I Was An Inverted Soul Snob Knob

[Winnie :-)]

If i was gonna stretch the truth would try and make myself younger Len , maybe cool Stafford Goer or something, no never went unfortunately. I have to admit i got into the scene at arguably one of its worst periods spencer soul bags white socks and Muriel Day were the order of the day for me

I knew there had to be a reason for you playing that record at the bowl......................... :P

[Guest]

Well, 'inverted' snobbery is rife. On many occasions I've played records and some have asked about them.....then immediately lose interest when they find out it’s a 'cheapy' (Another phrase I hate) Same thing if I’ve ever covered up a cheap record - for the fun of it (I hasten to add!) — As soon as the ‘mystery’ is over the interest gets lost — It’s quite fascinating to see actually.

All the best,

Len

Hi Len Interesting comments and share your view so many good records that are still at the cheap end but forgotten by many djs and yes most soulies started off with many of the forgotten tracks but when are they played now not very often I understand to a degree that many dj's try and play what they class as there better plays often all very big tickets to buy - but how many would even consider playing cheaper end tracks its not going to happen very often - sure ill get hammered on this

[Jem Britttin]

I knew there had to be a reason for you playing that record at the bowl......................... :P

Believe me Winnie theres a lot more poor taste pop soul where that came from

[Winnie :-)]

Believe me Winnie theres a lot more poor taste pop soul where that came from

You play em, I'll dance to em

[Len]

Hi Len Interesting comments and share your view so many good records that are still at the cheap end but forgotten by many djs and yes most soulies started off with many of the forgotten tracks but when are they played now not very often I understand to a degree that many dj's try and play what they class as there better plays often all very big tickets to buy - but how many would even consider playing cheaper end tracks its not going to happen very often - sure ill get hammered on this

I do think it's getting a bit better now mind - We're all maturing!

All the best,

Len

[Len]

You play em, I'll dance to em

No one has ever said that to me....

Len

[Len]

I knew there had to be a reason for you playing that record at the bowl......................... :P

Mike, On behalf of Win, I can only apologise!

All the best,

Len

[Jem Britttin]

No one has ever said that to me....

Len

Well you wanna play some proper Norman Sole not that Motown rubbish

[Guest gordon russell]

Quite easy really check out my profile born 1963 cousin sneeked me into St Ives when i was 13 so late 76/77, remember a lot of lads were wearing those patchwork jean baggies then.

it,s just you speak of spending time in oldies rooms.....in 76 there probably was only one and that was mr m's

[Len]

Jem's one of the genuine ones Terry, no need to try and pull him apart because there's nothing to catch out. I've said this before because I like you both - You both have a lot in common and that's a compliment.

All the best,

Len

Edited October 25, 2012 by LEN

[Jem Britttin]

it,s just you speak of spending time in oldies rooms.....in 76 there probably was only one and that was mr m's

No defo one at St. Ives 76/77and the Melton Mowbray Alldayer I attended back then

[Len]

No defo one at St. Ives 76/77and the Melton Mowbray Alldayer I attended back then

B*llshit!

All the best,

Len

[Guest gordon russell]

Jem's one of the genuine ones Terry, no need to try and pull him apart because there's nothing to catch out. I've said this before because I like you both - You both have a lot in common and that's a compliment.

All the best,

Len

Hello len.....how long you been his dad lol.......not trying anything,but he does word things in such a way as to give the immpression that he was where he wern,t......none of which matters as we all live today and the past counts for not much really :D

[Greety]

I love collecting Rare Soul (in most cases rare being the operative word). But when I hear something like "Native New Yorker" or "Everythings Tuesday" I get just as much of a thrill.

It's not just a heavy dose of nostalgia, but appreciation of brilliant songs and productions, that rightly sold in millions.

And I'll bet most people on here are pretty much the same.

[Winnie :-)]

No one has ever said that to me....

