What's The Rarest Soul Record, On A Ja Label?

[dthedrug]

HI ALL Since I was 15 years old (67) I have collected JA records, initially it was ROCK STEADY and from 68 it was the REGGAE that we loved, back in those days, many records from JA were copies of US SOUL or UK POP, The main thing was the REGGAE, that backed these songs.

In recent years (since the Internet) access to thousands of records on the TREASURE ISLE (JA) have come available,

In with many hundreds of records, we have made discoveries of JA SOUL also some unusual pressings with US SOUL, Last weekend I was speaking to my mentor & sage, he boasted that he had the rarest SOUL Record to come from? and I can assure you all, he does have the rarest of them all.

I will put into the RECORD CLUB PLAY OF THE DAY, HOWEVER what rare JA SOUL records have you got DAVE K

[TOAD]

w k cole i wonder why micron

[Sean Hampsey]

Reckon The W King Cole is far rarer on Rahtid than on Micron.

I sold my spare Micron for £20 last month.

Never had a sniff of a Rahtid copy.

Sean

[Pete S]

I don't think there is an answer to this question.

There are so many unknown Jamaican records that the rarest may not have even be discovered yet.

What about that Horace Faith record from 1962 I found about 2 months back and posted on here, I'm sure that was an unknown but it was fantastic.

I once did a cd compilation of Jamaican soul tracks from my 45's but didn't make a note of the tracks, I've still got the cd but don't know what half the records are!

[TOAD]

Reckon The W King Cole is far rarer on Rahtid than on Micron.

I sold my spare Micron for £20 last month.

Never had a sniff of a Rahtid copy.

Sean

thats interesting info dont know anything on that label

[Steve Edgar]

What about Lord Creator "Such Is Life" on Randy's? got one of those re-issues from Japan (and they seem hard to get now?)

But how hard is the original?

Steve

[Pete S]

thats interesting info dont know anything on that label

Label owned by "Dickie Wong" - I've never heard of him. Active 74-76 according to RKR

[Tsu Tomatoes]

thats interesting info dont know anything on that label

Gareth Donovan has a Rahtid copy. I seem to recall it's a multi coloured label, but I'm sure he'll confirm more details if he sees this thread.

[dthedrug]

HI ALL THE LORD CREATOR IS GOOD, & I want to show you this now,

As I was saying to MICK SMITH last weekend in Wolves, when i plated 3 of my JA SOUL,Their are some very rare records in JAM

MICK went on and isisted that he had the rarest and best soul record on a JA??

I ccould not help but gasp at the record that my Sage had, and I am telling you I 100% agree! do you???

with the greatest respect to all of us, this is why Mick is the #1 and what a find is #2 like my Moments LP track c/w GEAORGE SOULE - GET INVOLVED, I have yet to make the connection?

THIS SCAN comes to you via the guvner ME from Mick Smith DAVE N MICK

[Sean Hampsey]

Seen this for sale on eBay Dave, for about £75, which I thought was cheap.

Obviously pretty rare.

There was a copy in Sales on here a couple of years ago and I saw one in a box for sale a few years ago (think Ian Clark) but they dont show up too often.

Nice one.

Sean

[dthedrug]

HI ALL SEAN as Mick does not post, he gave me permission to do so on his behalf, as I feel it was to good not to mention, mind you when I tried to get him to list to my JA SOUL,NO CHANCE HERE ARE SOME SCANS OF 4 CURRENT JA SOUL 45s DAVE

BEST VERSION, AS IS JA CUT FOR JJBARRY SMITH

[Jordirip]

HI ALL THE LORD CREATOR IS GOOD, & I want to show you this now,

As I was saying to MICK SMITH last weekend in Wolves, when i plated 3 of my JA SOUL,Their are some very rare records in JAM

MICK went on and isisted that he had the rarest and best soul record on a JA??

