Wigan Blue Plaque

[Barry]

 ..here we go...

 

there's a FB crusade to have a Blue Heritage Plaque erected in the shopping centre above the old Wigan site.

 

I'm part of the group that's willing to chip in if it works out doable btw.

 

 

[Agentsmith]

fine....question is,...when it comes to impartiality, who's going to be asked to make any dedication?..or do you ask, russ, kev & richard to put aside differences for the sense of occasion and do it jointly?. sad fact about the catacombs dedication was, it only came about in the aftermath of the untimely death of it's principle dj, blue max, a pioneer who was revered by many other djs in the 70's...sad, because it should have happened many years before and he should have presided over it.

[Barry]

Thanks for not deriding the idea btw.

 

I think it's just a group of people wanting to commemorate a time in their life...don't know if I'd be bothered with any dedications.

[Mark S]

Why ? Apart from those of us that went it is of no relevance to anyone else I have fantastic memories of my time at the Casino dont need a bit of tin to reinforce that .

 

The Grand Arcade has the Casino Cafe and all the murals and stuff folks sit there slurping  their cappachino,s and munching on a pannini and dont give a hoot about what happened in the past .

[Agentsmith]

Why ? Apart from those of us that went it is of no relevance to anyone else I have fantastic memories of my time at the Casino dont need a bit of tin to reinforce that .

 

The Grand Arcade has the Casino Cafe and all the murals and stuff folks sit there slurping  their cappachino,s and munching on a pannini and dont give a hoot about what happened in the past .

that's a sad state of affairs mark, and no way to show proper respect, distant memories of the past stuffed away from daylight in some dingy refractory. but although it's long overdue and minus the element of council obligation to honour it's most famous landmark, a plaque IS symbolism in the face of indifference. of course, it's then a question as you would probably propose, of exactly how many soul folk would be remotely interested in viewing it, surprisingly, i think  quite a large contingent, and in particular younger generations who want to get their bearings..the fact that it will stand on the precise site should stir a few ghosts and raise the hairs on a few necks. next project: a museum...all artifacts and donations gratefully received...oh, and yes, that quite possibly could be done as well, if you've ever been to dundee natural history museum you'll know it's not just simply a notion.  

[dedji1955]

that's a sad state of affairs mark, and no way to show proper respect, distant memories of the past stuffed away from daylight in some dingy refractory. but although it's long overdue and minus the element of council obligation to honour it's most famous landmark, a plaque IS symbolism in the face of indifference. of course, it's then a question as you would probably propose, of exactly how many soul folk would be remotely interested in viewing it, surprisingly, i think  quite a large contingent, and in particular younger generations who want to get their bearings..the fact that it will stand on the precise site should stir a few ghosts and raise the hairs on a few necks. next project: a museum...all artifacts and donations gratefully received...oh, and yes, that quite possibly could be done as well, if you've ever been to dundee natural history museum you'll know it's not just simply a notion.  

Wigan has a new history museum and whilst there is a small area dedicated to the Casino nighters, there is no substance to it apart from a looped video and some of Dave Baron's fantastic paintings

The museum missed out and should of put more resources into it 

[Simon T]

I'M sure that  the Blue Plaque Scheme closed down earlier this year due to lack of funds

[Dave Rimmer]

f council obligation to honour it's most famous landmark,

Without a shdow of a doubt, the pier is Wigan's most famous landmark, followed by the old Central Park. Both of which have had far more visitors then The Casoino during it's allnighter period.

[Mark S]

Much as I love the Casino and the memories of it and freinds are precious to me that is its enduring legacy.

Sometimes we are guilty of over exagerating the importance of our scene in the grand scheme of things . Black music has had a profound influence on popular music of all genres yet rarely gets recognition so for the vast majority of people a small quirky part of the soul scene will hold very little interest .

I,m not against the idea just dont see the point 32 years after its closure .

