Allnighters - Is There A Future?

[pikeys dog]

Have noticed a slight drop in attendances to nighters since theres been a higher number of Soul nights utilising 'Niter' DJs.

whats the difference joe between a soul night dj and a nighter dj ?

Davie

soul night djs tend to be local - niter djs tend to go further afield... i.m.o.

Theres Soul nights that book all of the current Niter DJs...

Events like Soul or Nothing, Groovey Grooves and Piercebridge have utilised DJs who I would consider to be established 'Niter' DJs

Soul Sam, Mick H, Andy Dyson, Mark Bicknell, Dean Anderson all spring to mind as being more commonly known as 'Niter DJs' but have had a fair few 'Soul Night' bookings recently.

Years ago you would have HAD to attend a niter to listen to the sounds that were getting played by these DJs

At the same time:

Ah but then you have to stay up all night and some of us are far to old for that Joe

Niter djs at Soul or Nothing? Paul Sadot and Karl Rhodes are probably considered by some to be niter djs but who else? We've not had any of the djs on your list on yet have we? Most the djs at SON are collectors in the main.

I can see a steady decline in Niters over the next few years for the following reasons:

Later licences mean that people are more likely to stay in a 'Soul night' that runs until 3.30+ than scooch off to the 'local' niter... especialy if the designated driver has taken advantage of the later bar times...

Attendees are getting older and many are 'crashing and burning' around the 5 o'clock point, so many will start to go to events that start earlier so that they get their moneys worth before bailing out at 4.30.

hmm there used to be a time not so long ago we used to travel up and down the country to hear certain DJ's spin and certain sound's, now people just dont have to travel anymore.... has taken a lot of the fun out of it for a lot of us, as for the few who still make the effort, myself included you don't always get to see the friends you used to, tis sad, but doubt there is anything you or I can do about it think this needs another thread to discuss this in

Edited January 18, 2006 by pikeys dog

[pikeys dog]

So what are your thoughts?

With the added pressure of dwindling attendances due to people leaving the scene through ill health/passing away,

Later licencing for bars so more flexble hours for Soul nights,

Promoters going up against each other at weekends.... 4 nighters one week, none the next...

Do you see there being a niter scene in 5, 10 or 15 years?

[Guest Baz]

Do you see there being a niter scene in 5, 10 or 15 years?

Five years, think there will be a steady run of nighters on, ten years doubt it very much! perhaps one every now and then.....fifteen years will there be a scene left at all by then

[Guest]

Five years, think there will be a steady run of nighters on, ten years doubt it very much! perhaps one every now and then.....fifteen years will there be a scene left at all by then

Not in it for the long haul then Baz....... lot`s of folk had the same pesisism(fukc knows how to spell it?)in the early 8ts,look were still here now......

[Guest Baz]

Not in it for the long haul then Baz....... lot`s of folk had the same pesisism(fukc knows how to spell it?)in the early 8ts,look were still here now......

Yeah but how many people are there at the right age, for there to be a scene, let alone an alnighter scene in 15 years time

[Guest 50box]

So what are your thoughts?

With the added pressure of dwindling attendances due to people leaving the scene through ill health/passing away,

Later licencing for bars so more flexble hours for Soul nights,

Promoters going up against each other at weekends.... 4 nighters one week, none the next...

Do you see there being a niter scene in 5, 10 or 15 years?

My thoughts are, If you like niters join me in my campaign by boycotting all soulnight discos.

No more niters then start DIY & gardening.

[Guest]

Still think there is a few years left in the niter scene reasons why

1 New up and comin djs

2 The shift in music policy used to be 2 rooms now its 3

3 There is youn blood comin onto the scene (slowly i admit but new faces appear)

I do think the days are numbered for some venues thou but quality will always shine through and people will always travel to here quality music

HB

[Guest]

Yeah but how many people are there at the right age, for there to be a scene, let alone an alnighter scene in 15 years time

What the fukc will i do then? i think there`s one born every minute anyway

[Guest]

So what are your thoughts?

Promoters going up against each other at weekends.... 4 nighters one week, none the next...

Do you see there being a niter scene in 5, 10 or 15 years?

To me thats the key, promotors going against each other or putting not much thought into what else is on on a particular night.