I ccould not help but gasp at the record that my Sage had, and I am telling you I 100% agree! do you???

with the greatest respect to all of us, this is why Mick is the #1 and what a find is #2 like my Moments LP track c/w GEAORGE SOULE - GET INVOLVED, I have yet to make the connection?

THIS SCAN comes to you via the guvner ME from Mick Smith DAVE N MICK

I've got a nice copy of Sly, Slick and Wicked's - Sho Nuff / Ready for You on Jamaican Polydor. I'll try and scan it later.

Jordi

[Marc Forrest]

had the Roy Roberts on Jamaican Stateside which is quite scarce

amongst the rarest has to be that one (missprinted) title I played on solar radio three months ago though.

[Sean Hampsey]

Hi Dave,

What are the titles on the Barry Smith, White label?

All the best,

Sean

[Roburt]

Jimmy James' original WIRL Jamaican 45 recording isn't that rare ............

... well I don't think it is as I have 2 copies of the 45 myself.

[Pete S]

Jimmy James' original WIRL Jamaican 45 recording isn't that rare ............

... well I don't think it is as I have 2 copies of the 45 myself.

You're right, it sold by the shedload

[dthedrug]

You're right, it sold by the shed load

HI ALL....That's right PETE, but recent demand from people who are getting into the JA scene of JA SOUL have pushed the price up, the UK PYE VERSION is a good example of RARE V DEMAND,

The BARRY SMITH C/U is my fave JA SOUL RECORD, pointed out to me 20 years ago by the "BUSHDOCTOR" (IF i COULD GET MY HEAD AROUND HOW I RECORD IT SO YOU CAN HERE IT,) Some of you may no it, just me having fun, PETE may help out by recording it for me? if I see him O will give him a copy. DAVE

[45cellar]

Took me a while to find this one.

[Roburt]

Can't beat Jackie Opel for me ............... some of his JA / Bajan 45's must go for a pretty penny now.

[Roburt]

An earlier Jackie Opel effort at covering Sam Cooke .......

(he improved a lot after this & made some fine soul sides) ....

Edited November 29, 2012 by Roburt

[Pete S]

This is a great Jackie Opel soul track (sounds a bit off centre on this recording), the A side is better though (The Soul Boys - Rudie Get Wise)

[dthedrug]

HI ALL The Jackie Opel "Idon't want her" is a excellant example of JA SOUL, I'm no expert, but this record has it all, and it must be at the top end of must haves if you are going to invest in JA SOUL, value £100+ as it has 2 great sides, nice one PETE,

DAVE K

[Pete S]

THis is reggae not soul, but it's so soulful, if you know what I mean, two versions here

If there's a better early Reggae 45 than this I'm yet to hear it. One of the maybe three or four records from my old collection that I had to get back come hell or high water, I finally got it back last week, cost a pretty penny mind but it was well worth it. The song was originally a late doo-wop hit for The Pastels featuring Dee Irwin on vocals. Derrick's version obviously updates it by doubling the pace, but the call and male backing response of the title is still present and both versions are supremely soulful, plus there's an extremely catchy organ riff to spice up Derrick's version. All the time the chopping, "Sufferer" type rhythm is propelling the song along and I can honestly say that this is - in my opinion - one of the best 10 Jamaican records ever made, it's one of those you can play, put the neddle back on and play again, and do this again and again... I've put a link to both Derrick Harriott's version and also The Pastels original

[Roburt]

Most who have an interest in this subject will know the following ........ but for those still wanting to learn why some JA 45's are so rare ........

............ lifted from the Wiki entry on Lloyd Daley ......

Lloyd Daley built one of Jamaica most powerful vacuum tube amplifiers with forty KT88 output tubes in the late 1970s for the 'Jack Ruby High Power' sound system, owned by Lawrence Lindo (Jack Ruby). He also built KT88 Amplifiers for Joe Chin ('Unitone' sound system) and Ken Hamilton ('Duke Hamilton' sound system).

