Manship's Price Guide - 6Th Edition

[JimK]

I've just got hold of a copy of Manship's new Price Guide, the 6th Edition.

I'm told that the general release has been delayed by a few days due to a printers delivery glitch but will be sent out midweek - this next week.

My 5th edition has seen some action (can you believe it's been 4 years since that edition was printed!!) so it's nice to get my hands on a crisp and new price guide which looks both fresh and vibrant. The artwork on the front cover is similar in style to the 5th Edition but with a new array of rare Soul records to tempt you into locating.

There is around 70 or so extra pages yet it appears much more compact and portable than previous editions. Upon an anoraks measurement it is 1/2 inch less in depth (or 2.5cm if you're young enough to understand the metric system).

The pages feel like silk and shine like a brand new 45 and to be honest they feel just as tactile. The printer has obviously been told to spare no expense with the pages and it feels like a truly professional operation.

The scans of the original 45's (and also the repro's) are gone. Initially, I was disappointed with this as I had used these scans on numerous occasions to smoke out boots etc and felt this was a valuable resource. However, upon looking through the price guide, all of the information relating to matrix numbers, dead wax stamps and indicators of repro's is now located within the main listings pages. To be honest I suppose it's much easier than bookmarking the original page and trying to link this with the pics at the the end of the the book.

In summary, and in my mind, this edition is much more of a comprehensive guide than the 5th Edition. There is more detail and depth and, as far as I'm concerned, it is emerging as the truly definitive guide to rare Soul music and their prices.

Matrix numbers - listed, alternative takes - listed, vinyl or styrene press - listed. I'm enjoying this guide already and can safely pack the 5th Edition away safe in the knowledge that the 6th Edition moves us forward in the quest to discover, own and play that elusive but original rare Soul 45.

Quality.

Cheers, Jim

[Guest john s]

Glad it looks nice, how about the actual 'price guide' aspect?

Edited October 21, 2012 by john s

[JimK]

Well John, I only got hold of it yesterday night so that was just a brief review. I'll look at it in more depth over the next few days.

Jim

[paultp]

I have wondered whether I need a new price guide or not, Price guides are fairly inaccurate but do give an indication regarding the obtainability of a "newtoanignoramuslikeme" 45.

I thought the inclusion of bootleg information into a price guide is trying to do too much with one book, an indication that it has been booted (hasn't everything now?) is all thats needed. I'd really like to see a separate, well produced bootleg guide containing all the various matrix info and scans, to be used alongside the price guide.

I'd also like to see the price and bootleg guide as some sort of app I can put on my ipad rather than have to keep referring to a book (so 1970's!). Perhaps if you buy the book you could be entitled to the app? Can you imagine how good it would be to link the bootleg and price guides to ebay?

[John Reed]

I'd also like to see the price and bootleg guide as some sort of app I can put on my ipad rather than have to keep referring to a book (so 1970's!). Perhaps if you buy the book you could be entitled to the app? Can you imagine how good it would be to link the bootleg and price guides to ebay?

I think an electronic version would be very innovative, but could you get a way with charging people £30 for access to a web based database?

[Monkey]

Manny has talked about producing an iphone/ipad app in the past. You wouldn't need to charge £30 for the app to make it viable because you wouldn't have the big overheads for the print.

[Guest JimSLH]

Or even an Ebook would be good no need for an app then so get scanning jim and put this out for a download

[Spacehopper]

just recieved my new guide....quality of the pages is a big improvement,not worried about not having scans in the back as i have the last guide...but although there is bold type for the tunes that have been booted there is no information about what to look for for a lot of them?...so guess i'll have keep the old book too

[Dave Pinch]

the quality of the book is superb... as for bootlegs john maybe doing a more indepth version of the bootleg guide he did some years ago. taken at face value its gotta be very good. i`m trying to save the reading of it til my holidays but i have had a quick crafty look. i wish he`d change the value of tyrone thomas on polydor tho been £15 since the first ever book..never in the creation is this 45 £15 lol i suspect john hasnt had a copy in stock since the first guide was published probably why it hasnt gone up.. loads have changed tho some gone up ................some gone down

