Why Demo Copies Anyway?

[Guest ScooterNik]

Something I've never understood is the reasoning behind record companies going to the bother of printing different label designs for a comparatively small run of records in preperation for the major run that was to follow. Why not just send out issues?

I know some companies did just that, but why did the others send out specially labeled versions?

[Amsterdam Russ]

For tax reasons. Merchandise used as promotional giveaways would be tax deductible.

[Guest ScooterNik]

Ah. Cheers, never thought of that!

[Ian Dewhirst]

Promos also royalty-free!

Ian D

[soulpaul0]

to stop dj's selling them ?

didn't work if so!

[Neil Rushton]

In the USA most of the record labels relied on distributors to promote their releases, especially to radio stations.

The labels needed to know that if a distributor was given say 100 free "promotional" 45's they would not just flog them - hence "not for sale" promo copies in different colours to the commercial copies..

The distributors were all powerful in the 60's, for instance Robert Bateman relied on his distributor in St. Louis to tell him how many copies of "If It's All The Same To You Babe" - Luther Ingram to keep making to satisfy demand. When the distributor got through 5,000 copies and asked for the same again, Robert told them he wasd a bit concerned about making such a commitment. The distributor said no problem and contacted Jerry Wexler at Atlantic and said the record was breaking out, and that led to Atco picking up disribution rights to the record.

I had the thrill of sitting down with the legendary Hy Weiss some in 1989 and he said scams involving demo runs were part and parcel of the Soul Music industry.

[Mike Lofthouse]

I always thought it was so the DJ's would play the 'right' side. Enforced even more in the 70's when it was the same track on both sides - mono/stereo.

[Guest Brett F]

In the USA most of the record labels relied on distributors to promote their releases, especially to radio stations.

The labels needed to know that if a distributor was given say 100 free "promotional" 45's they would not just flog them - hence "not for sale" promo copies in different colours to the commercial copies..

The distributors were all powerful in the 60's, for instance Robert Bateman relied on his distributor in St. Louis to tell him how many copies of "If It's All The Same To You Babe" - Luther Ingram to keep making to satisfy demand. When the distributor got through 5,000 copies and asked for the same again, Robert told them he wasd a bit concerned about making such a commitment. The distributor said no problem and contacted Jerry Wexler at Atlantic and said the record was breaking out, and that led to Atco picking up disribution rights to the record.

I had the thrill of sitting down with the legendary Hy Weiss some in 1989 and he said scams involving demo runs were part and parcel of the Soul Music industry.

Hi Neil, the Hy Weiss conversation sounds fascinating, can you tell us some of those stories.

[boba]

I always thought it was so the DJ's would play the 'right' side. Enforced even more in the 70's when it was the same track on both sides - mono/stereo.

that practice only started in the 70s though (obviously with some exceptions such as one-sided chess records), in the 60s X's or "plug side" printed on the label told DJs what to play. I think the main reason is that they are royalty free as Ian mentioned (although the tax thing makes sense too).

[Guest Nick Harrison]

Something I've never understood is the reasoning behind record companies going to the bother of printing different label designs for a comparatively small run of records in preperation for the major run that was to follow. Why not just send out issues?

Was always of the understanding which included the theory of a "promo" being a form of a measuring gauge, i e hit or miss. Why go "directly" into the expensive of a production run of taxable "greater volumes", on a unknown group or singer and gamble with a company loss ?

Later - many "Major Label" signed and established groups and solo singers, who's marketing was very correct. Would these company label owners, see a green light and then go directly to pressing world wide issue copies only, due to there success and the demand on this musical product.

And very limited promo only albums would appear after the late eighties also - but then someone on here will disprove this !!

Hope that helps with some sort of reasoning Nicolas .

Edited September 29, 2012 by Nick Harrison

[Guest ScooterNik]

I'm fine with most of that explaination except for the first part of yours Nick, it'd be no cheaper to print up a demo label than a stock label.. If you're pressing 100 (or whatever) copies to give away, then it costs the same whether you press 100 with a normal distro label or if you use a bespoke one.

I'd guess the tax reason would be the major decider as a lot of labels were reputedly a little unscrupulous when it came to royalties (apparently....!)

[Chalky]

There is little colour except white in the label so would be cheaper than an issue label with colour.

Not all demos were white though, some were the issue with promotional copy or demonstration copy printed on or even a sticker to signify it is a demo.

They couldn't print unlimited copies of a demo either, it was a percentage of the total run, not sure what the percentage is.

[Guest Nick Harrison]

There is little colour except white in the label so would be cheaper than an issue label with colour.

You beat me too the answer first Chalk's - as a time served ex label printer, that is correct as a costing exercise. Issue's are moulded mass pressed penny a thousand plastic products.

[Guest Brett F]

Was always of the understanding which included the theory of a "promo" being a form of a measuring gauge, i e hit or miss. Why go "directly" into the expensive of a production run of taxable "greater volumes", on a unknown group or singer and gamble with a company loss ?

Later - many "Major Label" signed and established groups and solo singers, who's marketing was very correct. Would these company label owners, see a green light and then go directly to pressing world wide issue copies only, due to there success and the demand on this musical product.

And very limited promo only albums would appear after the late eighties also - but then someone on here will disprove this !!

Hope that helps with some sort of reasoning Nicolas .

Hi Nick, not sure i understand this statement, i have various LP's that are promo's from the 1970's, Alice Clark/ Alice Clark (Mainstream), Directions Band/ Directions (Brunswick), Hearts Of Stone/ Stop The World (V.I.P), etc, those just three i have near me, or am i misunderstanding what you meant.?

Brett

Edited September 29, 2012 by Brett F

[Guest Nick Harrison]

Good afternoon Brett -

As from late 80's and the early 90's onwards a decline was sighted in the brand new release of US only vinyl albums market - that did not distributed a promo supporting it's first label release.

So those 70's promo's are still a much valued personal item and are a soul music inheritance Brett as you know.

Hope that clears any early misunderstanding.

Nick .