Poll: Bbc Culture Show - Northern Soul - Your Take ?

[Guest Byrney]

For folks who went to youth clubs in the 70s and saw the NORTHERN SOUL enigma take shape, but never joined in, I think it would be a 'blast from the past'. .

True, but they're all at Butlins at Skeggy at the moment so they can a first hand feel of the nostalgia scene.

[Stevie]

Agree with SHEFFSOUL - I was wearing solatios in '74 along with baggies, which were not a fashion item at the time. The only way to get them was to have them made to measure at a local tailors, in my area Burtons or Hepworths. When they started to become available commercially I stopped wearing them.

I stopped going to Wigan shortly before the 3rd Anniversary and was wearing at that time Falmers jeans, Wrigleys belt, Green flash tennis shoes, cap sleeved T Shirt and Foster Grant graduated sunglasses.... Nice! :-)

Inbetween times there were bowling shirts (original American imports) which were later copied and also made available on the High Street, Hawaiian shirts, neckerchiefs, whistles, baseball caps etc

The clothing was like the music at the time - ever changing.

Have never really been sure why the oversize trousers have been chosen by the retro crowd as the clothing of the time - they really weren't around for that long in the beginning.

[Ritchieandrew]

Personally I thought the commitment & the candour of most of the people featured was positive. However I don't get the "Granny Clampit skirts" & bags thing anymore. I believe that people use this code of dress to confirm their affinity to the "Northern Scene."

along with the badges and badge festooned holdalls. After Wigan closed we used to say that the badge people evident then really never went there.! However we live in a democracy & people are allowed to dress how they wish, & express themselves accordingly. Regarding the footage, most of it was not new, and the newer footage really didn't give any credence to the current vibrant non oldies Northern scene. We had in the main the 'usual suspects' interviewed, & I would have liked to see some faces from the Wheel onwards as well, an interview of somebody like Brian 45 Phillips would have been interesting. Mention you are into Northern, & most people see the scene & mode of dress as portrayed on this type of footage, which of course is not how it really is.! Finally each to their own, & long live Northern Soul.!!!

[Chalky]

Brilliant clip showing the dancing. And nobody can tell me that the dancing would look better in comedy flares. I reckon good footwork always looks better in narrow trousers.

 

 

But many of those in baggies aren't very good with the footwork, just throw themselves about.  Same in dance competitions, all the best dancers sit down as they know the judges will pick the acrobatic ones.  I'd sooner watch good footwork, with the odd floor trick, in the right place at the right time, than some one who simply does acrobatics for the sake of it!

[Chalky]

Sowerby Bridge to be precise Mr. G.......I used the address enough times to remember! LOL Only when I used 'em it was for zoots & pegs......the "40's" as the guys around here used to call them were largely a thing of the past thankfully!

Cheers,

Mark R

 

Spencers are still making trousers in Sowerby Bridge, mainly sporting trousers, golf plus fours etc. 

[Ernie Andrews]

True. About 50/50 I'd say.  I went for an exactly a year without touching anything.  The one night decided to do it just because the others were doing it.  Worst decision EVER.

I never did Pete- I ate tons of Jam butties (Warburton's of course) and my mother used to rollock me in the morning for nicking the bread! If you have an undertanding of Psyco -immunology you would understand that the body's chemical systems can be affected by certain feelings and for me the music did that coupled with reloading my energy levels - hence the butties!

The programme was not bad for 30 mins but the reference to Bruce Lee is inaccurate IMO as I suggest they are referring to Sandys Kick Boxing - I don't think I ever saw Bruce Lee  dancing "Ton of Dynamite" style

[Guest Polyvelts]

Brilliant clip showing the dancing. And nobody can tell me that the dancing would look better in comedy flares. I reckon good footwork always looks better in narrow trousers.

.....There were some dancers on this quite good tv show in the seventies called 'Soul Train' ?

[Northernjordan]

Generic term,sorry didn't know there was a scooter club of that name..........great name for a club

Out of interest what happens when you get to 26

Cheers

Martyn

Sorry, I was just unsure and wanted to know who you had spoke to 95% of the club juat wear normal cloths that would fit in any way today... No baggies, no circle skirts but a couple of mod type characters. Just normal lads and lasses some who hate northern but most others who love it and will dance all night to it.