Edited July 31, 2013 by Mark S

[Jez Jones]

https://music.telasource.netdna-cdn.com/monthly_02_2008/post-9046-1203269074_thumb.jpg

 

..I suspect it will be down to individuals to take this on themselves ...similar to the Torch plaque.....councils seem oblivious of popular culture and reluctant to fund anything that isn't universally known....

[dedji1955]

I'M sure that  the Blue Plaque Scheme closed down earlier this year due to lack of funds

I don't think so because their is work being done on an application to have one for The Twisted Wheel on the hotel that is being built on The Whitworth St site

[Tezza]

Really, A Plaque ?

The Casino was a part, yes an integral part but just a part of a wider already established 'Scene' that had arisen over the previous 5,6 - 10 years, however you choose to look at it. It is important in our field but as a Heritage Site ?  The Majority of the time The Casino as it became, was used for other things, or not used as the case may be.

Are we to have a Plaque at Samanthas in Sheffield which holds more and better memories than The Casino - for me ! Wakefield Unity Hall - 6 Months but what a 6 Months it was. Cleethorpes, Blackpool Mecca, Va Va's ... Its your own memory and it should be so. we shouldn't be foisting our own perceptions of importance onto this its got to be in perspective. We on the Soul Scene have a self absorbed blanket of importance that we wrap around ourselves but to some outsider we are considered the Clowns in the great Music Circus.  Perhaps we should just accept out station in life ( not Station Road ! ) and try to fall back to our nice little underground bunker that we used to frequent back then.

Long live the Memory of the Casino - we loved you but now you're gone.

[Agentsmith]

Without a shdow of a doubt, the pier is Wigan's most famous landmark, followed by the old Central Park. Both of which have had far more visitors then The Casoino during it's allnighter period.

well, young sir, bearing in mind you are a fully qualified lancastrian, i stand corrected!

[Agentsmith]

Really, A Plaque ?

The Casino was a part, yes an integral part but just a part of a wider already established 'Scene' that had arisen over the previous 5,6 - 10 years, however you choose to look at it. It is important in our field but as a Heritage Site ?  The Majority of the time The Casino as it became, was used for other things, or not used as the case may be.

Are we to have a Plaque at Samanthas in Sheffield which holds more and better memories than The Casino - for me ! Wakefield Unity Hall - 6 Months but what a 6 Months it was. Cleethorpes, Blackpool Mecca, Va Va's ... Its your own memory and it should be so. we shouldn't be foisting our own perceptions of importance onto this its got to be in perspective. We on the Soul Scene have a self absorbed blanket of importance that we wrap around ourselves but to some outsider we are considered the Clowns in the great Music Circus.  Perhaps we should just accept out station in life ( not Station Road ! ) and try to fall back to our nice little underground bunker that we used to frequent back then.

Long live the Memory of the Casino - we loved you but now you're gone.

to all intents and purposes, the bricks and mortar were long standing, victorian era...anything over 100 years old represents an artifact of interest, weather still standing or not, it's about it's history. like you say the building in station road had other usages,therefore it had a historically interesting background...it was part of the town's make-up and as it's latter days brought it fame and notoriety, so should it be recognized...even if long overdue. the catacombs was part of a complex, a victorian building with a cobblestone yard and whilst it may only have played a small part in the building's long history, it was significant for a lot of folk and not just soulies. wolverhampton eventually got the message, possibly because of it's city status, it decided to recognise it's heritage both past and present. of course, i stated the plaque came about because of the passing of its most famous dj, but that's not to say wolverhampton mbc weren't aware of this as max's family name were synonemous with the town, as it was from the 50's and the plaque stands on the exact site of the once hallowed venue. i think every site of historic value to the scene should have this bestowed on them as it's part of OUR history, yes, we have the memories, bu we can also visit these places now without feeling we're just standing on an empty street...and stare at a plaque??...yes, why not?...we have a right to.....they can't take that privilage away from us.

[Barry]

I don't think it should offend anyone...a little blue plaque up on a wall in a shopping centre...I mean really!?

 

It is just a group of people wanting to give a little nod of affection to a gaff that they frequented during the best years of their lives...that's all.

