Are "hand Baggers" Taking Over This Scene?

[Daz Watson]

This is the first time Ive posted on here. But after an experience last night I felt compelled to write. For the past 3 years I've lived in the US  and so have not been to any UK venues for a while. Last week I  was in the UK for a couple of days and decided to drop in on the "Solid Gold Soul" night at Mansfield Civic Centre last night.  Wow! I was horrified. It was full and I mean FULL of handbaggers, mediocre music, drinks on the dance floor - the lot. Is that what the Northern scene has come to in the UK? 

 

Ive been reading on here about the recent Butlins weekender with attendance of over 7,000. At first I was impressed however, after last night, I have to ask - how many of those 7,000 were true soulies and how many were these clowns who have no clue about the music, the dancing or the heritage and are only there for the social side and to get tanked up!

 

Sorry if anyone feels  offended  but what I witnessed last night was a travesty masquerading as a Northern Soul night. It was like a huge wedding reception where all the adults are pissed trying to dance to Freda Payne ( and ... yes - they did play that as well !).

 

If thats what over commercialisation has done for this scene then God help us!

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest Bearsy]

Pick your venues wisely ....

[Barry]

...all about the...

 

[Steve S 60]

There's a similar thread in Freebasing, eloquently entitled " Eff Off Handbaggers".

[Goldsoul]

I think Phil Kingswood and Chris Collins the promoters have never made secret of the fact that it's a 'handbag do'.

A town like Mansfield has proved time and time again that it supports no other. Sadly.

[Guest Polyvelts]

...all about the...

 

All about the Lincoln's ????

[Len]

Although I don’t like the term ‘Handbaggers’ because I find it offensive to those that respectfully come into our Scene, I know what you mean.

As has been said, choose your venues wisely - You now have to do a bit of research (That is what has changed) There are still some great venues about with the true ‘spirit’

 

Welcome home by the way!  

 

All the best,

 

Len  

[Guest Polyvelts]

Hi Daz, as bearsy says 'pick your events wisely' ! So true.

Went to Solid hit soul last night in the heart of the city of London, near Liverpool st station. You can imagine how messy it was out on the streets as I made my way down there, people been boozin since 5pm, but in a basement below a pub was an oasis of true soul !

Even though it's a 6ts only policy (i personally prefer more of a mix up of eras) the music played is underplayed and interesting and at the same time you sometimes hear a massive oldie you havnt heard for ages that sounds just great after so many years unheard, 'at the top of the stairs' last night springs to mind. A mixture of all ages but people really into the music - and only a handful of bemused city boys that thankfully didn't stick around too long.

[Dave Callard]

You were in the wrong place at the wrong time as the saying goes.

Seeing as it was local to me ( Nottinghamshire ) if you are around tonight try the Grosvenor Rooms at Sutton In Ashfield that will restore your faith in true northern soul.

[Sooty]

...all about the...

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hrZERzykyYs

 

...bye bye....!.................hehe!x

@@

~

LUV

SOOTY

X

 

Mansfield had a 'hard core' contingency and functions back in the 90's and has always had a healthy handbag gathering I recall!x Same can be said for most towns and City's...and as said...horses for courses!x I went in to see Syreeta in a concert in the early 90's...first half she waffled on about some geeza she was married too and then at half time she was flogging her signatures for £3 each....and giving you change herself....I walked out happy missing the second half.....go home if it ain;t what u want...!!!!x

 

...but if it was all about this....it'd be superrr i'd say!!!x $2 dollars over Barry...keep the change...hehe....!!x

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DhvhfzbYCFk

[manus]

I'm actually quite pleased to see outsiders at an event these days as long as they don't cause trouble - maybe it's because I'm a wee bit bored with the orthodoxy of the scene at the moment - it's all getting a little too conformist for me. I went to a niter last weekend that had a jazz funk room and some of the folk came up stairs and danced and it was like a breath of fresh air - people not conforming to the dance rules and just interpreting the music in their own unpremeditated way. It was quite funny because one of the women must have heard about the current obsession with handbaggers as she placed her bag on the floor and started dancing and then laughed and picked it up and I thought the joke was in good spirits - and she could dance that's for sure ( and most likely without going to one of these silly dance classes which is far more insulting to the true spirt of the scene in my opinion).