When you are 26 you become a rusty musket ;)

[Guest Byrney]

But many of those in baggies aren't very good with the footwork, just throw themselves about.  Same in dance competitions, all the best dancers sit down as they know the judges will pick the acrobatic ones.  I'd sooner watch good footwork, with the odd floor trick, in the right place at the right time, than some one who simply does acrobatics for the sake of it!

I've said this before but many who wear this get up do a simple skippy, Wigan walk dance which was about when I first started in 78 - easy to do with very set steps, hand jive movements, etc - entry level stuff.

I can't recall anyone doing this from 1981 onwards until the emergence of nostalgia scene.

[Chalky]

I've said this before but many who wear this get up do a simple skippy, Wigan walk dance which was about when I first started in 78 - easy to do with very set steps, hand jive movements, etc - entry level stuff.

I can't recall anyone doing this from 1981 onwards until the emergence of nostalgia scene.

 

Some of those in circle skirts and baggies aren't even dancing in a northern style, dunnowhat some are dancing too at times but it ain't the record playing.

[Reg]

A lot of the women in the tent skirts don't do proper Soul dancing. It's all about the skirt, most of them don't even spin...they just twirl around just enough so you can see their pants

[MrsWoodsrules]

Got to say I dont like that part of the scene and personally find it cringewothy.

I do say live and let live, but its a bit embarrasing IMO, Whats the point?

Its 2013, just get on with it today, you can be stylish (I like to think I am cough cough) even retro, which is a smart look by todays standards, but 40" Spencers and twirly skirts?

I dont like it, its just silly.

i reckon its only a very small % in fancy dress, but they get all the coverage with the filmakers.

[Steve S 60]

There's a simple formula for baggy trousers.  If your age is greater than the width of your trouser bottoms, it's a no.

[macca]

Hey Chippy, not having a go, just my opinion.

Isnt that the wrong way round?

I detest this whole Weller/Soul thing.

He aint nothing but a bandwagon jumper.

I was/am familiar with all his very first records and onward.

Athough say....In The City etc, wasnt bad, I was listening to Gary Haines or J D Martin when he was playing at being a punk, my mother knew more about soul than him.

So, he then becomes a star (rightly so), as he is very talented too (and I do like him), but then, all of a sudden, he's some kind of soul guru.

We had finished with his style and music before he even started on it.

Rant over :-)

Back on topic.

 

Arguable, to say the least.

[macca]

I was thinking aloud on that last post. it's got sod all to do with the thread, sorry...

 

Enjoyed it in parts. Elaine's description of the dancefloor vibe with the presenter grinning broadly was cool. Some of the This England 1977 outtakes were better than those that appeared in the final programme. Loved the one of the black guy's extended spin at the Casino at the beginning of the programme. The stuff on the retro scene, the dance class, King's Hall scenes simply made me cringe, and cringe a lot, sorry.

[Reg]

Some of the outtakes were from the Old Grey Whistle test Tony's Empress Ballroom program from 1987. A clip in the record bar and also people going in.

[connie 52]

I was thinking aloud on that last post. it's got sod all to do with the thread, sorry...

 

Enjoyed it in parts. Elaine's description of the dancefloor vibe with the presenter grinning broadly was cool. Some of the This England 1977 outtakes were better than those that appeared in the final programme. Loved the one of the black guy's extended spin at the Casino at the beginning of the programme. The stuff on the retro scene, the dance class, King's Hall scenes simply made me cringe, and cringe a lot, sorry.

The coloured guy if remember rightly was Gid harding from Bolton

[Rich B]

Solatios were around in 72/73 for sure - lots of the cooler kids at the youth club I went to wore them. I always thought the later 'northern' wear was a retro thing even then. All connected with the flat sole/dancing shoes thing. A lot of local kids said to me "I don't mind the trousers but I couldn't wear those shoes!"

I think we should acknowledge that part of the northern thing was the feeling of superiority it gave you. And the fact that we were relentlessly forward looking.

The other guys who lived near me were in flares and platforms - I was in bags and flatties - they got baggies when they got to the High street - but I was already into tapers and converse - we were just cooler and they couldn't keep up!