 

Someone on FB said no-one outside the scene would know what it was about or give a hoot - but I think it would be nice to have something that may get the odd kid to ask 'What's all that 'bout Mam?"

 

Plus there are hundreds of Blue Plaques up and down the country that I have no idea for whom they were erected...they are erected for the people who care alone I guess...and therefore in an adult world shouldn't be a problem.

[Agentsmith]

Without a shdow of a doubt, the pier is Wigan's most famous landmark, followed by the old Central Park. Both of which have had far more visitors then The Casoino during it's allnighter period.

just wondered, on your travels dave, you've probably been and seen the exhibit in dundee?

[TOAD]

How sad!the dumbing down of a underground scene

[Barry]

How sad!the dumbing down of a underground scene

 

How do you work that out?

 

Yesterday's scene and this one are chalk and cheese, not blood brothers, more like second cousins - it's yesterdays scene that is being talked about - not this one.

[TOAD]

Point one as I'm in a hurry.

THE LOCALs DIDN'T WANT US THERE!

[Barry]

Point one as I'm in a hurry.

THE LOCALs DIDN'T WANT US THERE!

 

[Barry]

I don't think it should offend anyone...a little blue plaque up on a wall in a shopping centre...I mean really!?

 

It is just a group of people wanting to give a little nod of affection to a gaff that they frequented during the best years of their lives...that's all.

 

[Tezza]

I don't think it should offend anyone...a little blue plaque up on a wall in a shopping centre...I mean really!?

 

It is just a group of people wanting to give a little nod of affection to a gaff that they frequented during the best years of their lives...that's all.

 

Someone on FB said no-one outside the scene would know what it was about or give a hoot - but I think it would be nice to have something that may get the odd kid to ask 'What's all that 'bout Mam?"

 

Plus there are hundreds of Blue Plaques up and down the country that I have no idea for whom they were erected...they are erected for the people who care alone I guess...and therefore in an adult world shouldn't be a problem.

Memorial Plaques are everywhere and I personally would have no problem with that but a Heritage Plaque - We are pouring a bucket of over importance on this.  To us, yes, but Heritage ? 

[Barry]

Memorial Plaques are everywhere and I personally would have no problem with that but a Heritage Plaque - We are pouring a bucket of over importance on this.  To us, yes, but Heritage ? 

 

Okay - not a Heritage plaque - my bad - I just used that term as an easy in so people would get what I was on about - it'll just be a blue plaque.

 

And you're right, people are 'pouring a bucket of over importance on this' - it's just a nice idea and shouldn't cause much fuss...

 

...but I knew it would.

[Guest Byrney]

 ..here we go...

 

there's a FB crusade to have a Blue Heritage Plaque erected in the shopping centre above the old Wigan site.

 

I'm part of the group that's willing to chip in if it works out doable btw.

Can't see any harm in it myself.

[Jerry Hipkiss]

Point one as I'm in a hurry.

THE LOCALs DIDN'T WANT US THERE!

 

Point one as I'm in a hurry.

THE LOCALs DIDN'T WANT US THERE!

Due to the start time, I'm pretty sure most of the locals never saw us! Hows about a blue(y) plaque at Sandbach Services? :-)

[Carty]

 I like the idea , actually surprised it has never been done before , As for heritage , yes it is very much a heritage site , no doubt in my mind about that , would also be willing to contribute .     No need for anyones name on it , London has these blue badges on every corner , Manchester has quite a few nowardays as well,                    Fairly certain that the site will be given some kind of official recognition in the future , how far in the future i would not like to say .   dont think this is attaching too much importance to the idea,    after all  many people(including myself)  are into local history and you know , it is only a plaque, and if nothing more will mark the spot for future generations of  a very colourful piece of the towns history.       