I went to an alldayer the following day and again it felt how it should be people just enjoying things - the dancefloor was flooded and had a beware sign on it about slipping but people just danced around it without getting prima donnaish - one of the local heroin addicts came in off the street as it was a free event and spent the afternoon dancing away in his own style and was greeted with smiles and good humour.

[Premium Stuff]

Notts has a wide varity of nights available, get to the Black Bull nights for rare and underplayed, ATB at Underwood for great across the board stuff, Grosvenor for pure northern oldies etc etc some great nights. They may not be packed to the rafters but those there will all be soulies. 

 

Where is the Black Bull please?

 

Cheers

 

Richard

[Len]

I'm actually quite pleased to see outsiders at an event these days as long as they don't cause trouble - maybe it's because I'm a wee bit bored with the orthodoxy of the scene at the moment - it's all getting a little too conformist for me. I went to a niter last weekend that had a jazz funk room and some of the folk came up stairs and danced and it was like a breath of fresh air - people not conforming to the dance rules and just interpreting the music in their own unpremeditated way. It was quite funny because one of the women must have heard about the current obsession with handbaggers as she placed her bag on the floor and started dancing and then laughed and picked it up and I thought the joke was in good spirits - and she could dance that's for sure ( and most likely without going to one of these silly dance classes which is far more insulting to the true spirt of the scene in my opinion).

I went to an alldayer the following day and again it felt how it should be people just enjoying things - the dancefloor was flooded and had a beware sign on it about slipping but people just danced around it without getting prima donnaish - one of the local heroin addicts came in off the street as it was a free event and spent the afternoon dancing away in his own style and was greeted with smiles and good humour.

 

Great stuff, and 'can' be beneficial to an event.

 

"I'm actually quite pleased to see outsiders at an event these days as long as they don't cause trouble"

 

I got presented with my very own 'Tailor made' Hand Bag the other evening, and felt obliged to dance around it (Thanks Nick 'Topsy' Turvey of Banbury Radio!)....I plan on bringing it the next 'Len's Den', where it will have pride of place  

 

Obviously some folk at the event that the thread starters is referring to, didn't have a clue about how to behave - that is when it gets irritating and frustrating.

 

All the best,

 

Len  

Edited October 19, 2013 by LEN

[Steve L]

This is the first time Ive posted on here. But after an experience last night I felt compelled to write. For the past 3 years I've lived in the US  and so have not been to any UK venues for a while. Last week I  was in the UK for a couple of days and decided to drop in on the "Solid Gold Soul" night at Mansfield Civic Centre last night.  Wow! I was horrified. It was full and I mean FULL of handbaggers, mediocre music, drinks on the dance floor - the lot. Is that what the Northern scene has come to in the UK? 

 

Ive been reading on here about the recent Butlins weekender with attendance of over 7,000. At first I was impressed however, after last night, I have to ask - how many of those 7,000 were true soulies and how many were these clowns who have no clue about the music, the dancing or the heritage and are only there for the social side and to get tanked up!

 

Sorry if anyone feels  offended  but what I witnessed last night was a travesty masquerading as a Northern Soul night. It was like a huge wedding reception where all the adults are pissed trying to dance to Freda Payne ( and ... yes - they did play that as well !).

 

If thats what over commercialisation has done for this scene then God help us!

 

To be fair Daz the civic isn't a northern night but a commercial soul/ night out for the over 50s.

However in general the answer to your question is yes

[Steve L]

Where is the Black Bull please?

 

Cheers

 

Richard

 Mansfield Woodhouse, formerly the home of the Attic - now a load of black bull run by Mark Hopes & Cressy

[Daz Watson]

Thanks guys. Im actually Stateside permanent ( heading back now in fact ) and I only manage to get back 3 or 4 times per year. 