[bri pinch]

the quality of the book is superb... as for bootlegs john maybe doing a more indepth version of the bootleg guide he did some years ago. taken at face value its gotta be very good. i`m trying to save the reading of it til my holidays but i have had a quick crafty look. i wish he`d change the value of tyrone thomas on polydor tho been £15 since the first ever book..never in the creation is this 45 £15 lol i suspect john hasnt had a copy in stock since the first guide was published probably why it hasnt gone up.. loads have changed tho some gone up ................some gone down

there's will be hundreds of instances in the new guide, just like that one bro, but nevertheless, it will still be compulsive reading, can't wait till that gets back from thi trolls, so i can have a ganders

Edited October 30, 2012 by bri pinch

[John Reed]

For the first time, I bit the bullet and bought one. There are missing items where demos are included, but the harder to obtain issues, which sell for more aren’t. There are IMO both over priced & under priced records included in its pages. I think it’s an okay read, maybe the inclusion of more information such as matrix numbers would increase its value to me (not really bothered about pictures). I don’t think I’d buy one again. I do think it’s an ideal book to place in the downstairs toilet, to while away the time.

[Spacehopper]

this is why i was surprised...the last one had all the info you needed but if this was your first time buying one you are missing loads..there is some but maybe just the new info?...as for prices it is always only a guide and there will be some missing if john hasnt had them to sell i guess...

[Kev Cane]

the quality of the book is superb... as for bootlegs john maybe doing a more indepth version of the bootleg guide he did some years ago. taken at face value its gotta be very good. i`m trying to save the reading of it til my holidays but i have had a quick crafty look. i wish he`d change the value of tyrone thomas on polydor tho been £15 since the first ever book..never in the creation is this 45 £15 lol i suspect john hasnt had a copy in stock since the first guide was published probably why it hasnt gone up.. loads have changed tho some gone up ................some gone down

Same as Unlimited Four "True Love Is Hard To Find" on Chanson Dave, tell me where and how you can pick that up for £20

Kev

[John Reed]

or Tyree Davis for a ton..

[Ray Copley]

Personally don't think it's as good as previous editions ( Information wise ) - had mine a week now and I've got the old one on top of it as it seems to be alot easier to follow and carries much more info about boots and repo's, matrix details etc with I miss, plus I think the pictures did help as a referance !

As for values I think we all know that records are no longer fetching anything like this or any guide prices !

Don't think I would have bought if I had seen it first ! - Sorry John it's only my opinion for what it's worth !

[Spacehopper]

harrold jackson freedom riders is still only £20 in the book...i wish!!

although this gives me hope i might find one from a US dealer who only knows the book prices i suppose

Edited November 1, 2012 by spacehopper

[Denbo]

Upon an anoraks measurement it is 1/2 inch less in depth (or 2.5cm if you're young enough to understand the metric system).

1/2" is 13mm or 1.3cm Jim, not 2.5cm or 25mm which is 2 x 1/2" or 1".

You have been vetted. :lol:

[boba]

I'm confused, I understand it's thinner because the pages are thinner. Can anyone give some idea as to what percentage more listings there are? like are there 1.5 times the listings in the previous book, more, or less?

IMO picking out random underpriced or overpriced items is silly, as that will happen with any guide and the market is volatile.

[Steve Edgar]

I'm confused, I understand it's thinner because the pages are thinner. Can anyone give some idea as to what percentage more listings there are? like are there 1.5 times the listings in the previous book, more, or less?

IMO picking out random underpriced or overpriced items is silly, as that will happen with any guide and the market is volatile.

There's an extra 69 pages, so possibly another 3000 or so listings? but with the lack of additional lines of info you had within 5th editon, maybe less? (just a guess)

steve

[boba]

There's an extra 69 pages, so possibly another 3000 or so listings? but with the lack of additional lines of info you had within 5th editon, maybe less? (just a guess)

steve

so the numbers of listings per page is the same? what is the additional line of info that you're talking about, is that just for titles that have been bootlegged or are you talking about something else?

[Guest Gogs]

so the numbers of listings per page is the same? what is the additional line of info that you're talking about, is that just for titles that have been bootlegged or are you talking about something else?

Bob the 5th edition gave lots of info on bootlegs/re-issues within its pages and many had pictures to back the info up, But this latest edition really only tells you if an record has been boot-legged but offers little or no info. I'm glad that i still have my 5th edition to fall back on for the extra info needed to sort the wheat from the chaff. In fact i would recommend that anyboby not having the 5th edition should buy it before they even think about buying the 6th edition.