For me personally it's nighters untill I can no longer go, soul nights just don't do it for me and I would in the main rather stay in than go to one. I don't know why, its just the way it is for me.Hopefully the scene will stay even if not so many of the nights do.

[Guest Trevski]

Hope ther will still be 'niters. They still have that special atmophere for me, although it is not the same as being 15/16 and travelling to other parts of the country with older guys teaching you the 'ropes'. We used to be called apprentices then Never spoke for the first six months, 'til you learned a bit and could join in!

Ahh great days.. there was a real excitment and enthusiasm then! Still... would be sad to see 'niters demise.

Would never go to a 'soul nite' years ago. Niters or nowt! Nowadays, more soul nites than 'niters, but still love to go to some! Cant really 'get off yer tits' at soul nites!

Jo says she enjoys soul nites more these days. Get to see a lot of friends at soul nites that don't do niters anymore, get pissed, have a laugh. Niters still reflect the more 'serious' side of the scene perhaps?......

Edited January 18, 2006 by Trevski

[Guest]

Niters still reflect the more 'serious' side of the scene perhaps?......

Not the ones I go to or is that the people I go with

[Guest]

Niters still reflect the more 'serious' side of the scene perhaps?......

Not the ones I go to or is that the people I go with

[Guest Baz]

Not the ones I go to or is that the people I go with

I thought exactly the same

[Guest Soultown andy]

The next two years will tell,there is a decline in numbers but the quality well run venues will survive,and thats how it should be,at the moment far to many badly run events on imho obviously.

[Guest Trevski]

Not the ones I go to or is that the people I go with

I forgot to put "KarenC" not included!

Se you for a 'serious' chat on Friday

By serious, I meant that a lot of peple I know treat soul nights as a 'Just for fun' thing. They know they will get the same old oldies etc but the music is less important than the social side, and after a few jars they will dance to 'out on the floor' etc. ( I know some soul nites are more upfront but thats not my point) Niters on the other hand are more for the music, hearing quality new stuff etc. I don't mean they are not fun, just serve a different perpose for me, at least. Niters drive the scene, the soul nites feed off them.

Edited January 18, 2006 by Trevski

[Guest]

To me thats the key, promotors going against each other or putting not much thought into what else is on on a particular night.

For me personally it's nighters untill I can no longer go, soul nights just don't do it for me and I would in the main rather stay in than go to one. I don't know why, its just the way it is for me.Hopefully the scene will stay even if not so many of the nights do.

You said it yourself Karen WOT DO YOU KNOW YOUR OLNY A GIRL

HB

Spect that one will get me slap next time i see you (if i,m lucky)

[Guest]

You said it yourself Karen WOT DO YOU KNOW YOUR OLNY A GIRL

HB

Spect that one will get me slap next time i see you (if i,m lucky)

I think a kick in the shin is more than likely lucky for you it will be a while till I see you and I may have forgotten

[Mike B]

Allnighters at weekenders are great - not far to go to get to bed (unless you are staying on the site next door at Cleethorpes ) - I am definitely too old to do a nighter and then spend a few hours driving home unless its as a passenger who can go to sleep in the back

But I do like nighters particularly after about 3 am because there's loads of room on the dancefloor

Never been into extras to keep me awake all night but maybe the change in licensing laws will keep me going longer 'cos alcohol makes me hyper

Mike B

[Guest Dan]

i haven't been to a nighter for years, and the people i used to go with have long stopped too

shame because nothing beats the excitement of a nighter but the thing is for me i just can't stay awake

been more tired since we had kids but feel less able to do the things that might keep me awake since we had kids too

i like a good soul night three or four times a year but they vary tremendously in quality from 'top 500' oldies-driven rubbish to places where you hear lesser-played stuff and round by us (east mids) its tends to be te former rather than the latter.

so after all that, can't offer a useful opinion and am living up to my avatar again

[Mark Bicknell]

Due to work commitments, one or two other circumstances, family etc. i feel myself drawn less and less to the Allnight soul session, i still love playing a few tunes out and about and basically get asked to DJ at more soul nights than Allnighters, seems like the older we get the less we want to stay up all night, my question is this do we need the 'scene' to enjoy and embrace rare soul music? can you enjoy it, collect it, play it outside the venue situation? I seem to be enjoying the music more now than i've ever done, i still collect and will continue to do so, but i'm happy sometimes to take a six pack upstairs and play a few tunes on my own and yet still get the same buzz and glow as i get at a venue, i guess it's a music that we all like to share and that is perhaps why we all attend venues.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

