Pete S Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 Nice one Pete,great example....... It's a "Rare and Northern Soul Forum", not a mainstream-chart-disco forum, so if people don't like mainstream-chart-disco records as much as Northern, don't be surprised! What do you lot think of Disco Tex & His Sexolettes, or The Hustle, or Andrea True Connection then, are they the epitome of sophistcated soul music made by geniuses as well?
Garethx Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 My honest answer would be any nine of the Philly singles and Thelma 112 from the other pile, if it was there. It doesn't matter how much the Thelma singles are worth, how many of them rise above being generic dross?
Pete S Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 My honest answer would be any nine of the Philly singles and Thelma 112 from the other pile, if it was there. It doesn't matter how much the Thelma singles are worth, how many of them rise above being generic dross? Now you really are pulling our legs Name a Philly single better than I'm Lonely or Peace Loving Man or Sweet Lies or Love Is The Only Solution for a start.
Modernsoulsucks Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 that a lot of PIR discs have been spun in the past and that successive generations of the northern soul scene have seen a place for them. I firmly believe there should continue to be a place for them
Garethx Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 For hard and fast soul The Brockington Singers "Stretch Out" on TSOP. For something slower Bobby Bennett "Days Go By" on PIR. They're not all pop singles, and weren't all in your local Woolies in 1975.
Pete S Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 For hard and fast soul The Brockington Singers "Stretch Out" on TSOP. For something slower Bobby Bennett "Days Go By" on PIR. They're not all pop singles, and weren't all in your local Woolies in 1975. Well obviously, they weren't released in the UK
Guest Baz Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 'Love Train' has just come on the radio.......i couldnt help but nearly fall of my chair
mischief Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 (edited) 'Love Train' has just come on the radio.......i couldnt help but nearly fall of my chair What did you get up to quick to dance Edited January 17, 2006 by mischief
Ernie Andrews Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 Come on Philly Int is disco, no more, no less dont get me wrong some of it is great but has no room in a Northern room IMO, I love music was played at the WIlton near the end, we got up and left. Join the W.O.D.D weapons of disco destruction, and free our souls of Disco Sorry Mate - Anthony White- "Never gonna let you get away from me " is not Disco(its a great 70s uptempo soul record) -Infact would you like to define disco? :angry: :angry:
Ernie Andrews Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 Ive just had athought- What year was disco defined? If 1976 then all philly records before that were not disco as the same to call a record released in 69 is a 70s record if you get what I mean HMMM!
Guest Baz Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 Infact would you like to define disco? :angry: :angry: I love music
Guest Baz Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 Taken from the Philadelphia stroy website These Jerry Butler records really set the scene for what was to come, i.e. the birth of the Philadelphia sound and the Philadelphia International record label: silk voices singing in high register, a tight rhythm section (the MFSB session musicians) and lush string arrangements. All these ingredients helped to define the soon-to-burst mid-'70s disco style.
Pete S Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 Ive just had athought- What year was disco defined? If 1976 then all philly records before that were not disco as the same to call a record released in 69 is a 70s record if you get what I mean HMMM! We used to go to discos in the early 70's and the music played there was called disco music, that includes all your old Motown and Atlantic records...
Guest pete salland Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 Alright, on my right I've got a pile of ten singles on Thelma, on my left I've got a pile of ten singles on Philly Int. Which one do you choose? If it's the one on the left, you are in the wrong place. The mainstream soul forum is elsewhere. my aunty thelma says take the ones on the right but she might be a bit biased.
Guest FYLDECOAST Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 We used to go to discos in the early 70's and the music played there was called disco music, that includes all your old Motown and Atlantic records... first club I went to was called "Disco 72" this would have been around 1972 I suppose Steve Mc
Supercorsa Posted January 17, 2006 Author Posted January 17, 2006 Who started this arguement? Anyway in my first post, I didn't state Northern venues. Admittedly they are the types of events I attend. Then again I see on the playlists for Ponds Forge last Friday that The O'Jays - Backstabbers was played. So by my reckoning Ponds Forge is a soul venue, or am I wrong? I'd rather listen to I Love Music than Dean Barlows monstrosity Third Window, anyday of the week. Then again as we have all said in the past, there's no accounting for taste, whether good or bad! Soul Music v Northern Soul = Same Meat, Different Gravy!