How did it end up as it has?

[Quinvy]

There's a simple formula for baggy trousers.  If your age is greater than the width of your trouser bottoms, it's a no.

Funniest post I've ever read, and should become law on the scene. Brilliant.

[Rich B]

Really interesting that each dancer on the clip finishes his bit and walks off with attitude - exactly like break dancers do today.

I think those 'dance offs' have been part of black culture for a long time, they are mentioned in Archie Bell "Showdown".

[Rich B]

Funniest post I've ever read, and should become law on the scene. Brilliant.

Fair point, shouldn't have to be law though - a mirror should be sufficient!

[Reg]

Joe I can just see that Motown teapot in the tiki tiki bar :-)

That waistcoat is the funniest thing ever...nearly as naff as a car sticker I saw recently..."Johnsons Talc -it's a Northern Soul Thing!"

[Grayman45]

There's a simple formula for baggy trousers.  If your age is greater than the width of your trouser bottoms, it's a no.

 

Inches or centimeters?

[Guest]

There's a simple formula for baggy trousers.  If your age is greater than the width of your trouser bottoms, it's a no.

Or your waist !!

[Naughty Boy]

I would give it a  2 poss 3 stars   it kept me away from the news at 10.

When i heard  about this proggy thought here we go again another northern car crash  but for a change not too bad for maybe the uninformed  but thought it was pointless   tbh .. as for the Karate inspired moves nah  .  .

 

Wicksy

Edited September 28, 2013 by Naughty Boy

[Tricky]

A depressingly depressing programme that left me feeling depressed.

 

Sums it all up really.

 

Look back forty years at clothes and music coz nothing else exists after everybody left the scene in the early eighties and turned off the lights.

 

Tricky

[Chatty]

It was one fellows look back at a scene he hadn't inhabited for 30 odd years, it was always going to go back through the time warp, can't believe anybody expected anything different!

[Guest Byrney]

I for one didn't really expect anything different, just hoped it wouldn't just cast aside decades of the Northern Scene like many have in the media and nostalgia scene, missed opportunity for accuracy with some good bits and lots of cringy bits.

[Steve G]

It's a TV programme by a guy who was on the scene in his teens and has come back to find it still going. It's always going to try and have mass appeal. It's always going to focus on people that the producers think are "interesting" - going out clubbing in yer 50's, special clothes etc. etc. That's what keeps the viewer interested.

 

We mustn't forget the programme wasn't made for us...As such I still think it was good.

Edited September 29, 2013 by Steve G

[hullsoul]

Is Paul Mason on here?I'd be interested in his thought's after reading this thread.Has he been to any more "do's" since his return,has he any intentions of a follow up in some form etc.

Just a thought?

Cheers

Martyn

Edited September 29, 2013 by hullsoul

[TheBigO]

It's a TV programme by a guy who was on the scene in his teens and has come back to find it still going. It's always going to try and have mass appeal. It's always going to focus on people that the producers think are "interesting" - going out clubbing in yer 50's, special clothes etc. etc. That's what keeps the viewer interested.

 

We mustn't forget the programme wasn't made for us...As such I still think it was good.

Agree with you on this Steve, take it as it was and it was OK, we are NEVER going to get a programme that covers the myriad of diversity that the scene is unless it's a 13 week 2 hr series which, as we all know only too well, will still be ripped apart on these forums for missing something, not covering XYZ etc etc. Lifes too bloody short, just enjoy whatever elements of the scene you are into and carry on   

[Pete S]

A depressingly depressing programme that left me feeling depressed.

 

Sums it all up really.

 

Look back forty years at clothes and music coz nothing else exists after everybody left the scene in the early eighties and turned off the lights.

 

Tricky

 

I'm amazed it left you feeling depressed, the minute it finished I went in to Davina and said I want to go to an allnighter and get smashed, it really made me feel like going out again.  Till about an hour later when I realised I couldn't be bothered.

[TheBigO]

I'm amazed it left you feeling depressed, the minute it finished I went in to Davina and said I want to go to an allnighter and get smashed, it really made me feel like going out again.  Till about an hour later when I realised I couldn't be bothered.

