Original Vinyl Only Do..not Quite

[Dave Rimmer]

This particular night wasn't an ovo advertised night, so what does it matter who they are,

like I say it is what it is, why do you keep pushing?

Like you say, what does it matter, if you name them.

I keep pushing because nobody has actually named one of these big name DJs, just alluded to knowing about it.

You see, I'm a simple man, I don't understand what all this smoke and mirrors is about. if you know someone uses a laptop, what's the problem with naming tham. I haven't said I am crticial of them, (In fact given certain circumstances I'd fully support the idea), I just want to know who the 'Big name' DJs are that are using laptops. Why is that a problem to you ?

[Chris L]

went to a local soul/northern do at weekend,place packed dancefloor full most of night,everybody enjoying themselves still full hour after last record,but heres the catch,wasnt actually records???? all done on laptop behind [what would be record decks],podium flat screen showing photos soul images ect,apart from no actual vynil all very proffessional....so why am i still bemused by it and scratching my head at the thought of it,weddings mobile djs yes..but are laptops ok for local do,s?????are there any more such venues out there..

"Origonal vynil" would that be anything like "Original Vinyl" ?

[Jumpinjoan]

...do ya guys actually remember traveling to a venue to hear tracks you could rarely hear anywhere else and the excitement of dancing to them as well as the tingeling feeling of knowing that you belong to a rather ''secret'' and very special scene'' ???

Of course, but those days are long gone. The scene has been going a long time, there are a lot of knowledgeable people out there, there just aren't the amount of unknown records anymore and like it or not there are a lot of DJs with the same records (good records for sure, but the same none the less)

Edited October 16, 2012 by jumpinjoan

[Guest Phil Armstrong]

I do know that the camera often shows a different colour to the record as i have been accussed in a nice way of playing a salvadors second issue but i can assure you its not, i will have Mick Smiths balls if it is

No probs, lens cleaner on shopping list

[Pete S]

Well ...

I like OVO ....

But I also like mp3s ...

But which is best?

I've been mulling this over for a few days and I have decided that I totally rely on iTunes and mp3's nowadays. I sold all of my CD's, because I'd turned them into mp3's and put them in itunes. I have recorded all of my records, as mp3's, and now they are in itunes. So I now going to sell all of my own records, my personal collection that I've had for 30 years or more, because I've got no use for them anymore. So look out, there's going to be a few hundred more bootlegs on the market soon

of course this has nothing to do with OVO vs laptop, but I don't care anymore, I'd just like to see people enjoying themselves while they still can

[Dekka]

Like you say, what does it matter, if you name them.

I keep pushing because nobody has actually named one of these big name DJs, just alluded to knowing about it.

You see, I'm a simple man, I don't understand what all this smoke and mirrors is about. if you know someone uses a laptop, what's the problem with naming tham. I haven't said I am crticial of them, (In fact given certain circumstances I'd fully support the idea), I just want to know who the 'Big name' DJs are that are using laptops. Why is that a problem to you ?

Go on Goldsoul - Long Eaton Soul nights 2010 - gallery-image 65

Mr kev Roberts with a lap top, so now thats 3 'big names' been identified

Do you want me to do some backflips while i'm at it, it wasn't hard to research with the information I gave you

or is it that, you daren't name people?

But as I said in relation to the post from Harry, it wasn't advertised as ovo, 'bigname dj's are using laptops (I didn't say exclusively)

and it is what it is, satisfied now

[Pete S]

but surely the scene in 66/69 only had ovo?....were there bootleggers then? certainly werent cds and too early for reissues....

No you had constant reissuing of records on labels like Sue, London, Action, Tamla Motown, Stateside. The Fascinations for instance was issued on Stateside, deleted after 3 months, then issued again 18 months later on Sue!

[Pete S]

Re-issues were starting to make an appearance back then (from 68 onwards).

As soon as the Soul City label had kicked off & they had a hit with the Gene chandler 45, most labels started putting out reissues -- Motown, Stateside, Atlantic, London, President and more.

Soul City record shop (which we bought from by mail order) started out in 66 and DG started the record label in 68

No one then turned up their noses at a Soul City 45 being played (it didn't even occur to us that having the 'original' UK or US issue was much better than having the Soul City version).

Getting US 45's was very difficult but you had to go that way if the UK 45 had been deleted and the track was in big demand, but the routes / systems by which you got US 45's were far from straightforward,

I seem to recall EMI importing French copies of Bunny Sigler to sell thru main street record shops to meet the demand here as we didn't have the means to source such 45's ourselves.

