Poll: Bbc Culture Show - Northern Soul - Your Take ?

[Stevie T]

 

 

never any snobbery on my part , the music and dance comes first for me , i just happen to like to dress the way i do to dance . but i do need to buy my own dry cleaners

[Mark Bicknell]

For me you can take away all the veneer, the baggies, the badges, the tack etc. and at the end of the day it's about a young 17 or 18 year old black singer or group standing at a microphone and the engineer says ok roll the tape counts them in and bang there you have it their dreams and aspirations of having a hit record, the pain, the heartache, the passion, basically was the single most fundamental thing which drew me in some 37 years ago, what comes across to me in some areas of the scene is the music is so far down the pecking order of priorities the whole point of why we are all involved is lost or certainly diluted.`  

[Pete S]

 

 

 

I know where you're coming from and have to agree, the baggies were really good for dancing in compared to say a pair of Levi jeans.  It's funny, when I first started dancing in 'normal' trousers I really missed the swish of the baggy trousers round the bottom of the legs.  

Anyone remember trousers that came in, 78-79, or they were probably better known as "pegs", baggy at the top, tapered, they were called Skids trousers sometimes because Stuart Adamson from The Skids had them on on the Into The Valley sleeve.

 

[Back Street Blue]

 

 

 

Same here mate.........still wouldn't be seen dead in them now though

[Sooty]

....erm....techno problem!!!!x I said that...not Pete...! Why am I trapped in this box....?!

@@

X

Edited September 27, 2013 by SOOTY

[Spacehopper]

sub genres of dance from 'rave' to where we are now...just like the sub genres now on the 'northern' scene!

[Winnie :-)]

Just talking to Mick Smith, said he only caught the last 5 minutes and was too embarrassed to try and watch the rest on iplayer - he was talking about the clothes and dancing styles making people think that we all lived in a 40 year old time warp - and said it's a totally Northern (geographically) thing and nobody would be seen dead dressing like that at the 100 Club.

That's not strictly true Pete, there's 2/3 that wear bags to the 100, although I haven't been for 18 months so things might have changed. A few used to wear vests as well, I'm not going to name them because I don't know if they're on source, but they definitely exist

[ImberBoy]

[Pete S]

That's not strictly true Pete, there's 2/3 that wear bags to the 100, although I haven't been for 18 months so things might have changed. A few used to wear vests as well, I'm not going to name them because I don't know if they're on source, but they definitely exist

 

I don't know Win, I don't go, Mick does and I was just repeating what he told me to say (not sure why he won't post himself mind)

[Pete S]

 

So that's where my Gran's tablecloth ended up

[Md Records]

A Million is good viewing figures, but putting it in perspective "The History Of The Jews" on the same channel a few weeks ago got more viewers and there isn't a large exodus to Israel to my knowledge due to it, and looking at it from another angle, over 98% of the country didn't watch it. I still feel comfortable sleeping in my bed tonight knowing that my kids aren't rifling through my record collection. As I say, a good effort, but ain't gonna affect us much, though I do hope it gets a few more "bums on seats" for Elaine's film!! What I did notice the other day was all the northern instrumentals accompanying the "Mohammed Ali" documentary "Thumb A Ride", "Sliced Tomatoes", "The Champion" - Anyone else catch that?

 

Des

[Spacehopper]

That's not strictly true Pete, there's 2/3 that wear bags to the 100, although I haven't been for 18 months so things might have changed. A few used to wear vests as well, I'm not going to name them because I don't know if they're on source, but they definitely exist

 

was there last weekend and there may have been a couple but i cant remember..they were not obvious they were lost in a crowd of far better dressed people..some very well dressed mod types others just casual....

[Spacehopper]

yes des did catch that and mentioned it to nic at the time....fb had a big hand in the viewing figures i think..it seemed like every other post for a few days leading upto it was about the culture show!

[Winnie :-)]

I don't know Win, I don't go, Mick does and I was just repeating what he told me to say (not sure why he won't post himself mind)

 

 

was there last weekend and there may have been a couple but i cant remember..they were not obvious they were lost in a crowd of far better dressed people..some very well dressed mod types others just casual....

I'm not saying they're visible in abundance, just that some do wear wear the uniform, even at the 100.  