 

Dave - Yep, the Grosvenor Rooms is really my local venue if I were in UK. Sadly it's gonna be a few months Im afraid. 

 

All the best to Carl and the rest of the crew. 

[Ljblanken]

Thanks guys. Im actually Stateside permanent ( heading back now in fact ) and I only manage to get back 3 or 4 times per year. 

 

Dave - Yep, the Grosvenor Rooms is really my local venue if I were in UK. Sadly it's gonna be a few months Im afraid. 

 

All the best to Carl and the rest of the crew. 

 

Just curious... Are you west coast in the US? Always seeing who is out and about for soul stuff on the California mid to northern-coast...

[Guest Jerri]

I went to the Kings Hall Stoke all nighter and felt the same about the music!, people dancing around the same old records!

[Goldsoul]

I went to the Kings Hall Stoke all nighter and felt the same about the music!, people dancing around the same old records!

[Goldsoul]

Over to Andy Dyson, Keith Money, Cliff Steele and Mick H to respond perhaps!

[Grayman45]

I'm actually quite pleased to see outsiders at an event these days as long as they don't cause trouble - maybe it's because I'm a wee bit bored with the orthodoxy of the scene at the moment - it's all getting a little too conformist for me. I went to a niter last weekend that had a jazz funk room and some of the folk came up stairs and danced and it was like a breath of fresh air - people not conforming to the dance rules and just interpreting the music in their own unpremeditated way. It was quite funny because one of the women must have heard about the current obsession with handbaggers as she placed her bag on the floor and started dancing and then laughed and picked it up and I thought the joke was in good spirits - and she could dance that's for sure ( and most likely without going to one of these silly dance classes which is far more insulting to the true spirt of the scene in my opinion).

I went to an alldayer the following day and again it felt how it should be people just enjoying things - the dancefloor was flooded and had a beware sign on it about slipping but people just danced around it without getting prima donnaish - one of the local heroin addicts came in off the street as it was a free event and spent the afternoon dancing away in his own style and was greeted with smiles and good humour.

 

Where was the venue with the jazz funk room? I'm just curious.

[Tezza]

Notts has a wide varity of nights available, get to the Black Bull nights for rare and underplayed, ATB at Underwood for great across the board stuff, Grosvenor for pure northern oldies etc etc some great nights. They may not be packed to the rafters but those there will all be soulies. 

The Black Bull is the place to go to hear something a little away from the norm. Not Earls Court but quality stuff !!

[Premium Stuff]

The Black Bull is the place to go to hear something a little away from the norm. Not Earls Court but quality stuff !!

 

When is the next one please?

 

Cheers

 

Richard

[Guest]

When is the next one please?

 

Cheers

 

Richard

The next Black Bull is on the Saturday 30th November..

[Premium Stuff]

The next Black Bull is on the Saturday 30th November..

 

Thanks mate - will look into it 

 

Cheers

 

Richard

[Ted Massey]

I went to the Kings Hall Stoke all nighter and felt the same about the music!, people dancing around the same old records!

Obviously didn't try the Windsor suite them

[Ted Massey]

Richard try ATB that Barry runs has a similar ethos to the Black Bull it's on 2nd November

[Guest Byrney]

Might look in at ATB myself, it's at Underwood, a mile away from the town I grew up in: Eastwood.

Might stop at my old mums ;)

[Guest Jerri]

Over to Andy Dyson, Keith Money, Cliff Steele and Mick H to respond perhaps!

[Guest Jerri]

They did respond brilliantly in the wee room

[Guest Jerri]

Obviously didn't try the Windsor suite them

[Guest Jerri]

Obviously I did

[manus]

Where was the venue with the jazz funk room? I'm just curious.

 

It was in Brighton - jazz funk/modern downstairs and rare Soul upstairs - and the following alldayer was on Brighton seafront.

 

Cheers

Manus

[KevH]

Pick your venues wisely ....

 

I live about 2 miles from the Mansfield Civic.Although that sort of thing suits some people,i stayed in and played a myself a few tunes.From all reports i have heard it is exactly as described by Daz in the first post.