PLUS ... don't forget that many back then liked soul purely coz it was the 'in music' at that time. They attended clubs like the Mojo / Wheel coz they were the places to be 'seen'.

By 1970, many had moved onto UK blues / rock groups (the likes of Jimi Hendrix coming over here & hitting big sparked a big change in the scene) and lots were starting to refer to 'our music' as Tamla-Toytown and were slagging it off all the time.

I posted a reply similar to this now without getting as far as this post so my apologies.

[Spacehopper]

yeah youre right ofcourse!..im not an expert on british stuff but thinkin about it can think of a few.....although still not the same as the boots etc in the 70s and all the new ones on ebay nowadays...im thinkin they were all legal and top quality recordings from legit masters?

[Pete S]

yeah youre right ofcourse!..im not an expert on british stuff but thinkin about it can think of a few.....although still not the same as the boots etc in the 70s and all the new ones on ebay nowadays...im thinkin they were all legal and top quality recordings from legit masters?

Most were but I'm sure a lot of Sue releases were dubbed off vinyl. I know loads of ska and reggae records were dubbed from Jamaican 45's, hence such terrible sound quality on UK issue.

[Dave Rimmer]

Go on Goldsoul - Long Eaton Soul nights 2010 - gallery-image 65

Mr kev Roberts with a lap top, so now thats 3 'big names' been identified

Hmm, I'd hardly call three 'lots', which is the post I originally replied to. That was the point I originally questioned, it just then started to puzzle me as to why nobody was prepared to name all these 'big name' DJs that were using laptops.

As I said in one of my earlier posts, I wasn't being critical, and would have been quite happy using a laptop at the Hamburg weekender boat trip myself (Because that's when I ended up with a bottle of beer spilt all over the decks, records included)

I just don't believe that there are 'lots' of big name DJs using laptops, and would be surprised if anyone could name more than half a dozen 'big name' DJs who have used laptops at all, never mind on a regular basis. And if my assumption on that is correct, it's a mis-leading statement to say 'lots of big name DJs' use laptops.

[Jim G]

I think even Cigarette Ashes (JayBoy) was dubbed from the Mirwood copy. Frank Wilson UK Motown Mono release was also dubbed from Vinyl I understand.

[Dekka]

Hmm, I'd hardly call three 'lots', which is the post I originally replied to. That was the point I originally questioned, it just then started to puzzle me as to why nobody was prepared to name all these 'big name' DJs that were using laptops.

As I said in one of my earlier posts, I wasn't being critical, and would have been quite happy using a laptop at the Hamburg weekender boat trip myself (Because that's when I ended up with a bottle of beer spilt all over the decks, records included)

I just don't believe that there are 'lots' of big name DJs using laptops, and would be surprised if anyone could name more than half a dozen 'big name' DJs who have used laptops at all, never mind on a regular basis. And if my assumption on that is correct, it's a mis-leading statement to say 'lots of big name DJs' use laptops.

Bloody Hell Dave

I never said "on a regular basis", and your taking it out of context with my reply to Harry,

and yes a laptop on a boat would have been prudent.

Ok, 'lots' may imply more than 3, but you asked for names 'in the plural' and thats what you got.

However, like you with the boat, and kev at Long Eaton or Colin and Richard, wherever, I for one, do Not see a ploblem

when they're used at an event such as Harry implied and you and your boat.

Good God man

[Jim G]

the OVO debate has been done to death and even when I asked questions about what is "Original Vinyl" I never got a clear answer, which makes even harder to defend the "Original Vinyl".

Three examples:

Ann Sexton "You've Been Gone Too Long" (on a 7")

1st Issue - Impel

2nd Issue - Yellow 77 label

3rd Issue - Orange 77 Label

Which one is acceptable to play?

Little Richie

1st Issue Black SS7

2nd legal issue Sound (the blue label)

Which one is acceptable to play?

Prince Phillip Mitchell

I'm so Happy - USA Atlantic 7"

or UK Album Track from the "Top of The Line" album

Which one is acceptable to play?

Should we accept for OVO events so long as it played on some form of vinyl that is not a bootleg then it would be OK? This would at least mean that the DJ has at least invested some money into our beloved scene. After all there only so many copies of the true original to go round, and most local soul nights cannot afford big named DJ's every week (nor would they be available anyway I guess).

To quote the Mighty Marvellos "I'm So Confused" and am off to play some records with holes in the middle!

[Kevinkent]

Just a thought....

Could those who are gonna play other than original vinyl please post up something along the lines of "This an MP3 (or CD) event" and add it to their flyers too.