[Jordirip]

For me you can take away all the veneer, the baggies, the badges, the tack etc. and at the end of the day it's about a young 17 or 18 year old black singer or group standing at a microphone and the engineer says ok roll the tape counts them in and bang there you have it their dreams and aspirations of having a hit record, the pain, the heartache, the passion, basically was the single most fundamental thing which drew me in some 37 years ago, what comes across to me in some areas of the scene is the music is so far down the pecking order of priorities the whole point of why we are all involved is lost or certainly diluted.`  

 

Similar for me too Mark. It was also a feeling of total injustice towards the unknown guys that made this amazing music, when I looked at the crap that was getting rammed down our throats on the radio making talentless idiots rich and famous. It affected a lot about how I view life and people in general. Also the scene itself was f*ucking exciting to a youngster at that time.

[Kegsy]

Quite a few yachts in Marbella came from rave proceedings.

Quite right, one said yachts is owned by a guy I know, his initial

money came off the back of the rave scene, although he's cleaned up

most of his "investments" these days.

[ImberBoy]

I enjoyed the telly program, there have been some top comments about the content, what was missed and what was covered so I have nothing of any value or weight to add as far as that is concerned. My only criticism is that often we, as a community, forget that there are real people involved and it matters not that they have been thrust or have stepped up to the plate, there are people and their feelings should be respected.

 

I have no time for keyboard soulies and for the sou night alldayer shallow end, yes I know the “scene” is multi layered but the only layer I am interested in is The Allnighter Scene, I am quite horrified that some choose to slate the way people dress for an Allnighter especially when the couple are stalwarts of The Allnighter Scene.

[Citizen P]

A Million is good viewing figures, but putting it in perspective "The History Of The Jews" on the same channel a few weeks ago got more viewers and there isn't a large exodus to Israel to my knowledge due to it, and looking at it from another angle, over 98% of the country didn't watch it. I still feel comfortable sleeping in my bed tonight knowing that my kids aren't rifling through my record collection. As I say, a good effort, but ain't gonna affect us much, though I do hope it gets a few more "bums on seats" for Elaine's film!! What I did notice the other day was all the northern instrumentals accompanying the "Mohammed Ali" documentary "Thumb A Ride", "Sliced Tomatoes", "The Champion" - Anyone else catch that?

 

Des

 

Yes, That was a good programme, probably being torn to shreds on Boxing Forums as we speak 

[Kegsy]

Why am I clicking frantically on this hoping its a youtube video ??

Kegsy

[Sooty]

Just talking to Mick Smith, said he only caught the last 5 minutes and was too embarrassed to try and watch the rest on iplayer - he was talking about the clothes and dancing styles making people think that we all lived in a 40 year old time warp - and said it's a totally Northern (geographically) thing and nobody would be seen dead dressing like that at the 100 Club.

 

When you speak with Mick next Pete...say hi for me and give him my regards!x I apologise to him because when thinking on comments i've made about the DJ's I met or shared the decks with...i've failed to mention Mick...who was quite influential to me in the 90's!!x He always frightened me to death tbf!!!hehe!x I loved his music...and approach....but always held an air of respect for him and perhaps stayed away and didn't get as friendly as perhaps we could have!x I'm sorry about that....he may have been happy with it?! We never fell out or had a cross word.....but that's how it was I recall for us!x

Given my understanding....I understand his feelings about it....but....with all respect to him....and the show....without watching it all...in context....then any comment can't be taken seriously...I feel!x As for the 100Club....which is where we shared most time together....my memory in the 90's was that there was always this large 'crew' of young...Moddy...different looking Soulies giving it some at the front right all night....dressed to impress in a manner I never saw Nationwide.....!!!x Luv'd seeing them every time and danced alongside them often. Indeed they were the ones who heaped praise on me when I mistakenly played a 70's track....on me first ever spot.....din't know it wos a 60's doo as such...!!hehe!x But they were definitely 'different' and perhaps in 20 years...if picked out on footage....may be given the same critique that Mick is making of those presented on the brief bit of the show he saw!x I wos there....and don't think it strange...or weird....and....couldn't say on reflection I was embarrassed by the 100club crew or those on the show either!x Mick appeared to me to be reserved in his way...and I respect that and have done......and hope he finds it in his wisdom to feel the same towards others whose modus operandii may be 'different' to his. As i've said before....Northern Soul...it takes all kinds...and has all kinds...and I love em all...!x

 

LUV

SOOTY

X

[ImberBoy]

Why am I clicking frantically on this hoping its a youtube video ??