Len

I practice cerebral dancing when you're on Len, it sort of goes ''stomp stomp, pause for thought, stomp slide, must check the label, shuffle shuffle, everybody's part of the matrix, relax'' repeat as necessary x

[Dave Moore]

Played these two in Frankie's last month. Great songs, great records sung by real singers:

https://youtu.be/P2uQyP-I2VI

https://youtu.be/dYTqTPmTZ0o

[Kegsy]

Played these two in Frankie's last month. Great songs, great records sung by real singers:

https://youtu.be/P2uQyP-I2VI

I see your collection is coming on leaps and bounds Dave, bit disappointed

they werent white demos tho.

I'll get me coat :thumbsup:

Kegsy

[Roger Williams]

I love collecting Rare Soul (in most cases rare being the operative word). But when I hear something like "Native New Yorker" or "Everythings Tuesday" I get just as much of a thrill.

It's not just a heavy dose of nostalgia, but appreciation of brilliant songs and productions, that rightly sold in millions.

And I'll bet most people on here are pretty much the same.

Of all the gigs I did last year playing mainly new releases on the modern scene, the most feedback on any one track I got was when I played Average White Band 'Queen Of My Soul', massive pop record at the time - I think that was the catalyst for me waking up as far as the music is concerned and made me realise how blinkered I'd become because of the scene and DJ'ing and the like.

All cured now, thankfully.

[Jem Britttin]

Hello len.....how long you been his dad lol.......not trying anything,but he does word things in such a way as to give the immpression that he was where he wern,t......none of which matters as we all live today and the past counts for not much really :D

Eh you lost me there, werent you doing your "plastic sandals funk thing circa 1977" Tez Fleet allnighter fletton had good oldies room as well heard Mr. Floods ..Real compared to what in there for first time...love it

[Geeselad]

When I started going to soul do's I became a right soul snob - I don't know why because I knew fcuk all about Northern Soul. Still don't! Anyway, when attending non soul do's which became less and less as my all niter career took off I used to react pretty badly to disco dj's who used to say "Now for a bit of northern" - and then play shit like Needle in a Hay Stack, some other rubbish like Diana Ross - you know the sort of crap. My snobbery also came to the fore when people would say "Mm, you're into Motown aren't you" etc.

As a result - and at my own loss, I discounted loads of good stuff over the years - because I thought it was Motown shit, or it was stuff like Band Of Gold, Freda Payne - which I thought was rubbish just because the disco DJ dare call it northern soul. "You wouldn't know a northern soul record if it poked you in the eye" I used to scoff. "Too rare for you to have any in your crappy box of pop records".

Obviously, I've learnt over the years how wrong I was - just a great big snob!

Anyone have any views?

Peter

Dont know if you count as the same age, or got into the scene at the same time, the 8ts, but motown seemed pretty unfashionable, imho, at that time, and I certaily dismissed mt as not as good as the real deal, ie proper northern. OK, 'suspicion' and 'come on back to me baby' were massive but there's loads of common, motown, wheel records that I didnt know and never ever heard in that era. Maybe it was to do with the focus on nighters at that time rather than the preponderance of soul night that seem to dominate nowdays. or I could be talkin shite again, lol.

[Len]

none of which matters as we all live today and the past counts for not much really :D

I used to say that to my History teacher - She wasn't impressed!

Anyway back 'on topic' - This 'Inverted Snobery' works towards 'rare soul' as well as away from it. I know of Oldies orientated folk listening to something I've put on tape to share with them, they have 'reported' back "f*ckin' sh*t"....Then a while later I've seen them playing the said record! - This is down to them not listening when I play it to them, but listening when the 'right' person (for them) plays it and to be perfectly honest, I understand it.

All the best,

Len

Edited October 25, 2012 by LEN

[Sutty]

You stop listening once you start DJ'ing, that's something else I sadly only released not that long ago.

You stop listening when you start to believe you're a DJ instead of someone who plays music out as a hobby, and it becomes more important to be DJing than listening. Something I realised a long time ago thankfully

Edited October 25, 2012 by Sutty

[Dave Moore]

I see your collection is coming on leaps and bounds Dave, bit disappointed

they werent white demos tho.