It could save me a fortune in petrol and Blood Pressure pills.

Thankyou.

- Kev

[Kevinkent]

Should we accept for OVO events so long as it played on some form of vinyl that is not a bootleg then it would be OK? This would at least mean that the DJ has at least invested some money into our beloved scene. After all there only so many copies of the true original to go round, and most local soul nights cannot afford big named DJ's every week (nor would they be available anyway I guess).

Surely this exactly the reason that there are too many nights on - a current and frequent gripe on here. Any promoter/dj can get a night going, playing top tunes at minimal cost.

IMO they've invested money straight into their own pockets rather than into the scene.

- Kev

[Spacehopper]

ann sexton..impel and yellow ss....local and national,america is a big place remember...both released when record was new both acceptable

little richie..black issue..blue legit 2nds were released years after first release to cope with the northern soul scenes demand

dont know about lps but would say if it was released at the time the 7 was about..play both

[Citizen P]

Surely this exactly the reason that there are too many nights on - a current and frequent gripe on here. Any promoter/dj can get a night going, playing top tunes at minimal cost.

IMO they've invested money straight into their own pockets rather than into the scene.

- Kev

Halley F*CKING lu yah !!

:yes:

Tony

[Jim G]

Surely this exactly the reason that there are too many nights on - a current and frequent gripe on here. Any promoter/dj can get a night going, playing top tunes at minimal cost.

IMO they've invested money straight into their own pockets rather than into the scene.

- Kev

Don't know Kev, to be honest, at least they would have bought something. I scour for hours / days to pick up records at a price I can afford so I can play them at home, if I had to DJ anything over worth £50 would never be in my set, unless I had bought for less than that by pure chance.

Maybe we should have soul do's were all OVO have to be available for under £50, that would be fun!

But in truth, most of the punters would probably complain cos they couldn't dance to their favourite "rare soul" played from the laptop!

Off to get an original beer now from my Fridge

Edited October 16, 2012 by jim g

[Roger Williams]

There isn't one single promoter who puts on an event 'for the greater good of the scene', it's ALL done for their own ends, 'ovo' or otherwise. Get real.

Roger

[viphitman]

Of course, but those days are long gone. The scene has been going a long time, there are a lot of knowledgeable people out there, there just aren't the amount of unknown records anymore and like it or not there are a lot of DJs with the same records (good records for sure, but the same none the less)

...hmm there are still a few unknown/semi-known tracks at least for the majority of non-dj punters ;) ..... also for a younger crowd or even future generations etiquite and uniqueness within a music/club scene may have it's attraction as well as the details of how to dress propper as a mod, skinhead, punk....and so on.... I would still like to have cheddar cheese from around sommerset and a lovely bordeaux from france in the near future btw !!!! funny though that some of the I don't care about the format brigade were up in arms about the past and current soul film regarding the right clothes and so on....

[Guest Brian Ellis]

Like you say, what does it matter, if you name them.

I keep pushing because nobody has actually named one of these big name DJs, just alluded to knowing about it.

You see, I'm a simple man, I don't understand what all this smoke and mirrors is about. if you know someone uses a laptop, what's the problem with naming tham. I haven't said I am crticial of them, (In fact given certain circumstances I'd fully support the idea), I just want to know who the 'Big name' DJs are that are using laptops. Why is that a problem to you ?

Sam has been considering moving to a laptop - he's just now trying to work out where the slot is to push the 45 into

[Guest sharmo 1]

I thought the northern soul scene was about originality it's strange that recently i saw a guy pay sixty quid for an original sew on patch/badge , i've heared of people paying a fortune for original clobber ect but don't buy records .I personly think that there is a demand for reissue records and have some myself for referance for instance johnny on the spot i have on reissue as it's for me just alright and not worth the big price on original but handy to have on the shelf.I'd never play anything but original vinyl whilst djing as your not just listning to a sound but using modern art work from the label design to production and the artistry thats gone into producing something that represents and honours all the hard work and asperations of the people involved with creating their art.We should play original vinyl as we owe to the artists and all involved a great service to preserve and use a beutiful peice of artwork , without their time and skill we wouldn't even know each other or have a scene and all the hard work that has been put into finding new records , exposing new records and making them standards over the last few decades should be preserved and remembered and honoured.People like John Anderson , Tim Ashebende ,Butch ,Dave Raistrick and everyone else who's plunged and lundge forward in the ever developing and unfolding story of the northen soul scene should not have their time and efforts bastardised by a computor.I've nothing against people having a good night and doing what they like this is also not a plug for our r-n-b night but at the last Spa we thought how fantastic it was that 30,40 and 50 years after musicians entered a smokey studio thousands of miles away and record presses hissed as they gave birth to one of the twentieth centuary's greatest gifts they could never have immagened that all these thousands of miles and decades of time later their work would be played in a back street pub in Derby England and evryone would say what a fantastic record.We honour the artists , label designers ,engeneers , writers and dreamers every time we use their work , we have a moral and almost spiritual right and obligation to these people for without them we wouldn't be on here as there wouldn't be a scene.I am a ludite when it comes to music on laptops not that i want to smash them up but i don't want to be part of anything that's false .Regards Simon.