[Guest turntableterra]

It actually weighs almost 2.2 kg. thats heavey for any book. john had thought of adding the guide but it would have brought it over 2.5 kg. imagine the postage on that, 25 quid to here. the previous book can be used in conjunction as a bootleg guide. we may have been spoilt in that respect but the quality of the lovely glossed paper of a better gsm adds extra life to the pages. an app, a good idea, but some nerd would hack it and thousands would get it free..... why should they when 40 odd years of work has gone into them. im kinaestethic and tactile..........love the book

[boba]

I have the 5th edition, I know it has the bootleg information. For me, the main reason to buy a new book is not silky pages but new listings. That's what I'm trying to find out, how many (in terms of how many times of volume 5) new listings are there?

also, is there some shipping price break that happens between 2.2kg and 2.5kg? Thanks.

[Chalky]

How easy is it to set up a web page for a guide that members can access and amend, add to and build up a comprehensive online price guide?

[Dave Rimmer]

How easy is it to set up a web page for a guide that members can access and amend, add to and build up a comprehensive online price guide?

Technically, fairly easy these days. However, you would never get anyone to agree on the prices So in the real world impossible.

[TOAD]

r k r which is a larger book and listing than manships charges $25 for one year.

[Chalky]

Technically, fairly easy these days. However, you would never get anyone to agree on the prices So in the real world impossible.

Maybe not Dave but it can be amended. Maybe a link to the current price at the side?

It's not impossible IMO and it could work with enough like minded people.

Anyone got a link to some sort of software? I am willing to get this rolling of it is fairly easy to set up and maintain. I've a list I've not touched for a few years, 20000 plus entries I think, it would be a start.

[boba]

It's not that easy without custom software, unless you want it to be some totally open freeform text like a wiki. The closest thing which exists now is discogs.com, they have a huge code base and full time programmers. There are also members who are like roving nerds who question every entry added and create disincentives for anyone to enter info.

[Kev John]

I gave up on JM's price guide's year's ago imo over rated

atb

[boba]

I gave up on JM's price guide's year's ago imo over rated

atb

overrated by whom? that's like saying you gave up on wikipedia because there was incorrect information. I think if the book has a large amount of discographical information, and if it gives you at least some idea of relative prices, even if not totally accurate, and if it doesn't cost hundreds of dollars, it has some value. Of course it's not 100% accurate, the question is whether it's worth the cost of buying it. What made you determine that it was worthless to you or at least not worth the cost?

that said, I mainly only open up guide 5 for bootleg information, but I already have a large collection with most of the records I would want either a) in my collection b) already on my want list or c) "undiscovered" records that wouldn't be in the guide anyways. But getting burned on one bootleg pretty much equates to the cost of the guide so it's still worth the cost to me.

[Kev John]

overrated by whom? that's like saying you gave up on wikipedia because there was incorrect information. I think if the book has a large amount of discographical information, and if it gives you at least some idea of relative prices, even if not totally accurate, and if it doesn't cost hundreds of dollars, it has some value. Of course it's not 100% accurate, the question is whether it's worth the cost of buying it. What made you determine that it was worthless to you or at least not worth the cost?

that said, I mainly only open up guide 5 for bootleg information, but I already have a large collection with most of the records I would want either a) in my collection b) already on my want list or c) "undiscovered" records that wouldn't be in the guide anyways. But getting burned on one bootleg pretty much equates to the cost of the guide so it's still worth the cost to me.

boba

it's just imo no one else's

I go crate digging every week i do have a large collection

I just use my experience of looking

IF it don't look right i don't buy & if unsure i go to record dealers & friends i trust as they have been in the game since the 6ts

I have seen collectors going to fairs & shops with these books under there arms using them as a bible

YOU should only pay the price your happy with for a record

A lot of records in JM's books go for a lot less in real world upto 50% off or more on so called in demanders on rare soul scene for

M- ones

AS were in a global ressesion it's a buyers market not a sellers it won't last forever

[boba]

boba

it's just imo no one else's

I go crate digging every week i do have a large collection

I just use my experience of looking

IF it don't look right i don't buy & if unsure i go to record dealers & friends i trust as they have been in the game since the 6ts

I have seen collectors going to fairs & shops with these books under there arms using them as a bible

YOU should only pay the price your happy with for a record

A lot of records in JM's books go for a lot less in real world upto 50% off or more on so called in demanders on rare soul scene for

M- ones

AS were in a global ressesion it's a buyers market not a sellers it won't last forever

yes, I was asking what formed your opinion since you didn't give detail. Thanks for elaborating. I agree with pretty much everything you say.