I'll get me coat :thumbsup:

Kegsy

He he! I'm trying to put a decent hotbox together with 'em so I can do a bit o' that there Deeeeejaaaying lark everyone puts so much store by. But then of course you're expected to lop yer lugs off and start pontificating to all and sundry about just how good records like that George Lemons that yer paid a grand for are!

He He! Here's another couple that got dusted off: First one created, produced and performed by one of the greatest rhythm sections to ever grace a studio and recorded at the one of the greatest studio set ups ever. The second one starts with Leon Huff's greatest hour in my opinion. There's a reason these records topped the charts eh....cos they're bleedin' fantastic!

https://youtu.be/ejrWHEsyS40

Regards,

Dave

[Len]

You stop listening when you start to believe you're a DJ instead of someone who plays music out as a hobby, and it becomes more important to be DJing than listening. Something I realised a long time ago thankfully

Good point, I expect that's how some D.J's lose their identity after getting a bit 'successful' - Pressure's on to please an' all that. Again, in their defence, I understand that.

All the best,

Len

Edited October 25, 2012 by LEN

[Guest gordon russell]

Eh you lost me there, werent you doing your "plastic sandals funk thing circa 1977" Tez Fleet allnighter fletton had good oldies room as well heard Mr. Floods ..Real compared to what in there for first time...love it

Can understand you getting lost.....but luckily l was never part of the funk thing cica 77......never went to the fleet (why would you?)

Edited October 25, 2012 by gordon russell

[Guest gordon russell]

they play all this great (what l call club soul) at stewartby along with the rest.........it,s 20-40 mins from kettering/rushden/wellingborough....give it a try

[Dave Moore]

I don't think I'd be happy to go to a Northern Soul gig that played all the commercially successful soul records. That's the whole point of having a Rare Soul scene surely, so you can hear stuff you can't play at home? But every now and then, still like to turn the old volume up loud at home, crack a few scoops and appreciate it for what it is.....great music.

Regards,

Dave

[Len]

they play all this great (what l call club soul) at stewartby along with the rest.........it,s 20-40 mins from kettering/rushden/wellingborough....give it a try

I have, and both Hammy and Pottsy have come to D.J 'round these parts' bringing their Bedfordshire 'Magic' along with them - Great sets every time.

I also went to The Fleet and I liked it at that time, although I must have only been twelve, so very impressionable!

All the best,

Len

[Roger Williams]

You stop listening when you start to believe you're a DJ instead of someone who plays music out as a hobby, and it becomes more important to be DJing than listening. Something I realised a long time ago thankfully

The expanded version of what I said, and meant, exactly.

[Len]

I don't think I'd be happy to go to a Northern Soul gig that played all the commercially successful soul records. That's the whole point of having a Rare Soul scene surely, so you can hear stuff you can't play at home? But every now and then, still like to turn the old volume up loud at home, crack a few scoops and appreciate it for what it is.....great music.

Regards,

Dave

Yes, but I think some have lost their way and 'playing rare for the sake of rare' just doesn't cut it with a lot of people. I personally like all good soul music played, I don't care how rare it is - Although I'd be lying if I didn't say I get an extra 'buzz' from rare records, that's the 'Magic' I've mentioned before.

All the best,

Len

Edited October 25, 2012 by LEN

[Dave Moore]

Yes, but I think some have lost their way and 'playing rare for the sake of rare' just doesn't cut it with a lot of people. I personally like all good soul music played, I don't care how rare it is - Although I'd be lying if I didn't say I get an extra 'buzz' from rare records, that's the 'Magic' I've mentioned before.

All the best,

Len

I would never frequent a gig that was "playing rare for the sake of rare" as you define rare either. I suppose our definition of 'Rare' differs. I don't care if there are 5 copies or 5000 copies, I don't care if a 45 cost 5 pounds or 5 thousand pounds. That's not my definition of the term 'Rare Soul'. To me it means music that you can't hear on radios, isn't played at the local disco, or just something that someone has found that's good and needs an airing to like minded people. Sure, many of them turn out to be hard to find, but so does a lot of pish too. It's still pish...just hard to find pish.

