What Gives A Soul Night Direction - Punters Or Promoters?

[Chalky]

Once,not too long ago,in a pub in the East Midlands,a man had a dream.The dream was that all like minded "small alternative" venues would joint together.A kind of soul community.

Memberships would rise from the ashes for all these venues.Each club promoting each other,through flyers ,or the web.Emailing members with dates/times/guest dj's. The memberships could be used at each venue,with a discount on the door.

But because that man was i,it never came to fruition,because i'm a slacker.

Maybe someone would like to ressurrect the idea.?

 

I've advocated this for a long time but I doubt promoters would take it up as ten quid is ten quid, p*ss head or not.

 

Russ mentioned tickets.  They will never work.  Have run ticket only in the past or both ticket and pay on the door and the uptake of tickets was practically non existent.  Whether it is because people don't want to buy in case of last minute postponement?  Don't have the money to spend ahead or what I don't know.

[Len]

I've advocated this for a long time but I doubt promoters would take it up as ten quid is ten quid, p*ss head or not.

 

Russ mentioned tickets.  They will never work.  Have run ticket only in the past or both ticket and pay on the door and the uptake of tickets was practically non existent.  Whether it is because people don't want to buy in case of last minute postponement?  Don't have the money to spend ahead or what I don't know.

 

Look at Darrow Fletcher at The Wilton - I don't think they sold hardly any tickets until the last week or two - Poor Boxy, I bet that in itself added so much more stress to one of the most stressful promoting stories I've ever heard! Point being, for a live act such as Darrow Fletcher you would have thought people would buy their tickets well in advance, not just because it's Darrow Fletcher, but this event also had the 'it will probably sell out' factor - It made no difference.

 

Organise yourselves people!     

 

Len  

Edited August 31, 2013 by LEN

[Julie Moore]

Look at Darrow Fletcher at The Wilton - I don't think they sold hardly any tickets until the last week or two - Poor Boxy, I bet that in itself added so much more stress to one of the most stressful promoting stories I've ever heard! Point being, for a live act such as Darrow Fletcher you would have thought people would buy their tickets well in advance, not just because it's Darrow Fletcher, but this event also had the 'it will probably sell out' factor - It made no difference.

 

Organise yourselves people!     

 

Len  

Got my ticket for `Debbie Taylor` @ The Wilton in Nov 

 

 

A very organised 

 

 

Ms Moore 

[Premium Stuff]

Great thread this - just gone over the 100 posts mark 

[Guest SteveJohnston]

Considering it was a one off soul night leading up to a weekender planed for next year it sure has provoked some interesting and thoughtful posts, I would say the direction of any club is at first the promotors when they decide the DJ line up, once the first night opens then over time the dance floor lets the DJ's know if its the right direction! IMO .

Steve J

[Steve S 60]

The promoters will initially sound out the punters to see if there is a demand for a particular music policy, or that would seem the common sense approach to me.  Not much point starting a new venue without the promise of some support.  So getting back to the original question "What Gives A Soul Night Direction - Punters Or Promoters?", I'd say both.  The promoter may have a clear idea of where he wants the night to go, but without the backing of the punters, he'll have a hard time getting there.  Ultimately it'll be a compromise.

[Chalky]

Punters decide a venues fate, its success or failure but they don't necessarily decide its direction, not initially. They might influence the direction if the promoter is influenced by such but if a promoter knows what he or she wants then that will have a bearing on the type of crowd they attract. If a set is well thought out with imagination with the right mix of lesser known or underplayed and oldies then there is no reason why any venue can't succeed.

[Len]

Punters decide a venues fate, its success or failure but they don't necessarily decide its direction, not initially. They might influence the direction if the promoter is influenced by such but if a promoter knows what he or she wants then that will have a bearing on the type of crowd they attract. If a set is well thought out with imagination with the right mix of lesser known or underplayed and oldies then there is no reason why any venue can't succeed.

 

Was just about to answer - "Yeh, 'fate' but, not 'direction' Chalky"......then the rest of what you put sank in - Slow down Len, other people do know what are talking about!

 

Well done, carry on    

 

......I've had a hard week, and it's me Birthday weekend, so I'll try to stay off here until Wednesday  

 

Len  

Edited August 31, 2013 by LEN

[Chalky]

Wednesday?

 

Happy birthday btw...sure I've told you already mind

Edited August 31, 2013 by chalky

[Len]

Wednesday?