[Chalky]

ffs I doubt there's one person attends a venue that they are forced to attend and forced to Listen to a format that is in breach of their principles.

Most of us know where we are going and what we are letting ourselves in for. Most of us know the promoters, the Dj's and the policy of any particular club so WHY on earth is this constantly regurgitated?

Those that attend venues where the format is in breach of Soul scene etiquette couldn't give a toss so why on earth do some constantly worry about them.

Ffs go out and do what you want to do and enjoy it before its too late and let those who couldn't care get on with it. If someone wishes to play tracks off a laptop, whoopie fookin do, you are not got to stop them or change them and it won't spoil my night out wherever I choose to go.

[Mark S]

I dont understand this comparison .

The Mona Lisa is a painting , it's visual . I do'nt understand what has it got to do with sonics and dancing ? . Isnt it true that the vast majority of paying customers do'nt care about the format and just want to dance ? . Is that wrong of them ?

Maybe a poor analagy I dont know but the principle is quite simple . People are free to choose whatever format they want I,m not judging them .

Part of the OVO thing for me is that link with an era , who,s hands has that disc passed through before it got to my box / ears, was the artist trolling round Detriot with copies of it in the boot of his car trying to get exposure ? . this albeit a bit of a nieve view to some is how I feel about the subject , its so much more than just the music its history .

[Roburt]

............. the uk soul scene is slowly watered down by the just want to have fun .........

Kinell, you mean people are attending soul nites just coz they enjoy having a good time with their mates .........

.... the Soul Poice will have to put a stop to that or we don't know what it could lead to !!!

[tosspot]

i only play original 45s upstairs at the crown (+ the odd acetate or two), & downstairs they always have a live band on, SO that night even the bloody jukebox is turned off....Now thats what i call real music lol

[KevH]

There isn't one single promoter who puts on an event 'for the greater good of the scene', it's ALL done for their own ends, 'ovo' or otherwise. Get real.

Roger

Not true.

[Jaco]

Bloody Hell Dave

I never said "on a regular basis", and your taking it out of context with my reply to Harry,

and yes a laptop on a boat would have been prudent.

Ok, 'lots' may imply more than 3, but you asked for names 'in the plural' and thats what you got.

However, like you with the boat, and kev at Long Eaton or Colin and Richard, wherever, I for one, do Not see a ploblem

when they're used at an event such as Harry implied and you and your boat.

Good God man

See this is the bit I don't understand.

No further reference is needed with regards to Colin Curtis as his 'act of betrayal' was the subject of a feisty thread not that long ago .

But why would Kevin Roberts and Richard Searling feel the need to use anything other than original vinyl?

Surely they both have collections that could sustain interest throughout most nights if not the most cutting edge night without having to resort to another medium.

Baffling.

[Dekka]

Not true.

I agree with you Kev, people I have got to know personally (please don't ask me to name them, Dave)

Do it for the love

[Guest]

So...to sum it up then..there's real deal OVO events which I go to, there are NS events which play a mix of originals and pressings on 7" and 12" and a Saturday event in Sheffield City Centre, Maggie Mays- running 2-7pm which uses a vast range of experienced local dj's (who I strongly suspect hold all the originals on vinyl anyway). I respect each venue and its own ethos in its entirety. Tell you what though I have to say the Saturday CD event is a strong contender for me very often for "do" of the week the tunes are varied and often rarer ( due to prohibited cost or unavailability of the original track on the vinyl). Also a vast library of music on cd/mp3 format can be found faster, and for free - try downloading Bitlord - put in "Goldmine" Northern Soul and see what happens. Whether this is ethical or not doesn't come into it. And the tracks are good quality, disagree a noisy scratched original piece of vinyl somehow sounds better - how?