The Black Bull on the other hand is more my sort of night.....even though i don't make that no where near enough.

[Phil]

Hi just to say that the Mansfield Civic Centre SOUL NITE  is not a out and out NORTHERN  SOUL NITE and Never has been, is does not say that on the flyer that  we advertise yes true it is a bit hand baggy we do play ATB soul from all genras to people who possible have NEVER been to Wigan and any other Northern Soul venues in there youth or past.

I do put on Northern Soul & Modern Soul Events to which i State on the Flyer thats what you will get so to avoid any confusion but hey ho you still get folk moaning about the music policy.

Mansfield and Notts is Well covered with a array of Northern Soul Nites to suit all tastes so you can pick where to go and hopefully have a good time whatever floats your boat,our punters at the Civic enjoy a Good Friendly nite out once a Month so thats what we give them in return,hey ho sorry it was not to your taste Dan

Phil K.

[Jerry Hipkiss]

I don't get the continual downer some folk have on "handbaggers" or newbies or whatever folk want to call them on here. We've had 40 - 50 years to get things like dancefloor etiquette right and I think it a shame that we expect new folk to pick it up instantly. Of course it's frustrating, like learner drivers hogging the roads, but it says more about us than them if we can't tolerate new blood on the scene. Surely the challenge is to accept them into a world we love, feel special and worth coming into. Some might even feel welcome and stay around long enough to learn the unwritten rules of behaviour we've imposed on ourselves. Some might even get bored of the top 500 events and dip their toes into the dark side of the scene and support the more rarer or modern soulful events. 

 I speak of course as a ex handbagger circa class of 75.

Nor me as long as they make the effort - was at Gloucester niter last night, a mixture of hardcore soulies and locals, all just having a good time, I did have to go and have a word with one younger couple about drinks on the dancefloor but they immediately took notice...:-)

[Cunnie]

Quite funny really.
10 years ago folks were moaning about the scene dying & being on it's arse.

5 years ago they were moaning about there being too many venue's & now they're moaning about new people actually attending these new venue's.
Wonder what folks will be moaning about in 5 years time

[Steve S 60]

Quite funny really.

10 years ago folks were moaning about the scene dying & being on it's arse.

5 years ago they were moaning about there being too many venue's & now they're moaning about new people actually attending these new venue's.

Wonder what folks will be moaning about in 5 years time

 

Don't know, but I'm sure we'll find something.

[Ian Dewhirst]

Quite funny really.

10 years ago folks were moaning about the scene dying & being on it's arse.

5 years ago they were moaning about there being too many venue's & now they're moaning about new people actually attending these new venue's.

Wonder what folks will be moaning about in 5 years time

 

Too many originals being played? 

 

Ian D 

[Julie Moore]

At Oxford Soul Club last time out a group of maybe 17 students turned up .................one of the promoters had a little word in one of the girls ears about dancefloor protocol.............told her noone would pinch their handbags and no drinks on the floor .....................they were so open minded musically they had a brilliant night and will be back ................thats what is needed imho.

 

Regards 

 

Julie 

[Swifty]

We have a local do in town at one of the Pubs that's organised by a few lads who, to be honest have never been involved in the scene (Nearly put 'Our' scene) and that's where the problem (if it is one) lies . They're a bunch of lads ( Blokes actually 'cause they're in their 40's) who love all the stuff we had the pleasure of hearing all those years ago. The thing is I have been a couple of times and it's all off CD but they get 40-60 folk in there and it's only a small place.

 

I Spat my dummy out one night because the CD was left on a started playing again WTF!! My gripe was that some of the tunes on the CD I have on Vinyl and paid good money for but to honest they dont really give 2 flying fooks but there were a lot of people enjoying themselves , no handbags or beer on the dancefloor though.

 

At least new people are getting to hear stuff and gaining an interest in the music, which surely isn't a bad thing , or is it ?