Regards,

Dave

[Len]

I would never frequent a gig that was "playing rare for the sake of rare" as you define rare either. I suppose our definition of 'Rare' differs. I don't care if there are 5 copies or 5000 copies, I don't care if a 45 cost 5 pounds or 5 thousand pounds. That's not my definition of the term 'Rare Soul'. To me it means music that you can't hear on radios, isn't played at the local disco, or just something that someone has found that's good and needs an airing to like minded people. Sure, many of them turn out to be hard to find, but so does a lot of pish too. It's still pish...just hard to find pish.

Regards,

Dave

I know what you mean Dave, I'm just trying to reiterate the subject - 'Soul Snobery' - I think I'm pretty much the same as you, I wouldn't want to go to one extreme or the other. I like 'rare' meaning 'rarely heard' and also like a smaller quantity of well known stuff put 'in the mix' - They sound brilliant together and I think people sometimes forget that, as the starter said - due to 'Soul Snobery'

All the best,

Len

Edited October 25, 2012 by LEN

[Dave Moore]

I know what you mean Dave, I'm just trying to reiterate the subject - 'Soul Snobery' - I think I'm pretty much the same as you, I wouldn't want to go to one extreme or the other. I like 'rare' meaning 'rarely heard' and also like a smaller quantity of well known stuff put 'in the mix' - They sound brilliant together and I think people sometimes forget that, as the starter said - due to 'Soul Snobery'

All the best,

Len

Yep,

Few Classic oldies

Few Underplayed oldies

Few Current plays

Few New To My Lugs Plays

Sounds like a plan to me Mate!

Regards,

Dave

[Len]

Yep,

Few Classic oldies

Few Underplayed oldies

Few Current plays

Few New To My Lugs Plays

Sounds like a plan to me Mate!

Regards,

Dave

Yup that's the one mate. It ain't Rocket Science, the clue's in the title - SOUL night!

All the best,

Len

[Peter99]

I have, and both Hammy and Pottsy have come to D.J 'round these parts' bringing their Bedfordshire 'Magic' along with them - Great sets every time.

I also went to The Fleet and I liked it at that time, although I must have only been twelve, so very impressionable!

All the best,

Len

Whenever I went to the Fleet - and it wasn't often, I was ill!

Went with those naughty boys from Boston, and a few from Skegness.

The last bus home the next day - the Grayscroft from skegness was like the Gravescroft. On me tod, dark and feeling like shit.

Peter

[Peter99]

Yep,

Few Classic oldies

Few Underplayed oldies

Few Current plays

Few New To My Lugs Plays

Sounds like a plan to me Mate!

Regards,

Dave

Wot, no modern?

[Scotters]

Yup that's the one mate. It ain't Rocket Science, the clue's in the title - SOUL night!

All the best,

Len

Believe me Winnie theres a lot more poor taste pop soul where that came from

Been busy at work today have we boys?!

Must admit I've been nothing but amazed / pleased / educated / frustrated / confused / blown away by the range of "SOUL" I've heard out and about since I started going out to more "Northern" nights this last few years. Certainly since I met you two + a good few other like minded people, and yes....I think I have seen some soul snobbery & soul knobbery out there for sure.

I personally love popular soul & dance records from the last 40 odd years as much as rarest of the rare. Brilliant when out and hear something that was maybe a big seller in its day played against something that only a lucky few own in terms of original 45 or LP (but won't open that can again!).

Have to say that I've never been guilty of closing my ears based on popularity or price, apart from maybe with some R&B sounds

[Steve L]

Yup that's the one mate. It ain't Rocket Science, the clue's in the title - SOUL night!

All the best,

Len

Not rocket science Len so why is it so hard to find a venue that plays that perfect mix?

One of life's great mysteries

[Winnie :-)]

Not rocket science Len so why is it so hard to find a venue that plays that perfect mix?

One of life's great mysteries

Maybe this will help Steve

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reaction_mass

[Steve L]

Thats a piece of cake to understand Winnie compared to some of the issues on the soul scene

I find particle physics more of a challenge myself

[Guest mellytee]

Not rocket science Len so why is it so hard to find a venue that plays that perfect mix?