People who were on the scene once but left for whatever reason, who have returned at various points are thankful this event takes place, there's never any attitude or snobbery, or trainspotting about which label its on-just a lot of dancing and a positive and grateful response for the event taking place, which is free and leaves the people who come and attend regularly to make their own judgement. There is one regular at this event who attends the twisted wheel and he is highy informed when it comes to records and history. Als it has appeared to draw the newpeople into the scene - even "handbaggers" start somewhere after all. Average attendance 60/70 people, not bad for an event, been at some events in the las few years which struggled to make 15!

I don't think nightime NS events that played cd's would be able to draw a regular audience in as genuine soul fans want to listen to original vinyl if possible if there is a door tax which is fair enough, they simply would not entertain it.

However saturday or sunday afternoons in a pub or club using a cd/mp3 formt present no threat to the original ovo brigade, as long as they are advertised as such-and to be honest I have always preferred these afternoon events anyway where there is a more relaxed atmosphere with no soul police "contraints".

Each to his own, whateve format enjoy it for what it is. Live and let Live.

ATB and KTF

Mick

[Guest Bearsy]

I've got a wedding coming up soon anyone recommend a good dj ??

[jocko]

I've got a wedding coming up soon anyone recommend a good dj ??

You should know not to say that even in jest, your inbox is probably currently about to explode with all the offers, just in case you are serious........

[jocko]

So...to sum it up then..there's real deal OVO events which I go to, there are NS events which play a mix of originals and pressings on 7" and 12" and a Saturday event in Sheffield City Centre, Maggie Mays- running 2-7pm which uses a vast range of experienced local dj's (who I strongly suspect hold all the originals on vinyl anyway). I respect each venue and its own ethos in its entirety. Tell you what though I have to say the Saturday CD event is a strong contender for me very often for "do" of the week the tunes are varied and often rarer ( due to prohibited cost or unavailability of the original track on the vinyl). Also a vast library of music on cd/mp3 format can be found faster, and for free - try downloading Bitlord - put in "Goldmine" Northern Soul and see what happens. Whether this is ethical or not doesn't come into it. And the tracks are good quality, disagree a noisy scratched original piece of vinyl somehow sounds better - how?

People who were on the scene once but left for whatever reason, who have returned at various points are thankful this event takes place, there's never any attitude or snobbery, or trainspotting about which label its on-just a lot of dancing and a positive and grateful response for the event taking place, which is free and leaves the people who come and attend regularly to make their own judgement. There is one regular at this event who attends the twisted wheel and he is highy informed when it comes to records and history. Als it has appeared to draw the newpeople into the scene - even "handbaggers" start somewhere after all. Average attendance 60/70 people, not bad for an event, been at some events in the las few years which struggled to make 15!

I don't think nightime NS events that played cd's would be able to draw a regular audience in as genuine soul fans want to listen to original vinyl if possible if there is a door tax which is fair enough, they simply would not entertain it.

However saturday or sunday afternoons in a pub or club using a cd/mp3 formt present no threat to the original ovo brigade, as long as they are advertised as such-and to be honest I have always preferred these afternoon events anyway where there is a more relaxed atmosphere with no soul police "contraints".

Each to his own, whateve format enjoy it for what it is. Live and let Live.

ATB and KTF

Mick

Good comedy writes itself, live and let live but call lots of people who disagree with you soul police and snobs. Pure genius.

Your events sound good, my mum and dad used to go to them but gave up in their early 80's as it was too much for them. They were called tea dances back then.....

[Dekka]

See this is the bit I don't understand.

No further reference is needed with regards to Colin Curtis as his 'act of betrayal' was the subject of a feisty thread not that long ago .

But why would Kevin Roberts and Richard Searling feel the need to use anything other than original vinyl?

Surely they both have collections that could sustain interest throughout most nights if not the most cutting edge night without having to resort to another medium.

Baffling.

I heard Kev had records stolen from the boot of his car once, only hearsay

but it could explain at these soul events why he uses his laptop.

[Steve L]

Not true.

I was going to say that but couldn't be arsed

[Des Crombie]

I dont understand this comparison .

Isnt it true that the vast majority of paying customers do'nt care about the format and just want to dance ? . Is that wrong of them ?

No its not wrong the dancers shouldn't have to care what they are served.

I'm probably going to get a slagging for this but I am sick of hearing the old "well the dancers don't care" statement. While this is probably true it's no different to other areas of society where few people question or indeed care where and how they get what they want, be it food, clothes, dance music or whatever. In such cases it is my belief that the responsibility lies with the supplier to supply ethical, good quality and legitimate goods.