At the same time:

[Chalky]

Still think there is a few years left in the niter scene reasons why

1 New up and comin djs

2 The shift in music policy used to be 2 rooms now its 3

3 There is youn blood comin onto the scene (slowly i admit but new faces appear)

I do think the days are numbered for some venues thou but quality will always shine through and people will always travel to here quality music

HB

1. I have to disagree slightly mate, not enough dj's coming through with "new" records. Who is there to fill the boots of Butch, Andy Dyson etc???? Most of the newer DJ's (whatever their age) have nothng new to offer, record wise, not for many anyway.

2. Why the need for three rooms? You are just splitting your crowd. Fair enough when it's say an R&B or modern, anything else is just diluting your main room. There is only a hardcore of say 300 or 400 that attend nighters on a regular basis and you only have to lok at the average age to realise that the scene is slowly dwindling with no where near enough young uns coming into it to sustain it long term. The young ones that are there, what happens when they say get married, have kids...career gets in the way, will they still be there?

3. as above, not enough young ones to sustain a nighter scene IMHO. Many not getting any younger and it only wants a reasonable quantity to leave at roughly the same time or over a short period of time and the nighter scene will struggle.

All IMHO

[Chalky]

The next two years will tell,there is a decline in numbers but the quality well run venues will survive,and thats how it should be,at the moment far to many badly run events on imho obviously.

gotta agree mate

Far to many venues, too little thought (no thought at times) as to the effect that one promotion will have on another. Too many promoters not getting their heads together locally!

Edited January 18, 2006 by chalky

[Mark Bicknell]

1. I have to disagree slightly mate, not enough dj's coming through with "new" records. Who is there to fill the boots of Butch, Andy Dyson etc???? Most of the newer DJ's (whatever their age) have nothng new to offer, record wise, not for many anyway.

2. Why the need for three rooms? You are just splitting your crowd. Fair enough when it's say an R&B or modern, anything else is just diluting your main room. There is only a hardcore of say 300 or 400 that attend nighters on a regular basis and you only have to lok at the average age to realise that the scene is slowly dwindling with no where near enough young uns coming into it to sustain it long term. The young ones that are there, what happens when they say get married, have kids...career gets in the way, will they still be there?

3. as above, not enough young ones to sustain a nighter scene IMHO. Many not getting any younger and it only wants a reasonable quantity to leave at roughly the same time or over a short period of time and the nighter scene will struggle.

All IMHO

Good points Chalky but i'll ask again if allnighters stop or struggle will this dilute the passion and interest in the music? I don't think it will personally.

Mark Bicknell.

[Guest Baz]

1. I have to disagree slightly mate, not enough dj's coming through with "new" records. Who is there to fill the boots of Butch, Andy Dyson etc???? Most of the newer DJ's (whatever their age) have nothng new to offer, record wise, not for many anyway.

How is any one ever going to fill the boots of Butch and Andy, Mick ect never going to happen in a million years! to even get hold of the 'contacts' well its never going to happen

[Gasher]

HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT GONIG TO A NIGHTER WHERE THEY DJ,S DONT PLAY ORIGINAL 45,S

IS IT ACCEPTABLE TO PAY £12 TO ENTER A VENUE AND LISTEN TO

BOOTLEGS/PRESSINGGS ETC?

NOT FOR ME IT ISNT..

AT AN ALL NIGHTER ID WANT SOME

PRE REQUISITES FOR MY BUCKS

1.A KNOWN QUALITY DJ LINE UP

2.A BAR

3.A PLACE TO HAVE A FAG

SURELY THE STAPLE DIET OF AN

ALL NIGHTER AND OF COURSE THE PISS SMELLING BOGS TO DO YOUR GEAR IN.

AND HOPEFULLY A NO NEDS POLICY

ALSO I HATE GOING TO A 1500 SIZE VENUE WHEN THERES ONLY 150 IN THE DOOR...

WHY CANT SOME PEOPLE SEE ITS JUST NOT ALL ABOUT THE MONEY.