Finding it difficult to get hold of copies of records played by competing sound systems, he began recording his own at Federal Studios. His first 45 rpm singles came out in 1958, with some Jamaican R&Band early ska tunes made only for his own sound system. He had produced Roland Alphonso ("Bridgeview Shuffle"), Neville Esson, Owen Gray and Rico Rodriguez by the end of the decade, with relases appearing on his own Matador and Mystic labels. He released ska tunes in the early 1960s, with instrumental bands such as the 'Matadors All Stars', featuring most of the members of the later formed band The Skatalites in 1959-1960; or with the trumpeter Raymond Harper ("Heart & Soul" in 1962). Later releases were with rocksteady songs by The Overtakers for instance, always employing excellent session musicians.

In 1966 the police dismantled a part of his sound system, because they said it was disturbing the neighborhood, so he sold it. He moved his repair service and record shop in 1968 to 43 Waltham Park Road, which he bought and built, using it as a rehearsal facility and Recording Studio, and had success in the early reggae period on his Matador label with artists like Jackie Mittoo ("Dark of the Sun") or The Scorchers ("Ugly Man").

His biggest hit came out in 1969 with Little Roy and his rasta song "Bongo Nyah" which became a long-time Jamaican number one. He then produced other popular singles for artists like The Abyssinians ("Yim Mas Gan"), The Ethiopians ("Owe Me No Pay Me"), Dennis Brown ("Things In Life"), The Wailing Souls ("Gold Digger"), the first recordings of The Gladiators ("Freedom Train", "Rockaman Soul"), Alton Ellis ("Lord Deliver Us" another Jamaican hit), John Holt or The Paragons.

Avoiding the influence of American soul music (ever present through the rocksteady and early reggae era), Daley mostly produced original compositions, preferring religious (rasta) and socio-politicallyrics to love songs.

He also released many instrumental tunes with Johnnie Moore or Lloyd Charmers ("Zylon" was a 1969 hit) and dee-jay versions of his hits with artists like U-Roy ("Sound of the Wise" and "Scandal", both recorded in October 1969). In 1971, Daley released Little Roy's "Hard Fighter" version, recorded by The Hippy Boys, and named "Voo-doo". It was one of the first instrumental dubtunes where drum and the bass had a dominating role.

Most of Daley's productions have been released in the UK by Pama Records on its subsidiaries Crab and Gas, except in 1972, when he made a license deal with Trojan .........

A good (but pricey) book if you want to learn more ...........

.https://www.amazon.co...54867315&sr=1-1

.................. SEE EXTRACT BELOW ..............

Edited December 7, 2012 by Roburt

[Pete S]

Most who have an interest in this subject will know the following ........ but for those still wanting to learn why some JA 45's are so rare ........

............ lifted from the Wiki entry on Lloyd Daley ......

Lloyd Daley built one of Jamaica most powerful vacuum tube amplifiers with forty KT88 output tubes in the late 1970s for the 'Jack Ruby High Power' sound system, owned by Lawrence Lindo (Jack Ruby). He also built KT88 Amplifiers for Joe Chin ('Unitone' sound system) and Ken Hamilton ('Duke Hamilton' sound system).

Finding it difficult to get hold of copies of records played by competing sound systems, he began recording his own at Federal Studios. His first 45 rpm singles came out in 1958, with some Jamaican R&Band early ska tunes made only for his own sound system. He had produced Roland Alphonso ("Bridgeview Shuffle"), Neville Esson, Owen Gray and Rico Rodriguez by the end of the decade, with relases appearing on his own Matador and Mystic labels. He released ska tunes in the early 1960s, with instrumental bands such as the 'Matadors All Stars', featuring most of the members of the later formed band The Skatalites in 1959-1960; or with the trumpeter Raymond Harper ("Heart & Soul" in 1962). Later releases were with rocksteady songs by The Overtakers for instance, always employing excellent session musicians.