I know if I go to buy a pair of denim jeans I wouldn't expect the supplier to sell me fakes, bootlegs , or cheap poor quality ones made in a sweat shop or stolen from the back of a truck, MP3's ripped off from Youtube. In my mind the same should hold true here. Just because the dancers don't care is irrelevant. It's the responsibility of the promoters and then in turn the DJ's to supply a decent product that they can personally be proud of.

[Pete S]

I know if I go to buy a pair of denim jeans I wouldn't expect the supplier to sell me fakes, bootlegs , or cheap poor quality ones made in a sweat shop or stolen from the back of a truck, MP3's ripped off from Youtube. In my mind the same should hold true here.

A pair of jeans that you buy is a permanent thing, a 2 minute piece of music played through speakers has disappeared after that 2 minutes. You can argue forever about the jeans because you'll always have them there, but once the moment has passed, you can't argue about the music played.

[Andreas B]

Off to get an original beer now from my Fridge

made me chuckle.

[Geeselad]

I'd never doubt your credibility ted.

[Geeselad]

Well, actually I haven't heard about plenty well known DJs doing this, which is why I asked the question, so, yes it probably would be helpful if these well known DJs are named. After all, if you say 'plenty' and the other post says 'lots' I'm surprised I haven't heard about it, I'm out nearly every weekend, from one end of the country to another.

And I thought that's what this thread was about...a DJ playing MP3s from a laptop.

a fair veiw dave, i just meant its not about naming dj's its about the ethics of playing cd's opposedto ovo.

[Geeselad]

You're right it is, I've used the Traktor digital system on the House scene in the past and you don't realise how much you rely on visual markers - colours, design etc to quickly pick up on what you are looking for,

i was talking about the same thing this weekend, its the same as cdj's, I know it sounds ridiculous, but I work totally visually with tunes, titles and names, particularly with the 12's, mean little to me, its where it is in the box, what colour the label is ect that helps me to locate things.

[Guest turntableterra]

quote name='KevH' timestamp='1350409797' post='1810486'

Not true.

abso f@@king lootly. well said kev. original vynil and be a dj not just someone who buys records too. and i reckon the dancers do know. an night we attend has between 170 and 250 customers and they have a great dance, 5 quid to get in too. and as anyone setting a do for the first time will know. previous organisers charged more, played cd`s and a laptop, charged more dosh and only got 100. i reckon they showed with their feet. this venue is expensive, almost twice the price in comparison to others, but it is great.

[Smudger]

Roburt

So, many (most) didn't collect records and were more than happy having all their sounds on tape / cassette (the 60's equiv of CD's / mp3's).

And those of us did

Back then many on the scene weren't into records at all (though I always collected).

What mattered then was what clothes you wore, did you do the latest dance, did you have a scooter, did you go to the right clubs & attend live shows that featured the 'right acts'.

The most important factor in the decision to travel to a niter in the early days was who was on live.

In most towns, you couldn't get to see a US based act but had to make do with the local soul covers groups -- it was even hard to get to see the likes of Jimmy James, Geno, Alan Bown, Zoot Money, Herbie Goins, Sonny Childe, etc in a town venue as they were so in demand (across the UK & Europe) that they could pick & chose the gigs they took.

To see Ike & Tina, Ben E King, Edwin, Jnr Walker, Alvin Cash, Billy Stewart, Oscar Toney, etc you had to travel to a big city & attend a club venue there. The allniter's simply made it easier to do this, travelling over there on a late train / bus and then back home on the 1st train / bus the next day.

Of course, an 'allniter in-crowd' soon built up in each town & these were the guys that most on the scene back then 'looked-up to'.

So, many (most) didn't collect records and were more than happy having all their sounds on tape / cassette (the 60's equiv of CD's / mp3's).

Yep those were the days,used to carry a box of records round (still got the box) and a Discatron(portable french record player,now long gone) and go to local park Cussy Hill and laze around in the sun on a sunny weekend playing sounds to anyone who gathered around.The Discatron

you slot record into top and press right hand button which clamped record and started it spinning then needle was forced onto record at beggining at a pressure of about 2 tons.still got Washed ashore by platters on musicor that was played thousands of times on this and is now totally F'd. But great memories.

O.V.O. only of course!!!! tapes PAH!!!!

Edited October 17, 2012 by smudger

[Guest Alkie]

went to a local soul/northern do at weekend,place packed dancefloor full most of night,everybody enjoying themselves still full hour after last record,but heres the catch,wasnt actually records???? all done on laptop behind [what would be record decks],podium flat screen showing photos soul images ect,apart from no actual vynil all very proffessional....so why am i still bemused by it and scratching my head at the thought of it,weddings mobile djs yes..but are laptops ok for local do,s?????are there any more such venues out there..