 

Happy birthday btw...sure I've told you already mind

 

The Soul-source withdrawal Symptoms will kill me........maybe Tuesday then  

 

Have a good weekend guys (Wherever you go) and see some of you tonight at Stanwick for me Birthday Bash......Mmmm, I wonder what 'direction' I'll take the 'punters', maybe play a spot of Mid-tempo for a change.......No one can moan on my Birthday.......can they?!.......  

 

All the best,

 

Len  

 

P.s - ......Or Monday 'P.M'  

[Len]

Friday afternoon and all the bloody wekend - 'do you know whats on this weekend, who's on there, what time does it start, who's going'  Dont think people are too bothered to Book Ahead anymore. If you make it Ticket only other Events will use it as a pulling point " No Tickets Required "

Theoretically a good idea, practically ?

 

Right must go and iron me shirt after this 'corker'.........It's now 5.53pm Sat night, and I just got this text off me best mate (He normally comes with us to local nights)....."Hello Birthday Boy. What sort of time does The Duke Finish tonight. And what time you going......

 

.......I f*ckin' despair!.......how he organised my Stag night I'll never know......hang on he didn't - we were an hour and a half late!   

 

Laters.

 

Len  

[Guest Sylvia Dean]

This may not be appropriate on this thread .and its only a question !!! .. . But why have i gone from being a MINT MINUS .. Person.. When I orginally joined SS .. And around 5 or 6 years ago... to now being a BOOT ???? .

[Little-stevie]

This may not be appropriate on this thread .and its only a question !!! .. . But why have i gone from being a MINT MINUS .. Person.. When I orginally joined SS .. And around 5 or 6 years ago... to now being a BOOT ???? .

5 years is a long time.. Now you are an old boot  simples... x

 

A topic of interest indeed with many good points....

Edited August 31, 2013 by little-stevie

[Quinvy]

There's too much discussion on here about how Dj's can make a venue. Promoters who haven't got a clue are the biggest problem. The old cliche of, find a room, beg borrow or steal any old p.a., invite your mates to be Dj's and the faithful will turn up in their hundreds, is in the main absolutely true.

Anyone who wants to be a promoter should realise that people who travel great distances and pay their hard earned money, will expect a degree of professionalism. And most of all, they want to be entertained.

Another common promoter faux pa is not sticking to the original ethos of the event. Letting every man and his dog do a spot because he will bring his mates with him. Or worse, turning a blind eye to playing boots is par for the course in my experience.

Instead of trying to please everybody but actually pleasing no bugger, have some bollocks and stick to some principles.

In a nutshell, put some bloody effort into it.

[Premium Stuff]

Keep saying it but this is a great thread

 

Lots of really interesting and compelling comments - I find myself agreeing with very many of the points raised - event though some of those contradict each other 

 

Also, as far as SS threads go - it has yet to degenerate into slagging off, bitching, or general daftness ... 5, 4, 3, 2, 1 ... 

 

Keep it going I say ...

 

Richard

[Dean]

What a strange and very garbled interpretation of the soul scene that post is ? It makes the presumption that it was the old order ... Of dancers.. Versus what i will call (for the premise of putting in some sort of context)..the new order .. Who play rare and underplayed.. So therefore have their own percieved superiority who are taking the current soul scene .. And by way of playing underplayed and rare music in a dancehall setting . To another and enlightened direction .. . And that it does not matter one jot.. If the dancefloor is not full. ,,,,, Because .. ( in their eyes ) .. Thats not important ????? . So why do they want to play in a big venue ???

I here so many times by some of these (djs) ......... That ......"we will all be dancing to this rare tune soon".. And .......Because it is rare and underplayed .. It has to have credibility on the soul scene ... .. Not because it is danceable !!! . Which it often isnt ..

. And because many of these .( djs) .. Are not in many instances many have ........NEVER..... Ever ....

been dancers. ...... But are .... record collectors .!!!!!!!

The above article ... Again ... . Lumps all soulies together . By way of clothing . Quoting that .( and making another huge generalisation ).... That The top 500 soul tune people .all wear . ..... Big trousers etc... !!! .. Umm . Huge generalisations... I love dancing .. Love hearing challenging ..and danceable music ..new ( rare and underplayed ) ... interdispersed with old . Music that flows.. A mix to keep the floor filled at all times . But to suit all tastes.. Some djs get it very very right .. But please do not patronise or presume .. Or at very worst think they have superior knowledge . And that soulies do not ave discerning tastes .