Kegsy

 

My missus nearly caught me clicking on this 3:)

[ImberBoy]

[hullsoul]

Simon

So that's the look you was going for when you wore your kilt..........you can't get anything right

Cheers

Martyn

[Paul-s]

Beware all the dancers are Kung Fu fighters and take the piss and they will kick ya to Wiggin n back lol

Bruce Lee what a laugh the lass should have researched and she would have known the early northern dance moves where copied from soul artist like the legendary James Brown Jackie Wilson ect ect ect

Yes definitely Ian and backdrops and a few other things from the Teddy Boys at the earlier soul events

[Simsy]

Maybe because on the mod scene, music/dancing comes second to looking cool where as on the Northern scene the clothes, vest, baggy trousers etc are more about trying to stay cool and not being hindered by tight clothes if you do the acrobatics.  When I'm sweating my bollox off in jeans I sometimes wish I was wearing a pair of cotton bags tbh. I also think there's an illusion of better footwork with 30 ins of cotton flapping around ones ankles, ditto the women  'shuffle' spinning wearing a circle skirt. 

 

Just my opinion and observation, not having a pop at anyone. 

 

Yep I'd totally agree with that mate and I do get the practicalities of said 70's loose clothing etc, but purely from an aesthetic viewpoint, mods have faired better imo.

[Kegsy]

Why am I hoping this is DEFINATELY NOT a you tube video.

Edited September 27, 2013 by Kegsy

[TheBigO]

I seem to remember Spencer's setting up shop at the Casino, must have been late 70's.  As well as 40" bags, they did pegs and some MC Hammer type kecks with pleats all the way round.

Those were 20 pleat 'Bowies' which most of us around here wore throughout the 80's along with baggies when we felt like it. As is SOOOOOOOO obvious, not because they were cool or fashionable (clearly not) but because they were great to dance in, full stop. Like a threadbare old pair of fave slippers you refuse to get rid of, they just felt right when dancing, much like my 22 year old dancing shoes which are, by my own admission f**ked visually and held together by spit, tape and a prayer! However without them I can't move as freely and I'm too old to break another pair in over 20+ years, lol.

[Geeselad]

I think the term rave scene doesn't help as there was a multitude of genres and events under that banner. Even venues like Shelly's in Stoke we're completely different on different nights ( your old haunt mate) but still fell under the medias catch all banner: Friday was a more mellow, garage or real house affair with little car alarm stuff, compared to Saturday where hardcore was played.

Unless you scratched below the surface or was on one of the many 'rave' scenes outsiders probably wouldn't know this.

You said it so much better than I could mate, sorry to cause offence to anyone, but you can hardly critisie another scene talking in cliches and steroetypes when you're perpetuating new ones. I also think to a certain extent its and age thing, in terms of relating to house and the roots of contemporary dance music.

 

I often tell this anecdote about standing on the balcony at the Hac with me brother, he was telling me about standing on the balcony at station road, talking to a younger kid about the torch. The kid would say 'the torch cant have been better than the this could it?' My brother turned to me and said, Wigan and the torch were totally different but they werent even in the same league as the Hacienda.

[Guest Andy Kempster]

Please bear in mind the way the program was edited which didn't necessarily have time to deal with the complete context of all those sound bites. The point was that there has always been a parallel between fast music and the drugs du jour whatever the decade. Essentially most types of uptempo dance music since the 60's have generally had a drug of choice whether it was speed in the 60's and 70's, coke and E in the 80's, Ketamin in the 90's or MDMA in the 00's.

 

So 70's Northern Soul = speed and late 80's House = E. 

 

The BPM and age group was essentially the same. That's not in any way trying to compare the music but rather the sociological circumstances.

 

They could have used a lot of other stuff but they chose that which is OK by me. I never took drugs when I was into Northern Soul, but I was in the minority. 

 

Ian D 

I went from nighters to the acid scene in late 88 much to the chagrin of the guys I was going to bradford with, in fact they never spoke to me again

 

i had a heated conversation with them saying exactly this, its the same thing, dancing all night to uptempo dance music with like minded people ( )

 

i wasnt old enough for wigan so for me the Astoria was my Wigan Casino but i dont walk around in lilac joggers anymore

[Back Street Blue]

I often tell this anecdote about standing on the balcony at the Hac with me brother, he was telling me about standing on the balcony at station road, talking to a younger kid about the torch. The kid would say 'the torch cant have been better than the this could it?' My brother turned to me and said, Wigan and the torch were totally different but they werent even in the same league as the Hacienda.

 

Hacienda was a great club and comparing it with Wigan doesn't really illustrate the similarities that I personally saw between Wigan and say an all-niter at Legends in Warrington would.

 

I started going to the Hacienda in '84 before what I know of the rave culture got started.

[Maark]

Yep I'd totally agree with that mate and I do get the practicalities of said 70's loose clothing etc, but purely from an aesthetic viewpoint, mods have faired better imo.