[Barry]

 I like the idea , actually surprised it has never been done before , As for heritage , yes it is very much a heritage site , no doubt in my mind about that , would also be willing to contribute .     No need for anyones name on it , London has these blue badges on every corner , Manchester has quite a few nowardays as well,                    Fairly certain that the site will be given some kind of official recognition in the future , how far in the future i would not like to say .   dont think this is attaching too much importance to the idea,    after all  many people(including myself)  are into local history and you know , it is only a plaque, and if nothing more will mark the spot for future generations of  a very colourful piece of the towns history.       

 

Well said.

[Back Street Blue]

Maybe the answer is to look at a new foundation, rather than the national heritage route, "The Soul Hall of Fame" foundation with the idea of putting a memorial plaque on all such sites rather than just Wigan?

 

Just an idea.......and I haven't had my medication yet ! 

[Tezza]

Maybe the answer is to look at a new foundation, rather than the national heritage route, "The Soul Hall of Fame" foundation with the idea of putting a memorial plaque on all such sites rather than just Wigan?

 

Just an idea.......and I haven't had my medication yet ! 

Your task, should you choose to accept it is ............ 

[Mark S]

Maybe the answer is to look at a new foundation, rather than the national heritage route, "The Soul Hall of Fame" foundation with the idea of putting a memorial plaque on all such sites rather than just Wigan?

 

Just an idea.......and I haven't had my medication yet ! 

 

Just had an epithany

 

To pay tribute to venues past as we are getting older day centres for old soulies , Sam and Kitty clubs bit like Derby and Joan with better sounds

[Back Street Blue]

centres for old soulies , Sam and Kitty clubs bit like Derby and Joan with better sounds

 

That's already happening every weekend.....sounds like most of the venues I go to   

[Barry]

That's already happening every weekend.....sounds like most of the venues I go to   

 

That's what happens when you aim your night exclusively at soulies

[Tezza]

 I like the idea , actually surprised it has never been done before , As for heritage , yes it is very much a heritage site , no doubt in my mind about that , would also be willing to contribute .     No need for anyones name on it , London has these blue badges on every corner , Manchester has quite a few nowardays as well,                    Fairly certain that the site will be given some kind of official recognition in the future , how far in the future i would not like to say .   dont think this is attaching too much importance to the idea,    after all  many people(including myself)  are into local history and you know , it is only a plaque, and if nothing more will mark the spot for future generations of  a very colourful piece of the towns history.       

 

Memorial Plaque yes, Heritage Site ?? It no longer exists, there is a Shopping Centre where it used to be.  You can't deem an area a Heritage site because something used to be there.  A Building is a Heritage Site - Paul McCartney was born here, The signing of the Magna Carter was performed here but a Heritage Site on the floor in a Shopping Centre ?? I live in Chesterfield and we are surrounded by Buildings that date back to the 1500's/1600's but we have no Heritage Plaques anywhere. They have meaning and Historical value but Heritage sites ?

Just because it is part of your Heritage doesn't make it a Heritage site.  I think we will find the Heritage is the stumbling block here.  Memorial Plaque - Go for it, gladly donate.

Northern Soul is not as important to the rest of the World as it is to us, we should remember that and embrace it.  It is ours and we should protect it from the profiteerers and exploitation brigade. Remember with fondness but don't put it on a pedestal to be a target for the unbelievers. 

[Back Street Blue]

Your task, should you choose to accept it is ............ 

 

I'd get involved if there was enough genuine interest.

[Carty]

Tezza, yes   ok concede the point about a heritage site ,  not sure about your last paragraph though,   you wrote :   "Northern soul is not as important to the rest of the world  as it is to us, we should remember that and embrace it . It is ours and we should protect it from the profiteerers and exploitation brigade .  Remember with fondness but dont put it on a pedestal to be a target  for the unbelievers ":  ?  not too sure what has been proposed would have this kind of effect.