 

It's not and shouldn't be a Secret Society

 

Just my thoughts really

 

Swifty

 

p.s. One of the lads that runs it asked me how I play 'them American record with no middle'

[Zed1]

Agreed it's not a secret society, but we want people to come out first and foremost for the music, which isn't always the case at many venue's...

Edited October 20, 2013 by Zed1

[Swifty]

Agreed it's not a secret society, but we want people to come out first and foremost for the music, which isn't always the case at many venue's...

and in fairness to the people I was on about that is the reason , which is a good thing .

[TOAD]

Err if they are not on the scene how do they no what cd tracks to play? Every man and his dog these days says into northern soul but really haven't got a clue

[Raremusicdirect]

At Oxford Soul Club last time out a group of maybe 17 students turned up .................one of the promoters had a little word in one of the girls ears about dancefloor protocol.............told her noone would pinch their handbags and no drinks on the floor .....................they were so open minded musically they had a brilliant night and will be back ................thats what is needed imho.

 

Regards 

 

Julie 

Sounds spot on.........

[Mark S]

After witnessing handbaggers doing their stuff a couple of weeks ago falling about and dancing like twats treating the venue like they would anywhere on a saturday night out I think the advice to choose venues wisely is apt .

 I would be happy to see midweek events that maybe wouldnt attract the divies .

For me its about the music and I,m not remotely interested in new blood

[Twoshoes]

...............one of the promoters had a little word in one of the girls ears about dancefloor protocol.............told her noone would pinch their handbags and no drinks on the floor ....................

 

Regards 

 

Julie 

Good point and one that often gets overlooked is the honesty of the scene that firstimers don't understand, your bag,coat whatever is safe left unattended,I have personally only seen one thing go missing at a Northern night, a coat with the car keys in the pocket,a full scale search entailed with everyone getting wound up at such a thing happening.The coats were hung in a communal area, turned out my mate, not a regular at the venue had left early , had the same coat at home and thinking he had worn it on the night just put it on and walked home,all was resolved next morning to everyones satisfaction ,honest mistake albiet a stupid one.

[Peter99]

Good point and one that often gets overlooked is the honesty of the scene that firstimers don't understand, your bag,coat whatever is safe left unattended,I have personally only seen one thing go missing at a Northern night, a coat with the car keys in the pocket,a full scale search entailed with everyone getting wound up at such a thing happening.The coats were hung in a communal area, turned out my mate, not a regular at the venue had left early , had the same coat at home and thinking he had worn it on the night just put it on and walked home,all was resolved next morning to everyones satisfaction ,honest mistake albiet a stupid one.

That's fair enough. But, the soul scene has had it's fair share of crooks over the years - some seriously crooked ones at that.

 

Peter

 

[Russ Vickers]

There are actually 2 issues here.  One is encouraging & tolerating new folk who are genuinely interested in the music, much like we were when we began our journey & Im all for that. 

 

The second is people who are coming along & have no idea really whats going on, they may be vaguely familar with a bit of soul & Motown, but in all honesty you could be playing pretty much any genre of music, so long as its singalong, good time, party music, its a Disco for geriatrics & older singles, who on the whole, want to get pissed n get thier leg over if possible, once tanked up anyone is fair game for a piss take n if there are regular soulies in the gaff theyre at the sharp end.

 

I dont think, that on the whole, proper soul music events suffer that much with the latter & if they do, its usually nipped in the bud.  However, there are promoters out there that dont give a hoot about the music or the punters, they are selling a product & NS is the en vogue thing, everyone thinks they know what NS is, if theye of a certain age & the promoters will pretty much give em what they want so long as theyre making a profit, its not about the music or the scene or any thing else, theyve seen a way of getting bums on seats & making money...end of.

 

Go to the events you enjoy & give the others a wide birth.

 

Russ

[Swifty]

Err if they are not on the scene how do they no what cd tracks to play? Every man and his dog these days says into northern soul but really haven't got a clue

Toad , everyone can just google Northern Soul and get a CD of the old top tunes for £2.99 or less mate , hey I'm not knocking them but it's easy to do