Not sure if I'm responding correctly Sylvia as it's not clear what post you're referring to. If it's to the thread in general, I wasn't trying to interpret the soul scene. There's not enough therapists for that one.

Old order of dancers? Not sure about that? New order who play rare and underplayed, not sure about that too? I'm not generalising on age and experience, more on outlook, which I acknowledge is a fairly crass generalisation in itself.

Your point about venue is well made, which is part of the the discussion behind this question posed int he first post: "Is it possible to run a rare/underplayed night (whatever that conjours in your imagination) in a venue with a half-empy (at best) dancefloor?"

 

It's my opinion that many collectors /Djs have been or in some cases (god bless Joan) still are dancers. That's most people's roots in this scene, just at different times.

 

I don't lump all soulies together (if your comments refer to the post at the start of the thread), it's more about recognising the different tribes and interests attending soul nights. I do acknowledge making some assumtions though "There's a mixed crowd attending, and here I'm going to make some crass presumptions". Whilst there will always be exceptions I think there is a strong link between those wearing an NS uniform as identification and a greater appreciation of top 500 type oldies. And before you baggie wearing folk jump to your keyboards, of course there are exceptions, and there are those within that style group who have long impeccable history and credentials.

 

The night that sparked this discussion played many many great tunes, I could not find a complaint in me about the music played. The thread isn't about one night. It's a question as to whether rare/underplayed nights can sustain themselves in a dancehall venue, and the counter culture side of that discussion as to whether, because of the (my presumption) inevitable presssure to play to a floor, with the prominence (whilst not exclusive!) of a retro-clothed dance scene in strong number preferring to dance to top 500 type oldies, dancefloor venues will gravitate to an oldies playlist?

 

I think there's some good strong points made in the posts above about how an event is promoted, and the tenacity of promoters to stick to their intention. Look, nobody is going to go to Mick H's Up front Rare Nottingham Trentside day/nights and expect to hear top 500. Mick H is big enough (reputation and physical!) to not waver on that. Lifeline nighters  - you know what you were going to get, and other more up front soul nights/nighters (don't want to try and run through a list). But there's a host of soul nights out there that may struggle between intentions, attendance, and dance floor reactions. I think it can difficult to play less well known tunes, but bloody good tunes, to emptyish floors thinking / hoping that those not dancing are still enjoying the soul of the music. It then becomes too easy to put the same oldie on again and feel good for filling the floor, ignoring the vast wealth of really good quality soulful tunes that are buried in boxes whilst we drop and spin to the same tunes over and over again.

 

I wonder if this will make sense in the morning, just back from Goodies 50th birthday and a few beers at the John Cockle Mansfield, oldies central   

[Chalky]

There's too much discussion on here about how Dj's can make a venue. Promoters who haven't got a clue are the biggest problem. The old cliche of, find a room, beg borrow or steal any old p.a., invite your mates to be Dj's and the faithful will turn up in their hundreds, is in the main absolutely true.

Anyone who wants to be a promoter should realise that people who travel great distances and pay their hard earned money, will expect a degree of professionalism. And most of all, they want to be entertained.

Another common promoter faux pa is not sticking to the original ethos of the event. Letting every man and his dog do a spot because he will bring his mates with him. Or worse, turning a blind eye to playing boots is par for the course in my experience.

Instead of trying to please everybody but actually pleasing no bugger, have some bollocks and stick to some principles.

In a nutshell, put some bloody effort into it.

 

Spot on Phil.

[Len]

Spot on Phil.

 

and recognise your limitations, meaning not everyone wants to bother with 'silly' attention to detail....there are so many factors that make a huge difference to an event, that most people are blissfully unaware of (and rightly so) It starts from how a room is 'dressed' (Where the furniture is etc) I know some may laugh at that, but it's true (It's a 'Dynamics' thing), then there's the lighting, the flow of 'people traffic'.......I could go on for hours.....don't worry I won't.........I 'released' my full list on a thread on the very subject a while back - I really enjoyed doing so as well.....god I'm sad   

 

Len  

 

........Mmmmm, I wonder if anyone will notice that I didn't even wait until Monday, let alone Wednesday to post again......  

Edited September 1, 2013 by LEN

[Premium Stuff]

........Mmmmm, I wonder if anyone will notice that I didn't even wait until Monday, let alone Wednesday to post again......  

 

I did but you beat me to mentioning it 

[Julie Moore]

Still following with interest ............................Great thread