[Phild]

Surely should be a "Bluey" Plaque

[Barry]

Surely should be a "Bluey" Plaque

 

Jerry Hipkiss

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Due to the start time, I'm pretty sure most of the locals never saw us! Hows about a blue(y) plaque at Sandbach Services? :-)

 

Edited July 31, 2013 by Barry

[Tezza]

Tezza, yes   ok concede the point about a heritage site ,  not sure about your last paragraph though,   you wrote :   "Northern soul is not as important to the rest of the world  as it is to us, we should remember that and embrace it . It is ours and we should protect it from the profiteerers and exploitation brigade .  Remember with fondness but dont put it on a pedestal to be a target  for the unbelievers ":  ?  not too sure what has been proposed would have this kind of effect.

 

I am possibly/probably in a minority whereby I am not bothered about Lording Up the Northern Soul Scene.  We, in the past, had to run the gauntlet of ridicule and were left in our underground clubs until it fell into the hands of the Money Men.  Anything that advertisers NS I look on with trepedation and fear that it will once again be placed high on the parapit to be shot at. Too old to be arsed to run that again. At the moment, Northern Soul is this years flavour but when its been sucked for a while and the taste becomes a little bland and the money been bled then what will become of it ? Cynical perhaps - no, definitely.

[Barry]

You see Tezza - I never gave a *hit what anyone has thought of it....or us for that matter...and I'm trying not to make this sound too worthy.

 

Yes we lived outside the normal boundaries when in 'nighter-mode', so why be worried about what anyone from them normal boundaries thinks of us now?

[Tezza]

You see Tezza - I never gave a *hit what anyone has thought of it....or us for that matter...and I'm trying not to make this sound too worthy.

 

Yes we lived outside the normal boundaries when in 'nighter-mode', so why be worried about what anyone from them normal boundaries thinks of us now?

I agree to an extent Barry. On its own it is a commendable thing ( apart from the Heritage thing Ha ha ! ) But possibly, to me , the wrong moment in time. Films and TV Programmes are rife with Soul references at the moment and even a couple of high profile ones which are set/based on the Northern Scene.  The BBC are just shooting a 1/2 Hr Prog for the Culture Show. It seems as though everywhere we turn it is NS. Last time this happened we had an influx of folk comimg along to gawp at the Baggy Trousers and Big Skirts jumping around.  Nearly destroyed us. I fear we are on the edge of another abbys and we may not be able to recover this time. But as I said, I am a cynic !

Memorial Plaque - go for it, I would gladly chip in but be discrete !!

[Tezza]

Perhaps I should leave it there. I don't want this to descend into a personal battle of wits. I understand the romance behind it and praise your passion and dedication.

[Mark S]

I think a discrete location for aforesaid plaque would in keeping with the ethos of Northern Soul be underground .

I,ll get me leather coat .

[Phild]

I think a discrete location for aforesaid plaque would in keeping with the ethos of Northern Soul be underground .

I,ll get me leather coat .

 

Yep underground and nowt on it that Joe Public can read. But those in the know, know what it says

[Mal C]

Never went, just a name of some old club to me to be honest.. If they want to out a blue plaque up, why not, there have been worst places they have put those things...

 

'it will still be alive in the hearts of those who went....'  as they say

 

M

[Guest Polyvelts]

Could the newsagents around the corner get a plaque for selling the biggest number of ice lollies at half five in the morning.

[John A]

How about a blue plaque for the Empress Hall? you lot weren't the first people to dance in that gaff

[Barry]

How about a blue plaque for the Empress Hall? you lot weren't the first people to dance in that gaff

the emp.PNG

 

[Mal C]

How would it read though... 

 

Wigan Casino Toilet

197odd - 1982

Lived here

I Came I conquered!

Then I slipped over...

[Barry]

How would it read though... 

 

Wigan Casino Toilet

197odd - 1982

Lived here

I Came I conquered!

Then I slipped over...

 

Gambling game in the bogs @ Wigan Casino

Two lads would inject an air bubble into their forearm and lads would bet against how far up their arm they would let it go before stopping it and forcing it back down - knowing that if it went over their shoulder it would go straight to their brain and Bob's Yer Uncle.....some scary shit went on in them bogs when you think back....

[Carty]

The less the English heritage blue plaque committee hears about that particular activity , the better.