One of life's great mysteries

I've found some!!!!!!!!! ............................But cant tell you on here

[Steve L]

I've found some!!!!!!!!! ............................But cant tell you on here

Cant you send it in code, have you got an enigma machine?

[Guest mellytee]

Rhymes with Books (Wigan accent)......

[Len]

Not rocket science Len so why is it so hard to find a venue that plays that perfect mix?

One of life's great mysteries

'Cause I stopped promoting in 2007 lol

Len

Edited October 26, 2012 by LEN

[Len]

Seriously though, promoters obviously have to make a venue pay, so they have to give what the 'market' wants and unfortunatelly (For some of us) nowadays that 'market' is mainley well known oldies. This is why some venues are now two room events, but then that goes from one extreme to the other in the same building and although I enjoy the smaller second rooms, I would much prefere if the Oldies 'side' listened so were more excepting of tunes fresh to their ears, then it could all be in the same room as it was through the 90's.....But don't hold ya breath....

All the best,

Len

Edited October 26, 2012 by LEN

[Kegsy]

I would much prefere if the Oldies 'side' listened so were more excepting of tunes fresh to their ears,

All the best,

Len

My local has a couple of Northern oldie CD's on the juke box.

Last night I deliberately tried a small litmus test of the regulars.

I Put on ;

Lee David Temptation

Little Richard I dont Want To Discuss It

Major Lance You Dont Want Me no More

Phillip Mithchell Free For All

Johnny Johnson Breaking down the walls

All uptempo feel good tunes of a similar ilk IMHO.

However I got the usual "whats this shit" banter from the regulars for the first four.

Then they all sat there and tapped feet and sang along with Johnny Johnson.

Go Figure !!!!!!

Kegsy

Edited October 26, 2012 by Kegsy

[Len]

....and I think that my last post is actually 'on topic'

Len

[Barry]

My local has a couple of Northern oldie CD's on the juke box.

Last night I deliberately tried a small litmus test of the regulars.

I Put on ;

Lee David Temptation

Little Richard I dont Want To Discuss It

Major Lance You Dont Want Me no More

Phillip Mithchell Free For All

Johnny Johnson Breaking down the walls

All uptempo feel good tunes of a similar ilk IMHO.

However I got the usual "whats this shit" banter from the regulars for the first four.

Then they all sat there and tapped feet and sang along with Johnny Johnson.

Go Figure !!!!!!

Kegsy

Lucky you Kegsy - the only boozer round here that had a half decent jukey with some Northern got rid of it ages ago.

[Kegsy]

Seriously though, promoters obviously have to make a venue pay, so they have to give what the 'market' wants and unfortunatelly (For some of us) nowadays that 'market' is mainley well known oldies. This is why some venues are now two room events, but then that goes from one extreme to the other in the same building and although I enjoy the smaller second rooms, I would much prefere if the Oldies 'side' listened so were more excepting of tunes fresh to their ears, then it could all be in the same room as it was through the 90's.....But don't hold ya breath....

All the best,

Len

This "oldies only" mentality has always puzzled me.

The essence of the scene I know and love has always been

finding and breaking new tunes, be they Northern/Modern/Crossover as

long as its soulful and can be danced to it'll do for me.

kegsy

[Len]

My local has a couple of Northern oldie CD's on the juke box.

Last night I deliberately tried a small litmus test of the regulars.

I Put on ;

Lee David Temptation

Little Richard I dont Want To Discuss It

Major Lance You Dont Want Me no More

Phillip Mithchell Free For All

Johnny Johnson Breaking down the walls

All uptempo feel good tunes of a similar ilk IMHO.

However I got the usual "whats this shit" banter from the regulars for the first four.

Then they all sat there and tapped feet and sang along with Johnny Johnson.

Go Figure !!!!!!

Kegsy

Yes, not sure if it's 'Soul Snobery' but defo the ussual 'not listening' until it suits them. I mean, with ref to a post I made on another thread where I explained a guy shouting "Why don't you f*ckin' play something we like!" while 'The Dynamics - I Need Your Love' was playing - Even if he didn't 'know' it, he simply couldn't have been listening and I'm sure every single one of you would agree.

All the best,

Len