Guest Baz Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 MY FAVOURITE PHILLY!!!!! Always thought some of it was a little cheesey
Billy Freemantle Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 (edited) My honest answer would be any nine of the Philly singles and Thelma 112 from the other pile, if it was there. It doesn't matter how much the Thelma singles are worth, how many of them rise above being generic dross? I think you have given a really bad example, here, to support your argument, Gareth. Some of the Thelma singles really highhight the diffrerence between Detroit soul that makes it into the Northern category and wanabee Motown soundalikes that didn't make it in the charts. Did any Philly singers have the throaty relaxed delivery of Emanul Laskey? I'm listening to 'I'm a Peace Loving Man Man" right now. Can you name a Philly record that has such understated, almost matter-of-fact intensity? Gotta play it again! Edited January 17, 2006 by Billy Freemantle
Guest pete salland Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 MY FAVOURITE PHILLY!!!!! thats my chico!
Garethx Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 I will concede that some Thelma records are more than competant. A couple are fantastic, such as Peace Loving Man and Martha Starr's Love Is The Only Solution / I'm Lonely. I also really like Joe Matthews' Is It Worth It All as well, even though it may be considered generic dross in some quarters. My answer was hasty and slightly tongue in cheek, but I stick by my basic point. Pete's proposition was highly hypothetical. Unless he's got a time machine his pile of ten free Thelma singles is fairly likely to comprise all the mediocrities on the label. The likeliehood is that ten random Philly singles would yield a better afternoon's listening, for me at least.
Guest pete salland Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 Another favourite filly!!! the one on the rihgt is called thelma and the one on the left philli-pa.
Guest Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 MY FAVOURITE PHILLY!!!!! Put em` back in yer` cheese box,with the rest of your 45s
Simsy Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 Another favourite filly!!! Bit to zooafile for me . I Prefer blondes
Billy Freemantle Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 (edited) I will concede that some Thelma records are more than competant. A couple are fantastic, such as Peace Loving Man and Martha Starr's Love Is The Only Solution / I'm Lonely. I also really like Joe Matthews' Is It Worth It All as well, even though it may be considered generic dross in some quarters. My answer was hasty and slightly tongue in cheek, but I stick by my basic point. Pete's proposition was highly hypothetical. Unless he's got a time machine his pile of ten free Thelma singles is fairly likely to comprise all the mediocrities on the label. The likeliehood is that ten random Philly singles would yield a better afternoon's listening, for me at least. Yes, some of Thelma's product may be dross. But the point is that those that have been adopted by the rare soul scene are not - at least most of them are not. Would you not agree, too, that the good Thelma records - including the ones you have mentioned yourself - have a certain quality that lifts them out of the mainstream soul bag and is the reason why they were both commercial success yet Northern Soul smashes? Now, despite the artistry and the sometimes downright grandeur of many Philly releases, can you honestly say that they also have this special something? Edited January 17, 2006 by Billy Freemantle
Guest Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 BEST FILLET OF ALL. Yes,and they`re shit rare........
Guest Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 PeteS I love you in a reletively manly kind of way but you are so full of shit sometimes... ! The problem is with this thread is that minds have been locked up and there's no point really....
Guest Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 PeteS I love you in a reletively manly kind of way but you are so full of shit sometimes... ! The problem is with this thread is that minds have been locked up and there's no point really.... If Philly was disco music of the time when it was big in the charts, was Motown in the 60's when it was at its most prolific disco music of that time then? Cheers Paddy
Guest Baz Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 If Philly was disco music of the time when it was big in the charts, was Motown in the 60's when it was at its most prolific disco music of that time then? Cheers Paddy That and bad pop music alot of the time yes
pikeys dog Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 If Philly was disco music of the time when it was big in the charts, was Motown in the 60's when it was at its most prolific disco music of that time then? Cheers Paddy Yep, but then again you don't hear many 'Supremes', 'Rare Earth' or 'Jackson 5' tracks played at Northern dos either.
Guest Baz Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 Yep, but then again you don't hear many 'Supremes', 'Rare Earth' or 'Jackson 5' tracks played at Northern dos either. That depends what kind of 'northern' do's you attend joe
Pete S Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 PeteS I love you in a reletively manly kind of way but you are so full of shit sometimes... ! . I'll take that as a compliment
Guest Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 Come on Philly Int is disco, no more, no less dont get me wrong some of it is great but has no room in a Northern room IMO, I love music was played at the WIlton near the end, we got up and left. Join the W.O.D.D weapons of disco destruction, and free our souls of Disco They used to play "I love Music" at Clifton hall early 80's........Look beyond 1969 you Philistine....... see you In Stoke....i'll be carrying a cutlass.
pikeys dog Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 Must say though - Satisfaction Guaranteed by Harold Melvin and The Bluenotes is one of the greatest records ever made i.m.o. - Teddy P could belt it out somewhat....