 

Agreed Ian........ if they have managed to retain a full head of hair!  Likewise Teddy boys, as with Mods the hairstyle is an integral part of the look. Not so with soulies and if you are gonna be sweating your head off all night and throwing yourself about on a dance floor, then being self concious about your hair style ent gonna work! Luckily, it's something I and quite a few others don't have to worry about any more!

Edited September 27, 2013 by Maark

[Sooty]

The Barn at Braintree....'77/8...I had 6 months 'freedom' when leaving a kids home and on bail waiting to go to prison. I went to The Barn at Braintree twice.....RAMMED...and dancing to Funk all night...until 2pm anyway!! Then the scraps would start! Many soulies frequented it i'm sure as some were dancing Northernish styles I remember!x War's Me and Baby Brother was a then anthem and it kicked off dance wise every time.....and a tune that I remember being played I also remmebr being spun at me school youth club disco a year or so earlier among the Northern....

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E7iSk3b-lPg

 

...both of which I have still proudly in my collection!x The 1 tune from that era that i've played to both genres Northern folk at Party's and Funky doo's...with equal success....is this......

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dt4Kw3s_t_Y

 

As mentioned above about being late with fashion....I remember attending these 2 Funky nights in me mams idea of it....8 button high waisters with flaps 2 deep each leg.....pin striped brown...2nd hand...and I was happy in em tbf among all the trendy Funksters in flares....!x Nearest I got to Wigan I suppose...!x

 

LUV
SOOTY
X

 

..infact...I think th DJ at the Barn played Jam-Jam-Jam off an acetate from the US at the time or summink as it hadn't been released over here at the time! The whole dance floor was like a sea swelling and swaying....awesome memory and 2 nights! Right raver eh?!x

@@
~

Edited September 27, 2013 by SOOTY

[Guest northernsoul62]

Too many circle skirts

I like seeing girls dancing in full circle skirts and i also like oxford bags ...maybe i dream of being young again..

[Guest northernsoul62]

I agree its so feminine and may i add a little sexy

[Guest Matt Male]

I know where you're coming from and have to agree, the baggies were really good for dancing in compared to say a pair of Levi jeans.  It's funny, when I first started dancing in 'normal' trousers I really missed the swish of the baggy trousers round the bottom of the legs.  

Anyone remember trousers that came in, 78-79, or they were probably better known as "pegs", baggy at the top, tapered, they were called Skids trousers sometimes because Stuart Adamson from The Skids had them on on the Into The Valley sleeve.

 

 

I remember Pegs Pete. I seem to remember they were also made of wool and so got really heavy after sweating in them or when they got wet in the rain.

[Guest Byrney]

I ...maybe i dream of being young again..

I can understand that and fair play mate, and I think this may be a key driver of the nostalgia scene and some of its is attendees and why not.

We'd all like to be young again but myself on the Northern scene I look forwards to what's next with a fond nod to the past, that's what Northern Soul has done since Wigan.

[Mr Smithy]

Quite a credible job in 1/2 an hour. For the uninitiated there's enough stuff easily available if they want more and can be assed to look.
So all in all a decent job.

Take heart in knowing if the US networks / cable tried it, it would be a total pigs ear featuring god knows what flavour of the month tosser
mouthing off from a badly written script.
 

[Citizen P]

Quite a credible job in 1/2 an hour. For the uninitiated there's enough stuff easily available if they want more and can be assed to look.

So all in all a decent job.

Take heart in knowing if the US networks / cable tried it, it would be a total pigs ear featuring god knows what flavour of the month tosser

mouthing off from a badly written script.

 

 

 The US don't have exclusive rights to flavour of the month tossers or badly written/ researched scripts.

 

Paul O'Grady, anyone?

 

or my own personal "fave" Stuart Maconie

[Mr Smithy]

 The US don't have exclusive rights to flavour of the month tossers or badly written/ researched scripts.

 

Paul O'Grady, anyone?

 

or my own personal "fave" Stuart Maconie

Ah, but we do have far more of them to choose from, and the quality of toss is much lower.

and our drivelese LCD is far far lower than yours.

IMO you're not even in the running.

[Kevinkent]

Maybe because on the mod scene, music/dancing comes second to looking cool where as on the Northern scene the clothes, vest, baggy trousers etc are more about trying to stay cool and not being hindered by tight clothes if you do the acrobatics.  When I'm sweating my bollox off in jeans I sometimes wish I was wearing a pair of cotton bags tbh. I also think there's an illusion of better footwork with 30 ins of cotton flapping around ones ankles, ditto the women  'shuffle' spinning wearing a circle skirt. 