GREED SEEMS TO BE A BIG MOTIVE NOWADAYS

Edited January 18, 2006 by the gasher

[Chalky]

How is any one ever going to fill the boots of Butch and Andy, Mick ect never going to happen in a million years! to even get hold of the 'contacts' well its never going to happen

my point exactly Baz.

[Chalky]

Good points Chalky but i'll ask again if allnighters stop or struggle will this dilute the passion and interest in the music? I don't think it will personally.

Mark Bicknell.

It won't dilute the passion or interest for me Mark, nothing will.

[Guest rachel]

not getting any younger

You mean getting old?

I agree, can see the number of nighters decreasing greatly in next few years - hopefully will be a good thing with the best remaining (though I guess that's a matter of taste). Ten years on I expect they'll be very few and far between... hopefully some of us who are young-ish now will keep something going but who knows...

As to the point about soul night/ nighter DJs, personally I'd like to be able to go to a 'local' soul night first, hear people who don't play at nighters playing stuff you won't hear at nighters, then onto somewhere else that didn't open till maybe midnight to hear the 'nighter DJs' (there are far too many 'nighters' in this sentence aren't there? ). And for them to finish later than 6am so some of us don't have to hang around train stations for hours. But I suspect I'm in a small minority...

[Guest Baz]

my point exactly Baz.

So what happens when they decide enough is enough? and want to retire

[Guest Dan]

Due to work commitments, one or two other circumstances, family etc. i feel myself drawn less and less to the Allnight soul session, i still love playing a few tunes out and about and basically get asked to DJ at more soul nights than Allnighters, seems like the older we get the less we want to stay up all night, my question is this do we need the 'scene' to enjoy and embrace rare soul music? can you enjoy it, collect it, play it outside the venue situation? I seem to be enjoying the music more now than i've ever done, i still collect and will continue to do so, but i'm happy sometimes to take a six pack upstairs and play a few tunes on my own and yet still get the same buzz and glow as i get at a venue, i guess it's a music that we all like to share and that is perhaps why we all attend venues.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

nail hit squarely on head for me mark.

for a four or five year period i did an allnighter every weekend if there was one going and sometimes two, plus all dayers (as did most people on here probably and for much longer, not trying to claim anything special here).

but i was young, i didn't have a problem enhancing my experience with a variety of dubious chemicals and i wasn't that career-minded. i didn't have a family, i didn't have a mortgage and i had fewer outside interests and pulls on my time.

now i look back and enjoy the memories but the fact i don't/can't do that any more doesn't alter my enjoyment of the music at all and it never has.

i (luckily) always carried on collecting and that was where my enjoyment was (and is).

the great, great thing is the internet and sites like this: someone like me, sitting in my village surrounded by farmers and badgers with not another soulie for 10 miles, can still hear new sounds, find out info and catch up on a few bits and bobs of gossip easier, and cheaper, than i could before.

so my theory is that we're living through the dawn of the age of the virtual all-nighter .

it's got its pros and cons but i like it.

now, anyone knocking any virtual gear out?

[Guest]

1. I have to disagree slightly mate, not enough dj's coming through with "new" records. Who is there to fill the boots of Butch, Andy Dyson etc???? Most of the newer DJ's (whatever their age) have nothng new to offer, record wise, not for many anyway.

2. Why the need for three rooms? You are just splitting your crowd. Fair enough when it's say an R&B or modern, anything else is just diluting your main room. There is only a hardcore of say 300 or 400 that attend nighters on a regular basis and you only have to lok at the average age to realise that the scene is slowly dwindling with no where near enough young uns coming into it to sustain it long term. The young ones that are there, what happens when they say get married, have kids...career gets in the way, will they still be there?

3. as above, not enough young ones to sustain a nighter scene IMHO. Many not getting any younger and it only wants a reasonable quantity to leave at roughly the same time or over a short period of time and the nighter scene will struggle.