Guest Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 Gotta say Baz, when i was a young un'...i didn't care for "Newies"....but with the "Passage Of Time"...i grew more fond of the 70's etc, and nowadays i find i like anything from the 60's, 70's and 80's (even current tunes)...as long as it sounds right.....don't be to blinkered mate......it may come back and carve an X on your forehead.... Take a leaf out of Pikeys book....seen the fine fellow play a couple of times recently.....mainly a solid 70's set....and very good to. Brett
Guest Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 Don't listen to the Baz, do not go over to the darkside, remember a W.O.DD is for life not just for soul sam
Pete S Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 They used to play "I love Music" at Clifton hall early 80's........Look beyond 1969 you Philistine....... see you In Stoke....i'll be carrying a cutlass. Well good for them playing a five year old top 10 chart record...
Guest Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 Well good for them playing a five year old top 10 chart record... Yeah...Good Days......not certain they played any Childrens TV Theme tunes though..... Yeah.....Good Days.......
Guest Baz Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 Don't listen to the Baz, do not go over to the darkside, remember a W.O.DD is for life not just for soul sam Never fear i shall not secome to there Dark and mysterious ways No i do like all manner of soul genres Brett, but come on you must admit alot of the Philly stuff is disco
Pete S Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 Yeah...Good Days......not certain they played any Childrens TV Theme tunes though..... Yeah.....Good Days....... Shame, they would have probably gone down well there
Mark Bicknell Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 Eddie Hill - You Got The Best Of Me - Thelma, Robert Ward - Cry Me A River - Thelma, Jimmy Gilford - Nobody Loves Me Like My Baby - Thelma, Emanuel Lasky - I Got To Run For My Life - Thelma etc. etc. generic dross? I have no comment or personal opinion on Philadelphia International to be honest but if you are gonna site Thelma as generic dross, Motown sound-a-likes etc. then add Ric -Tic, Golden World, Arctic, Okeh etc. and a thousand other labels into the mix. Regards - Mark Bicknell.
Guest Rowly Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 McFadden & Whitehead ? Ain't No Stoppin us Now??? Ohh! Suits You Sir!!! Marvelous!! Isn't It? Mmm!!
SteveM Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 Just read quickly through this thread and found it quite interesting. Seems like a few people want someone to kick a la fosland (not saying he didn't deserve it), but it seems that the reason some Phil. int records, not the disco ones, are not seen as acceptable, is simply that they were successful. Like it or not, ' I Love Music' was a huge record at Northern Soul allnighters. So why isn't it NS. If Jerry Fuller 'I Get Carried Away' can be classed as Northern, why not PI output, which certainly has more relevance to black music. And Pete, Jerry Fuller is NOT a beat ballad
Steveh73 Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 I know its said above but this thread really does highlight the northern scene's obsession with rarity over quality. Who cares if some Philly releases were played in seventies youth clubs? Who cares if some of their releases were popular in the discos of the time? Does it really matter? Gamble and Huff, in my opinion at least, pulled off the rare trick of producing a sound that was commercially successful AND credibly soulful - the two don't have to be mutually exclusive. If you enjoy seventies soul and you're not hung up on rarity or any of that cobblers, then there are loads of great sounds waiting for you on the Philadelphia International label/s. Its probably best that the northern scene ignores this sound anyway, look what happened to the price of Party Time Man once it was 'discovered'.Do you really want that to happen to Bad Luck or The More I Get?! Cheers Steve.
Pete S Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 In hindsight then, maybe this Philly stuff is acceptable, despite it being chart fodder and top of the pops material which 30 years ago you would have all disowned and slagged off anyone who liked it. In context: pleasant soul music, in northern soul context, waste of good vinyl
Simsy Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 McFadden & Whitehead ? Ain't No Stoppin us Now??? Ohh! Suits You Sir!!! Marvelous!! Isn't It? Mmm!!
Pete S Posted January 17, 2006 Posted January 17, 2006 Just read quickly through this thread and found it quite interesting. Seems like a few people want someone to kick a la fosland (not saying he didn't deserve it), but it seems that the reason some Phil. int records, not the disco ones, are not seen as acceptable, is simply that they were successful. Like it or not, ' I Love Music' was a huge record at Northern Soul allnighters. So why isn't it NS. If Jerry Fuller 'I Get Carried Away' can be classed as Northern, why not PI output, which certainly has more relevance to black music. And Pete, Jerry Fuller is NOT a beat ballad Don't get that last comment but...it is a beat ballad
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