 

Just my opinion and observation, not having a pop at anyone. 

 

Spot on Mark IMO. I've worn baggies because they're not restrictive. Then I wore them because they shrouded my inadequate footwork. Now I don't wear them, but only 'cos I've aged into a right sh!t dancer.

 

And re the "Bruce Lee" comment made on the programme - I don't think Fran paid full attention to the question before replying as the dancing of course didn't come from Martial Arts. However, with Kung Fu and Karate being so popular at the time it possibly had influence on the ability of quite a few dancers, so I think I know where she's coming from. Whenever I tried on a new pair of parallels or baggies - if I couldn't do a good jodan-mae-geri in a cramped changing cubicle then they were to tight and i wouldn't buy 'em.

 

Enjoyed the programme more than I thought I would and looking forward to Elaine's film a whole lot more than previously. I'd only seen a brief taster before and thought it was a bit corny. My faith has been renewed.

 

 - Kev

[Guest spikeybob]

As an aside, does anyone on here know exactly when Elaines film will be released ? Thought it might have said on the programme, not just "forthcoming film". Will it be a mainstream cinema thing, a pokey art house flea pit jobbie, or straight to DVD ? Sorry if this is covered on another thread.

[stevefrost]

1 star, not enough Frank Wilson

[TOAD]

No need to swear

[TheBigO]

As an aside, does anyone on here know exactly when Elaines film will be released ? Thought it might have said on the programme, not just "forthcoming film". Will it be a mainstream cinema thing, a pokey art house flea pit jobbie, or straight to DVD ? Sorry if this is covered on another thread.

Last time I spoke with Elaine she was trying to sort out the distributors from cutting out a major chunk of the film central to the experience, namely the move from youth club to soul night to allnighters, hence the delay. I support her fully, better to have the film as you want it and a little delayed rather than releasing something with all the balls cut off! Not sure if it's going to be a mainstream release or not, who cares! This looks set to be the best film on the subject to date so I'm looking forward to it.

Edited September 27, 2013 by TheBigO

[Jordirip]

pete and sue are two of the most genuine down to earth people i know on the scene and are worth more than you lot 10 times over your all a bunch of sad basterds and need to get a life the comment you lot have put on here are fucking disgusting should all hang your heads in shame !!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Easy tiger. Has anyone slagged Pete and Sue off? I've read every post on this thread (have you?) and I have seen no dissing at all of anyone. Only the very funny clothes some people choose to wear for some reason.

[Chalky]

Just for you, Chalky.....the Nicholas Brothers.

 

https://youtu.be/fNKRm6H-qOU

 

 

That's the guys 

[Chalky]

That's not strictly true Pete, there's 2/3 that wear bags to the 100, although I haven't been for 18 months so things might have changed. A few used to wear vests as well, I'm not going to name them because I don't know if they're on source, but they definitely exist

 

 

Is that 2 or 3 or two thirds Win?  I've never in all the time I've gone to the 100 Club seen two thirds dressed up as though it was 1977.  Odd ones yes but never the majority.  LIke you I don't go very often now, probably once a year so it could have changed.

[Kevinkent]

Is that 2 or 3 or two thirds Win?  I've never in all the time I've gone to the 100 Club seen two thirds dressed up as though it was 1977.  Odd ones yes but never the majority.  LIke you I don't go very often now, probably once a year so it could have changed.

 

The occasional (was gonna say 'odd') one or two - it hasn't changed. And if it does, I ain't going if that Croasdel chappie is gonna wear a vest!

 

 - Kev  

Edited September 27, 2013 by KevinKent

[Gogger]

A Million is good viewing figures, but putting it in perspective "The History Of The Jews" on the same channel a few weeks ago got more viewers and there isn't a large exodus to Israel to my knowledge due to it, and looking at it from another angle, over 98% of the country didn't watch it. I still feel comfortable sleeping in my bed tonight knowing that my kids aren't rifling through my record collection. As I say, a good effort, but ain't gonna affect us much, though I do hope it gets a few more "bums on seats" for Elaine's film!! What I did notice the other day was all the northern instrumentals accompanying the "Mohammed Ali" documentary "Thumb A Ride", "Sliced Tomatoes", "The Champion" - Anyone else catch that?

 

Des

got the 2nd half to watch yet , was thinking mesen nice soundtrack

[Guest shakeypaton69]

its pissing me of already had a go at one on facebook for posting pics of sue showing her knickers and completely taking the piss out of her  its disgusting and out of order i personally thought the show great and they covered everything with great detail