All IMHO

i sort of agree with you as for the fact that the new younger DJs are not finding new tunes but there are playing tunes that are new to then that we may not have herd for a long time or even forgot about thats where i am comin from with this one and yes the three room room dose dilute the main room but it keeps the shite r&b out of it and yes your right about the younger eliment without us old bast###s they won,t be able to sustain a heathy alniter scene but hay it got you talkin

HB

[Chalky]

i sort of agree with you as for the fact that the new younger DJs are not finding new tunes but there are playing tunes that are new to then that we may not have herd for a long time or even forgot about thats where i am comin from with this one and yes the three room room dose dilute the main room but it keeps the shite r&b out of it and yes your right about the younger eliment without us old bast###s they won,t be able to sustain a heathy alniter scene but hay it got you talkin

HB

I wish more would play stuff we've forgotten or not heard for years but even when someone does there are fewer people prepared to listen or accept them

Edited January 18, 2006 by chalky

[Guest Baz]

I wish more would play stuff we've forgotten or not heard for years but even when someone does there are fewer people prepared to listen or accept them

Basicly what ever happens were shafted buy the sounds of it .........

[Guest]

I wish more would play stuff we've forgotten or not heard for years but even when someone does there are fewer people prepared to listen or accept them

True mate but we live in hope

HB

ps thats why you will enjoy heavenly blocked in sept openminded down here we are

[Chalky]

Basicly what ever happens were shafted buy the sounds of it .........

hope not. hope there's a good many years left in the scene yet and me

Edited January 18, 2006 by chalky

[Mark Bicknell]

nail hit squarely on head for me mark.

for a four or five year period i did an allnighter every weekend if there was one going and sometimes two, plus all dayers (as did most people on here probably and for much longer, not trying to claim anything special here).

but i was young, i didn't have a problem enhancing my experience with a variety of dubious chemicals and i wasn't that career-minded. i didn't have a family, i didn't have a mortgage and i had fewer outside interests and pulls on my time.

now i look back and enjoy the memories but the fact i don't/can't do that any more doesn't alter my enjoyment of the music at all and it never has.

i (luckily) always carried on collecting and that was where my enjoyment was (and is).

the great, great thing is the internet and sites like this: someone like me, sitting in my village surrounded by farmers and badgers with not another soulie for 10 miles, can still hear new sounds, find out info and catch up on a few bits and bobs of gossip easier, and cheaper, than i could before.

so my theory is that we're living through the dawn of the age of the virtual all-nighter .

it's got its pros and cons but i like it.

now, anyone knocking any virtual gear out?

Mark Bicknell.

[Chalky]

True mate but we live in hope

HB

ps thats why you will enjoy heavenly blocked in sept openminded down here we are

what I like to hear

[Guest rachel]

Basicly what ever happens were shafted buy the sounds of it .........

I'm just upset by the mention of 15 years time, you and me will be over 40 Baz

[Guest Baz]

I'm just upset by the mention of 15 years time, you and me will be over 40 Baz

Thats scary when you say it like that

[Guest Jim.]

I'm just upset by the mention of 15 years time, you and me will be over 40 Baz

Steady Rach, steady!

[Guest]

I'm just upset by the mention of 15 years time, you and me will be over 40 Baz

You poor young thing you how sad that you will 40

I,ll be 21

HB

[Mace]

I personally believe that the allnighters will on a whole go back to being more underground with attendance figures dropping to 150 - 300 max, more likely to be at the lower end of the scale.

One or 2 of the obvious big events may well continue being successful a few times a year, but I really believe the smaller nighters will become the main stay.

The music will have to merge more to accomodate lower numbers so shite R&B will get played alongside wishy washy Northern and disco bunny modern

Seriously though, this should allow more new tunes in all genres to break through.....as it used to do.

Soul nights attendance figures will probably stay healthier for a lot longer due to the reasons outlined in previous posts, but a lot of allnighters have basically become extended soul nights due to the mass attendance expecting the same tunes they hear week in week out at their local soul nights....and the dancefloor dictates on such occasions.

I think there is plenty of young DJs with plenty to offer, they may not be Butch et al by any standard, but they usually have limited exposure to play stuff they truly believe in, so time will tell.

As for their choice of tunes, all said and done, one mans meat, is another mans poison.......

[Sanquine]

Since I was 20 I have heard people bang on that there's only a few year's left in the scene. They believed when you got in your 30's, you'd be to old too dance, do all nighter's or venue's. The same with the collecting side of it. I never agreed with this, but it's been said many time's over, yet here we still are. Now were basically saying too old at 40 or 50 for niter's. Surely not.

Can't understand why the, too old, can't stay up all nite attitude. I've done the marriage, children, semi career, own business, thing, I'm in my 40's, I have no problem staying up all night and dancing (aided or not ).