I agree it is lame and a big negative that people use the guide as a bible and that it ends up setting the prices, even though it is supposedly a "guide". And it is mostly overpriced. But it still has some value to me, mainly as a bootleg guide, and even if you and your friends know all the prices it still has some value as another source of (relative) prices. Of course it might not be worth it for that to you. Also, if most of the items go for 50% less than the book (for example), you could just knock 50% off the price and use that as a guide. One of the reasons the book is interesting to me is if it contains a large amount of listings. I am not interested in the price of the in demanders or well known northern cuts, that information is easily available via various online and real life sources. I mainly collect oddball stuff so, for example, seeing if some obscure group has a second record and seeing how one dealer (Manship) values the two releases against each other would be interesting information to me.

[Jnixon]

record porn. simple

[Kris Holmes]

record porn. simple

how can it be record porn if there are no pictures?

[AlanB]

It actually weighs almost 2.2 kg. thats heavey for any book.

My postman's comment on it: "This is very heavy."

[Guest]

Back when JM introduced his new (current) website, I remember that mentioned here on soul-source that he was working on setting up an online service similar to the price guides, and this online service would include sound clips for a lot of tunes. That would have been a great improvement. On the old JM site, you could even hear sound clips of titles that had been sold in the past. On the new one, it’s only possible to hear stuff that is actually for sale.

He must have dropped the idea because it’s a good while since he mentioned this, but that could have been a nice service. But of course, youtube has become a serious competitor in this field.

Edited November 3, 2012 by Preben

[boba]

Back when JM introduced his new (current) website, I remember that mentioned here on soul-source that he was working on setting up an online service similar to the price guides, and this online service would include sound clips for a lot of tunes. That would have been a great improvement. On the old JM site, you could even hear sound clips of titles that had been sold in the past. On the new one, it’s only possible to hear stuff that is actually for sale.

He must have dropped the idea because it’s a good while since he mentioned this, but that could have been a nice service. But of course, youtube has become a serious competitor in this field.

it might not have been worth it with regard to cost for him, it wouldn't be a cheap custom thing to set up.

[Guest]

How easy is it to set up a web page for a guide that members can access and amend, add to and build up a comprehensive online price guide?

Would be the best way on the web ? but hard to get it to work imo - to ref true facts with updates from honest collectors/buyer/sellers etc that would and could be recognised as fact/s ?

Johns been around selling on the soul seen as long as I can remember and one of a couple of dealers that have had many of the listed in the books I find Johns book good but we all no the prices can and will be all over the place on some a great referance like the others

[soulsalmon]

Maybe not Dave but it can be amended. Maybe a link to the current price at the side?

It's not impossible IMO and it could work with enough like minded people.

Anyone got a link to some sort of software? I am willing to get this rolling of it is fairly easy to set up and maintain. I've a list I've not touched for a few years, 20000 plus entries I think, it would be a start.

go for it mate ,sure youll get a lot of help from members on here,fellow collectors et all,I for one would subscribe to such a service right away

[boba]

nobody has answered the question as to how many times more listings there are in vol 6 compared to vol 5. that's the main reason i'd consider buying it.

[Guest Nick Harrison]

It actually weighs almost 2.2 kg. thats heavey for any book. john had thought of adding the guide but it would have brought it over 2.5 kg. imagine the postage on that, 25 quid to here. the previous book can be used in conjunction as a bootleg guide.

And that is the clear reason why the bootleg section has been omitted from edition 6 - due to the extra increased paper material cost.

Interesting as the bootleg section contained within edition 5 is printed on gloss paper, well it's actually a cheaper glazed paper made from a clay or chalk pulp And your right - it has a slightly greater GSM (grains per square metre) held content.

A great saving will be made on this print run as the original reproduction costs will be very low as it will be all held on file already, and any new additions/titles are added as amendments to the origination. An extra cost for the cover and digital artwork revamp would be incurred.

Again a nice finished UV varnished cover as standard and it may be of a significance to the cost weather this production print run was sheet feed or web reel printed.

Was it printed in the Uk - Barry.

Thanks.