In 1966 the police dismantled a part of his sound system, because they said it was disturbing the neighborhood, so he sold it. He moved his repair service and record shop in 1968 to 43 Waltham Park Road, which he bought and built, using it as a rehearsal facility and Recording Studio, and had success in the early reggae period on his Matador label with artists like Jackie Mittoo ("Dark of the Sun") or The Scorchers ("Ugly Man").

His biggest hit came out in 1969 with Little Roy and his rasta song "Bongo Nyah" which became a long-time Jamaican number one. He then produced other popular singles for artists like The Abyssinians ("Yim Mas Gan"), The Ethiopians ("Owe Me No Pay Me"), Dennis Brown ("Things In Life"), The Wailing Souls ("Gold Digger"), the first recordings of The Gladiators ("Freedom Train", "Rockaman Soul"), Alton Ellis ("Lord Deliver Us" another Jamaican hit), John Holt or The Paragons.

Avoiding the influence of American soul music (ever present through the rocksteady and early reggae era), Daley mostly produced original compositions, preferring religious (rasta) and socio-politicallyrics to love songs.

He also released many instrumental tunes with Johnnie Moore or Lloyd Charmers ("Zylon" was a 1969 hit) and dee-jay versions of his hits with artists like U-Roy ("Sound of the Wise" and "Scandal", both recorded in October 1969). In 1971, Daley released Little Roy's "Hard Fighter" version, recorded by The Hippy Boys, and named "Voo-doo". It was one of the first instrumental dubtunes where drum and the bass had a dominating role.

Most of Daley's productions have been released in the UK by Pama Records on its subsidiaries Crab and Gas, except in 1972, when he made a license deal with Trojan .........

A good (but pricey) book if you want to learn more ...........

.https://www.amazon.co...54867315&sr=1-1

.................. SEE EXTRACT BELOW ..............

Which bit are you referring to in your original comment (about why records are rare), I can't see anything, am I just not looking hard enough?

[Roburt]

Which bit are you referring to in your original comment (about why records are rare), I can't see anything, am I just not looking hard enough?

Finding it difficult to get hold of copies of records played by competing sound systems, he began recording his own at Federal Studios. His first 45 rpm singles came out in 1958, with some Jamaican R&B and early ska tunes made only for his own sound system.

Pete, it ain't too obvious, you have to read between the lines a bit.

But, 45's made for other sound systems were only for their use (so obviously pressed up in limited quantities) ..... so he started cutting his own 45's, again made (in limited quantities) only for his own sound system.

....... OR .... am I reading too much into the bit about .... made only for their own sound systems

[TOAD]

but coxsone dodd was first along with duke ried

[Pete S]

Finding it difficult to get hold of copies of records played by competing sound systems, he began recording his own at Federal Studios. His first 45 rpm singles came out in 1958, with some Jamaican R&B and early ska tunes made only for his own sound system.

Pete, it ain't too obvious, you have to read between the lines a bit.

But, 45's made for other sound systems were only for their use (so obviously pressed up in limited quantities) ..... so he started cutting his own 45's, again made (in limited quantities) only for his own sound system.

....... OR .... am I reading too much into the bit about .... made only for their own sound systems

No the reason why they found it hard to get copies of records played by competing sound systems was because here we are talking about the late 50's when there was no Jamaican recording scene, everything played was by American artists on American labels, they were imported and covered up so that the other system operators couldn't find out what they were. The recording scene didn't really kick off until 58-59 and from what I have read, the big system operators like Duke Reid and Coxsone Dodd made records which they then promoted at their own gigs - so rather than covering them up, they wanted as many people to know what the records were as they could now be bought in the shops (played exclusively for a few weeks to get the demand going then issued). Real exclusive sound system tracks were few and far between until the late 60's and early 70's really. I don't know whether thats true about Lloyd Daley making records solely for sound system play, maybe for a few weeks as pre-releases but they couldn't afford to hire musicians and singers to record tunes exclusively for sound system play. Thats just my opinion, obviously

Edited December 7, 2012 by Pete S

[TOAD]

^ id go with that ^