Your spot on Pete and I did in fact go out last night - will let you all know how that went once I get out of surgery

[macca]

The getting smashed part is the part that least appeals. Do these retro bods still get blocked too?

[Pete S]

The getting smashed part is the part that least appeals. Do these retro bods still get blocked too?

 

I agree actually, I was just getting carried away in the moment.

[Guest nsoulxx]

Actually I thought it was rather good. I'm sure some people will pick holes in the minutiae, but what came across very well, was that all other aspects of the scene are, and have always been, secondary to the music. It's the music's ability to connect on an emotional level with us soulies that makes the scene(s) special, and nothing else comes close.

 

4/5

Well said

[dedji1955]

The getting smashed part is the part that least appeals. Do these retro bods still get blocked too?

I suppose it's like it always has been and always will be..Some do and some don't regardless of what part of the scene appeals to them

Personally I havn't touched any gear since the 70s and still attend Nighters on a regular basis, doing 3 in a weekend last Month!

[Guest nsoulxx]

A lot of the women in the tent skirts don't do proper Soul dancing. It's all about the skirt, most of them don't even spin...they just twirl around just enough so you can see their pants

There were loads of crackers on show last night Reg! big ones! I had to move right to the edge so i could dance without being consumed by a skirt. Saying that it did look amazing last night with the place packed to the rafters with so many people having come out of thw oodwork at KGH. Bet it's back to low numbers again in November though unless the show and forthcoming film keep the interest going for a while. Does grate on your nerves when you can't find a spot to dance though because of all the massive high heel brigade

[Guest nsoulxx]

I suppose it's like it always has been and always will be..Some do and some don't regardless of what part of the scene appeals to them

Personally I havn't touched any gear since the 70s and still attend Nighters on a regular basis, doing 3 in a weekend last Month!

Maybe that stuff back then was so strong that it's still in your system?! I did a mod weekender followed by the Radcliffe all nighter a couple of months back without anything stronger than Strongbow and diet coke and it killed me for a week after   

[Guest nsoulxx]

A depressingly depressing programme that left me feeling depressed.

 

Sums it all up really.

 

Look back forty years at clothes and music coz nothing else exists after everybody left the scene in the early eighties and turned off the lights.

 

Trick

So not true

[Guest nsoulxx]

Joe I can just see that Motown teapot in the tiki tiki bar :-)

That waistcoat is the funniest thing ever...nearly as naff as a car sticker I saw recently..."Johnsons Talc -it's a Northern Soul Thing!"

Reg, Rochelle actually asked me if you'd really bought that waistcoat for Rich as she believed you were serious! I tried to explain about Rich and his tastes but I think that she really thinks you two will be out showing the world your new gear!

[Guest nsoulxx]

Some of the outtakes were from the Old Grey Whistle test Tony's Empress Ballroom program from 1987. A clip in the record bar and also people going in.

Why don't you stop drawing attention to that clip please if you don't mind!!! Watched it again and just realised, it cuts off at the point where you were heading up the stairs so it's alright for you!!!

[Guest nsoulxx]

i saw the show, top marks, really enjoyed, saw alot of familar faces, its nice to see pete and sue, two lovely people,few people asked me over the years what was the early days of Wigan like, and the dancing,first 2 years possibly 3, of the casino you just cant put into words, the atmosphere, the buzz, most of all the music. i look like i'll be taken to the grave with anyone else knowing, cheers Billy.  

Said hello to Sue last night at KGH, she is lovely and was treated like a movie star. Her hubby's spot was a floor filled one too. Nice people and what's under her skirt will be better than what's under the skirts of those trying to be mean about her on Facebook!

[Len]

 

 

(I couldn't find the post I was referring to, I guess Mike may have removed it because of the swearing)

 

Hi Mate,

 

Firstly apologies if my line “as long as they do it their way” came across to you that I was implying that the young ones on the programme are not ‘doing it their way’, I don’t know them - I was generally speaking. The Scene will soon be theirs and I do hope they do it their way and enjoy the ride to boot - just as I did, albeit bumpy at times! (I thought my Mod reference showed that)

 

I know someone commented that the young ones on the programme “have got it so wrong’, and you didn’t like that - This is someone’s opinion (which he’s entitled to of course) Fact is, his opinion won’t matter to those that are genuine, because to them it wouldn’t be correct. He also would have had to make his own way on the Scene, and would have had to have that ‘staying power’ to get through any ‘flack’ that was thrown his way - It happens.