[Guest Nick Harrison]

nobody has answered the question as to how many times more listings there are in vol 6 compared to vol 5. that's the main reason i'd consider buying it.

Its difficult to estimate how many new additions/titles have been added to this newer more recent update. But when compared - edition 6 has 695 pages from A to Z and edition 5 has 628 pages. And the typeface and lettering is of the same size within each edition. If that's a gauge of greater measurement.

Maybe the author or one of the many acknowledged contributor's mentioned within its opening pages could help, as I see a few are members on here.

Thanks.

Edited November 4, 2012 by Nick Harrison

[boba]

ok, if there's about the same number of listings per page then that answers my question. thank you.

[Premium Stuff]

I think the info on John's website says how many more listins there are. You could try looking there.

Cheers

Richard

[Chalky]

record porn. simple

don't tell us your pages are stuck together already?

[Premium Stuff]

I think the info on John's website says how many more listins there are. You could try looking there.

Cheers

Richard

Bob - JM's website says this:

Vital Usa Soul 45 Referencing.

Is Printed In High Quality 90grm Gloss Paper.

This Guide Weighs 2.2kilos

Is A Reference Of That Data Compiled In Book Form

Has Held Data On All It's Vinyl Sales. This Guide

For The Last 15 Years John Manship Records

Website Receives Approx 15 Million Hits A Month

Values Are What We Would List Mint Copies To Sell

To Our Near 30,000 Customers From Our Website.

Fact Every Aspect Of Collecting Usa Release Rare

Soul And Related 45s Is Covered.

70s & 80s Soulful Dance, Boogie, Mod & Latin In

Artists, Titles Or Catagories Which Comprehensivel

Cover Northern Soul, Funk, Deep Soul,

Offers More Concise Information On Label Variation

Documenting

Approx 80,000 Titles

No Other 45 Rpm Record Guide In The World Today

Covering Approx

15,000 Different Artists

NB - the details on the previous guide #5 also claim 80,000 titles.

Here are the website links so you can check it out yourselves..

https://www.raresoulm...IPS_PRICE_GUIDE

https://www.raresoulm..._PRICE_GUIDE__5

Cheers

Richard

Edited November 4, 2012 by Premium Stuff

[boba]

ok thanks. that also is in line with what was posted above. thanks again.

[Kegsy]

It's not that easy without custom software, unless you want it to be some totally open freeform text like a wiki. The closest thing which exists now is discogs.com, they have a huge code base and full time programmers. There are also members who are like roving nerds who question every entry added and create disincentives for anyone to enter info.

I would have thought a very basic guide could be done using Excel.

Data could be sorted by artist,label,price.

The find function could be used instead of scrolling thru.

kegsy

[kevinsoulman]

I FOR ONE CANNOT WAIT TILL XMAS DAY FOR MINE ,THE OLD ONE IS WELL WORN,I ALSO USE HIS WEBSITE A HELL OF A LOT TOO,

I,M SURE WHEN HE USED TO BE ON HERE HE MENTIONED AN UPDATED BOOT /REISSUE GUIDE HOPEFULLY ITS IN THE PIPELINE.

HIS BOOKS ARE WHAT THEY ARE GUIDES PRICES ARE NOT SET IN STONE BY HIM .

I ONLY WISH I HAD HIS FORSIGHT YEARS AGO WHEN VISITING THE STATES IN THE ROYAL NAVY AND P---ING IT UP THE WALL AS IT WERE INSTEAD OF VINYL HUNTING

I FOR ONE WISH HIM ALL THE BEST AND WISH I COULD OPEN A 45 BOX NOW AND THEN JUST TO SEE WHAT DELIGHTS ARE INSIDE AND IM SURE IN SOME CASES OUT AND OUT RUBBISH.

KEV

[hullsoul]

Maybe not Dave but it can be amended. Maybe a link to the current price at the side?

It's not impossible IMO and it could work with enough like minded people.

Anyone got a link to some sort of software? I am willing to get this rolling of it is fairly easy to set up and maintain. I've a list I've not touched for a few years, 20000 plus entries I think, it would be a start.

Chalky

You don't need a definitive price?As people buy or sell there record they just look it up & add to what's already been sold,over time this will the trend of prices in the real world.So people will be able to work out what is a fair price from an individual record.It will also show what records are rising in price & ones falling.I think it's a great idea if it gets off the ground

Cheers

Martyn

Edited November 4, 2012 by hullsoul