[Guest Alkie]

It was me who put this night on in question .like I said we never advertised NS djs or that it was a OVO .all I was asked to do was try and put a NS night together and we had 120 people there ! We have learnt a lot since and the next one we have 2 local lads playing vinyl KTF people

[Iancsloft]

I thought the northern soul scene was about originality it's strange that recently i saw a guy pay sixty quid for an original sew on patch/badge , i've heared of people paying a fortune for original clobber ect but don't buy records .I personly think that there is a demand for reissue records and have some myself for referance for instance johnny on the spot i have on reissue as it's for me just alright and not worth the big price on original but handy to have on the shelf.I'd never play anything but original vinyl whilst djing as your not just listning to a sound but using modern art work from the label design to production and the artistry thats gone into producing something that represents and honours all the hard work and asperations of the people involved with creating their art.We should play original vinyl as we owe to the artists and all involved a great service to preserve and use a beutiful peice of artwork , without their time and skill we wouldn't even know each other or have a scene and all the hard work that has been put into finding new records , exposing new records and making them standards over the last few decades should be preserved and remembered and honoured.People like John Anderson , Tim Ashebende ,Butch ,Dave Raistrick and everyone else who's plunged and lundge forward in the ever developing and unfolding story of the northen soul scene should not have their time and efforts bastardised by a computor.I've nothing against people having a good night and doing what they like this is also not a plug for our r-n-b night but at the last Spa we thought how fantastic it was that 30,40 and 50 years after musicians entered a smokey studio thousands of miles away and record presses hissed as they gave birth to one of the twentieth centuary's greatest gifts they could never have immagened that all these thousands of miles and decades of time later their work would be played in a back street pub in Derby England and evryone would say what a fantastic record.We honour the artists , label designers ,engeneers , writers and dreamers every time we use their work , we have a moral and almost spiritual right and obligation to these people for without them we wouldn't be on here as there wouldn't be a scene.I am a ludite when it comes to music on laptops not that i want to smash them up but i don't want to be part of anything that's false .Regards Simon.

Beautiful piece of writing Simon about some of the social history of Northern Soul,your wasted lad you should be editor of the Times

C ya Fri @ Southport Weekender

Ian

[Roburt]

There's a lot of 'selective memories' on here ... and thats the folk who were actually around on the scene back in the mid to late 60's ......

Soul was the in music back then, so around 50% of those that went to soul clubs were only there coz it was the place to be (they soon moved on when soul wasn't the flavour of the day).

Of the rest; I'd say 40% didn't collect vinyl at all, so they had no idea what label a 45 had been issued on & whether it was OV or not (BTW, OV was a term I NEVER heard used once in the 60's).

Don't forget, back then, you went to a soul club to pull birds .... around 50% of those who attended were female and hardly any of the ladies had the slightest interest in the actual records (aside from wanting to dance to them).

So that leaves about 10% at most who even cared about the records themselves or what label's particular tracks were on.

So, yes, like any guy who actually wanted the records for themselves back then; I spent many hours in record shops, 2nd hand shops, sending for set-sale & auction lists & ordering records that I found on those. I bought from Soul City Record Shop (visiting at times or by mail order) & even sent off to Randy's Record Shop in Gallatin Tennessee and bought stuff from them (their small catalogues were a great source of info on non UK released 45's by artists of interest to me).

... AS FOR .... named DJ's back then ... apart from Jimmy Saville, Johnny Walker, Emperor Rosko & the like, I didn't know of any (unless Owlin Robin from the Nite Owl counts and I'm sure he doesn't). You could hear all the soul tracks on pirate radio & most people just taped the ones they liked off the radio.

I attended allniters in the north & midlands every week from early 67 right through to 69 and I never knew any DJ's names (wasn't interested in who they were as long as they told me what the last record was when I was interested). I knew of Pete Stringfellow, DJ at the Mojo, but only because he owned the club, booked the acts, DJ'ed, chatted with me on a regular basis and chased all the best looking girls in the club ... so he don't count as just a big name DJ.

I knew of Owlin Robin from the Nite Owl but only coz I attended the niters there for 6 months and his name was on the club's ad every week.

I attended the Wheel every week from the 14th October 67 (Jnr Walker live) thru to summer 68 (they didn't book good US acts in the summer months as everyone went off to Yarmouth or Newquay instead of going to Mancaster). In all that time, I had no idea at all who Roger Eagle was (though I must have asked him at least twice every Sat night what the last record had been). So no 'big name DJs' spinning at niters back then.

