying round over inflated ego 45' s.

As S G will agree no fuck** wanted Sag War Fare ten years back - fact ,,, It s weird how certain spins cause a vinyl 45 to inflate madly in price. Sag War fare has always been more hotly collected in USA than UK , but the price now is astronomical - They are copies out there , there is for all records - no one can know read the Eccentric book with regard to Sag War Fare as to how many were pressed . 

[NEV]

While on ' fact ' subjects .

Richard did not purchase this from Soul Bowl from what I remember .

 

He played it out @ Dunk All Dayer last year he said ' first time played out ' so never saw an airing @ Parkers from what I remember Steve.

 

Sold  / traded to Soul Sam last year .

 

Yes , he's owned it since the 1990 's but purchased from another dealer not J A me thinks.

   I was kinda hoping you'd tell me he had it in the 70's and once played it at Wigan ..but thinking about it ,that's the kinda thing Sam would have done and not Richard eh

  So 90's it is then and Steve G .. that taste in exquisite soul music has served you well

[Glynthornhill]

No chance would that have ever got a Wigan spin Nev 

[Steve G]

The other thing is tastes have continued to evolve….in the 90s no one would have gone for "Don't be so jive"…..it wouldn't have been right for the scene then. It's the move towards the funkier edge and the european influence over the last ten or so years that has brought that style of 45 into vogue. 

[Arthur Fenn]

Sam tells me that Richard got his off Tim Ash for 20quid in the early 90's, Sam got the trade by giving searling some dodgy northern 8-)

[Marc Forrest]

sag war fare...all I can add to all the informatons and opinions on this fabulous 45 is that the day I received my copy was a day of celebration for me. for the next coming ten days I started every single one of them b playing both sides at least twice.. i had and up to today have my hairs stand up when I hear it!

It simply is one of the very best soul records ever made.

I initially bought it for the flipside and personally thinl its a unrivaaled masterpiece.

And yes, the first time I playd in Germany (Hamburg in this case) I had one person dancing to it on the floor.

A few years later and it still packs the floor like last night at the Hip City Soul Club.

[Diamondjim]

sag war fare...all I can add to all the informatons and opinions on this fabulous 45 is that the day I received my copy was a day of celebration for me. for the next coming ten days I started every single one of them b playing both sides at least twice.. i had and up to today have my hairs stand up when I hear it!

It simply is one of the very best soul records ever made.

I initially bought it for the flipside and personally thinl its a unrivaaled masterpiece.

And yes, the first time I playd in Germany (Hamburg in this case) I had one person dancing to it on the floor.

A few years later and it still packs the floor like last night at the Hip City Soul Club.

 

First time it got played in Berlin was 2001 Marc at Olivers night & I played both sides only person other than Smithy that asked about it was a German fella called Martin.

Same year it also bombed at Wilton niter and only person that asked about it there was top record enthusiast Dave Guiry 

[Bridgesoceity]

 

Ok ,if Ted Massey is dancing to " don't be so jive " .. i have to concede and agree ,it is a great dancer

 

  But then again ,i dance to it every time i hear it and i must be going to the right places to be hearing it ,but the two times ive heard it played ,sadly i was pretty much on my own ,both times by different dj's too and both top dj's in my estimation .

 

 The truth is ,i missed out to Dave for the first copy i went for and it was a good price ,but now both records have gone massive and so has the price ,so it's a case of unless i find either myself , i wont be buying em in todays market

 

  The flip of Sag War Fare is my fave of the three songs in question ,so the next question to the more upfront venue goers out there ,how does that go down on the floor then

 

[Bridgesoceity]

Sam played the flip to Sag Warfare at masters of soul and from what i could see was probably the most popular record of the night

[Marc Forrest]

First time it got played in Berlin was 2001 Marc at Olivers night & I played both sides only person other than Smithy that asked about it was a German fella called Martin.Same year it also bombed at Wilton niter and only person that asked about it there was top record enthusiast Dave Guiry

whos there "diamond jim", is it craig ? you mean the friday allnighter at cox orange as part of that weekender with the hip city on the nect night ? that was a great weekend... Is it alteady 12 years ago though :o ?!? anyway, whoever played it there was to my knowledge indeed the first person to have played it out here. I missed it, may have been in the other room who knows. Martin is a great character and enthusiastic about his music, was with us last night at the Hip City as well. atb

[Marc Forrest]

Oops, just seen the signature, hi David ;)!

[Bridgesoceity]

Who gets the royalties from the Sag Warfare re issue??

[Marc Forrest]

Who gets the royalties from the Sag Warfare re issue??

 

I seem to remember having been told that they licensed all 45 records via the writers or band members.

[KevH]

Who gets the royalties from the Sag Warfare re issue??

 

According to YOUTUBE,one of the guys from Sag Warfare is still around.Maybe he would know.?

[Paulb]

Russell Paine contacted one of the guys from the band and got promised a small handufull for x amount of readies. Needless to say he never saw a single copy and didn't get his cash back. So prob best not to go down that route.