Although agree certain soul nite's are on till 3am, still not the same feel as a niter has.

Karen

[Guest 50box]

You mean getting old?

I agree, can see the number of nighters decreasing greatly in next few years - hopefully will be a good thing with the best remaining (though I guess that's a matter of taste). Ten years on I expect they'll be very few and far between... hopefully some of us who are young-ish now will keep something going but who knows...

As to the point about soul night/ nighter DJs, personally I'd like to be able to go to a 'local' soul night first, hear people who don't play at nighters playing stuff you won't hear at nighters, then onto somewhere else that didn't open till maybe midnight to hear the 'nighter DJs' (there are far too many 'nighters' in this sentence aren't there? ). And for them to finish later than 6am so some of us don't have to hang around train stations for hours. But I suspect I'm in a small minority...

Nighters nighters nighters

[Pudsoul]

Nighters have a new dawn, a new age to look forward to. As our children grow old, and fly the coop, as our mortgages get paid and our jobs less important, as we enter old age, when everyone knows a person can survive on three hours sleep a night, a new scene will emerge, populated by grey haired and wrinkled but snappily dressed soul boys and girls, happily supplied by their local GP and shuffling madly till the rubber comes off the soles of their carpet slippers. The only downside I see is where to dispose of those unsitely colosotomy bags and dangerous wheelchair activity on the dancefloor?

[pikeys dog]

Nighters have a new dawn, a new age to look forward to. As our children grow old, and fly the coop, as our mortgages get paid and our jobs less important, as we enter old age, when everyone knows a person can survive on three hours sleep a night, a new scene will emerge, populated by grey haired and wrinkled but snappily dressed soul boys and girls, happily supplied by their local GP and shuffling madly till the rubber comes off the soles of their carpet slippers. The only downside I see is where to dispose of those unsitely colosotomy bags and dangerous wheelchair activity on the dancefloor?

Already happening isn't it?

Question is.... what happens when the returnees start 'fading away'?

[Simon T]

I was wondering how much it cost to run an allnighter?

Surely, (if numbers continue to decline) they come a time when you will need every one of the soulies out and about that evening in the country, through the door to make it viable?

Perhaps they’ll only be one, run by a billionaire who’s bought up all the records and is the sole DJ?

[Dave Moore]

Already happening isn't it?

Question is.... what happens when the returnees start 'fading away'?

Hopefully the prices of the records they "flap" to buy nowadays will recede to more realistic levels cos they can't sell 'em to each other any more. Then I step in and buy all the stuff I won't buy at the moment. Result.....

Returnees have had a few years reliving their drug fueled yoof. They're happy!

Record dealers have all retired to sunnier climes having made a fortune of the returnees. They're happy!

Styrene 45 (Wife), allows Dave to buy what ever he likes vinyl wise cos it's all peanuts now! She's happy!

Dave spends most of his time in his "Rekkid Cave" fawning over copies of stuff he knew he'd eventually have, but just had to wait it out a little longer. HE'S HAPPY!

Sounds like a plan to me Mate!!

Regards,

Dave - (Poised to pounce like a coil spring!)

https://www.hitsvillesoulclub.com

[Winnie :-)]

Already happening isn't it?

Question is.... what happens when the returnees start 'fading away'?

==========

We contact Wogan, and ask him to host the inaugural save the soulie telethon, with 'Pie-eyed' the bear as our mascot

What about, just as a suggestion, an Motown weekend combined with northern? I know we've all heard the motown catalogue, but the idea is to get younger people into the scene, would they not be more likely to identify with it? Then slip in northern, maybe a bit of a long process, cos they may have to have some tried and trusted first, but if they like that, then it can become progressive. Most of us came up via motown, maybe a similar route could be applied? Not sure if it's been tried already, but we all know to keep the scene going we need new blood. This way they'd have a grounding in style of music, and etiquette.

Winnie:-)

[Guest]

Yeah but how many people are there at the right age, for there to be a scene, let alone an alnighter scene in 15 years time

I hardly see any young-ish people get into northern soul at this point. I make my friends mixtapes/cd's and they'll love the music but won't "commit" to it. I was wondering, just how many on this forum for instance are in their twenties early thirties?