 

Ref the couple featured, I don’t think anyone would want to offend them, maybe they have felt just a little upset by ‘it all’, but I think / hope they are also able to smile about it. I got the impression that their ‘faith’ is strong, so are well capable of handling any criticism that may have looked (to some) like it was aimed at them (I don’t think it was) They seemed like a nice couple, and anyone could tell by watching the programme, that they are having a ball doing ‘what they do’ - Good on em.

ïŠ

…..I’m sure Hayley won’t mind me telling this story......I remember as a young Mod attending Cliff Steel’s ‘Detroit Academicals’ Soul Nights - One was at a Working Men’s Club called Friendly’s (ironically enough!) ….I was walking past ‘the girls on the door’, and Hayley ‘screeched’ “Mod!”, and pointed at ‘Moi’…..which was closely followed by a ‘chorus of laughter’ from anyone who heard!…..How did I react? - I didn’t, and the experience didn’t put me off….some 25 years later, I was invited to Hayley’s 50^th Birthday, which I thought really nice (especially from the perspective I have described)

 

This is nothing compared to other things that have ‘tested’ me over the years, but I stuck with it, and do you know what? Looking back, ‘some’ that threw flack my way, weren’t actually ‘qualified’ to do so (imo)

 

Years ago, I had a fascinating conversation with Ion (A ‘Face’ / D.J of the 80’s Scene) at his flat in Holbourn, about this very subject. I shared a couple of my ‘experiences’ with him, and he shouted…..“’That’s the apprenticeship Lenny!”…..then went on to tell me about his early experiences and the ‘flack’ that he had endured - I remember the conversation being an ‘Ulrika’ moment!

 

So, you (and any other younger ones), wear exactly what you want, and enjoy your journey. Some may fall by the wayside (as has been said), but those that stay will have the rewarding bonds, and understanding with others that have done the same - no matter what year!

 

Ref the above, I now feel compelled to say hello to Billy Whizz again - Hello Billy!.....I came on to the Scene years after Billy, I haven’t even met him and maybe never will, but I do feel we share that ‘special thing’

 

All the best,

 

Len  

 

P.s - To this day, I still feel that ‘edge’ / ‘slightly intimidated’ at places sometimes - and I like that………Mind you, I feel intimidated going to the local Post Office - if I succumbed to it I would never leave the house!......I suppose being a ‘schitzo’, I will at least always have company…..”I agree Len”……….”Yeh, so do I mate”……….”Thanks”……….”Who said that?!”……….  

 

N.B - I know Mental Health is no laughing matter - believe me, I know. But I’m allowed to laugh at myself - It helps me cope  

[Steve G]

(I couldn't find the post I was referring to, I guess Mike may have removed it because of the swearing)

 

Hi Mate,

 

Firstly apologies if my line “as long as they do it their way” came across to you that I was implying that the young ones on the programme are not ‘doing it their way’, I don’t know them - I was generally speaking. 

 

On

and

On

and

On....

 

Hi Len, think he deleted his own post when he realised how daft he was sounding......Move along nothing to see here!  

Edited September 29, 2013 by Steve G

[Peter99]

Hi Len, think he deleted his own post when he realised how daft he was sounding......Move along nothing to see here!

Hi Steve

 

He'd covered everything though - in great detail.

 

 

Peter

[elizabeth]

Hi please keep quiet about the scene bbc...their is know

 

difference in the scene with me still northern soul

 

personally i dont like the baggies & the skirts their

 

not our scene,Sue & Pete brill people

[macca]

I've tried babelfish with this last post but buggered if I understand what it came up with. no comprendo isabel.

[Steve G]

Hi Steve

 

He'd covered everything though - in great detail.

 

 

Peter

 

Hi Pete,

It's also possible he's gone to "Russfest 2013" for the weekend ....who knows, who cares.....

Edited September 29, 2013 by Steve G

[Peter99]

Hi Pete,

It's also possible he's gone to "Russfest 2013" for the weekend ....who knows, who cares.....

  LOL