........... now to the 45's ................

OV was unheard of .... we were so desperate to get the big sounds, we would have had them on EMI's or boots if they had been available ...

so for a big track like Gene Chandler's "Nothing Can Stop Me" we were quite happy to have it (& DJ with it) on a US Constellation 45 (from 1965) but there were none around in quantity. We'd have had it (& played it) off the US Brunswick LP ('The Girl Don't Care' -- 1968), on the Stateside 45 demo or issue that was known (1965 release but hard as hell to find back then) or on a Soul City 45 (a summer 68 release that made the UK pop charts).

If I had been DJing back then (which I did on occasions) & had played my G.Ch. on Soul City and someone had come up to me & said .. "That's not OV, you can't play that" ... I'd have thought he was a nutter even though anyone could have walked into any high street record shop and purchased a copy of the Soul City 45.

We bought copies of Bunny Sigler's "Let The Good Times Roll" on French EMI coz you could get them from high street record shops and that was a lot easier than spending hours in 2nd hand shops looking for an original UK or US version. When we got the French 45, we DJ'ed with it no problem.

So attitudes back then were very different from today's OVO malarky, people were allowed to go out to a soul club just to have a good time and dancers just danced but didn't think twice about whether they were allowed to get stuck in just coz a track wasn't being played off OV.

Edited October 17, 2012 by Roburt

[Guest turntableterra]

(quote name='smudger' timestamp='1350453816' post='1810687')

Roburt

So, many (most) didn't collect records and were more than happy having all their sounds on tape / cassette (the 60's equiv of CD's / mp3's).

And those of us did

Yep those were the days,used to carry a box of records round (still got the box) and a Discatron(portable french record player,now long gone) and go to local park Cussy Hill and laze around in the sun on a sunny weekend playing sounds to anyone who gathered around.The Discatron

you slot record into top and press right hand button which clamped record and started it spinning then needle was forced onto record at beggining at a pressure of about 2 tons.still got Washed ashore by platters on musicor that was played thousands of times on this and is now totally F'd. But great memories.

O.V.O. only of course!!!! tapes PAH!!!!

(/quot))

i have one also and the free single on how to operate it, narrated by nicholas parsons

[Roxie]

To put things into perspective about the event the guys setting up were asked to do it at the last minute.

I attended not knowing what it was going to be like but I also took a box of original vinyl, which included

Tommy Neal — Going to a happening

Jimmy Delphs — Almost

Mel Torm — Comin home baby

Dusty Springfield — Whats it gonna be

Little Carl Carlton — Competition Aint nothing

The Fidels — Try a little harder

Linda Jones — just cant live my life

Gloria Jones — Tainted love

Doni Burdeck — Candle

Frank Beverly — If that’s what you wanted

Jackie Wilson — Because of you

Dena Barnes — If you ever walk out of my life

Donald Lee Richardson — If you ever walk out of my life

Four Vandals — Wrong side of town

Al Williams — I am nothing

Danny Monday — Baby without you

Candi Staton — Now you’ve got the upper hand

Ann Robinson — World of happiness

Moses Smith — Girl across the sreet

The Artistics — This heart of mine

A C Reed — My baby’s been cheatin

Paul Anka — When we get there

The Invitations — Whats wrong with me baby

Bobby Paris — I walked away

Alexander Patten — A lil lovin sometimes

Ann Sexton — You’ve been gone too long

Roscoe Robinson — That’s Enough

Barbara Lynn — Movin on a groove

Barbara Mills — Queen of fools

Betty Swann — Kiss My Love Goodbye

Beverly Ann You’ve Got Your Mind on other things

Bobby Sheen — Dr love

Chairman of the board — bless you

Jean Stanback — If I ever needed love

Jerry Butler — Moody Woman

The Cheers — Mighty mighty lover

Ace Spectrum — Don’t send nobody else

Joey Delorenzo — Wake up to the sunshine

Gladys Knight — If you ever get your hands on love

Barbara Randolf — I got a feeling

Frank Wilson — Do I love you

Bobby Taylor — Oh I been blessed

Barbara McNair — Your gonna love my baby

The Spinners — Ill Always love you

Billy Procter And Love System - Keeping up with the Joneses

And a selection of these where played on the single deck for the first hour. As I am not a 'DJ' just a punter who wanted to support the event and over all I thought it went really well. I hope that it will eventually become OVO but we need to start somewhere. As for the £2 entry this went to a local hospice along with a raffle procedes from the night.