Betty Boo Say It Isn't So

[Prophonics 2029]

Its got me thinking whats not been found yet and whats been binned of even better tunes than the likes of this one.

[Guest Gogs]

So is it ok to play the grapevine label out? or does it have to be the rca acetate copy?. I've got both the grapevine issue and demo but never played them at soul nites.

[Guest Dale]

Never eve,evr.ever tire of this awesome recording!!! it always leaves me speechless!! it is that buddy good -Detroit brilliance and then some [what year was it originally recorded]].....first remember hearing it via R.Searling [Pre RCA/ Grapevine release]- late 70s????

Betty Boo rules the waves

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oEFo25alcnE

ktf

tfk

Both great tunes .......but Spell bound for me......heard it played out at Grumpy Soul Carl Fortnum i think??????fingers crossed hope to here it Saturday down at Rugby ........

Edited September 6, 2012 by Dale

[Guest]

Like everyone else I love this track

not quite everyone Martyn, Jocko had just told you that it, along with a handful of others, had made him into the man he is today

And yes Gogs, it is ok to play it out. However, if it is a DJ that has bought off JM's auction (my guess it is) then he will obviously be saying different

Edited September 6, 2012 by mikecook

[dthedrug]

Manship is flogging an acetate this week I see.

What a truly great soul record, can't believe it never got a release in the U.S.

Few questions about this.

Would it have been one of these acetates that Dickie S was spinning at Wigan then as I presume his connections to RCA lead him to it?

Was it originally recorded for RCA & does anyone know the whereabouts the original masters?

Was just wondering.

Aid.

HI ALL The BETTY BOO come from Richard Wylie to John Anderson SOULBOWL as John did a lot of business with him, the story was given to PCRL in a excellent interview 15 years ago,

The link between Richard John & RCA RECORDS Meant all was in place to release this classic, there was 1 problem in that POPCORN could not remember the name of the singer, so they used BETTY BOO, I think it was DANA VALLERY, however no one else does? the acetate, along with a few other releases is pretty unique to own & BETTY BOO is worth a bit more than most as it was not released in any other form, or was it?? as a owner of Larry Clinton "she's wanted in 3 states" & Jimmy Burns"I realy love you" RCA ACCITATE and seeing how valuable these discs are going for, a part of me would and should let it go up for sale the collector/s who have won the 2 copies that have been auctioned by John.

Also I have to think what would I like as their is no proper valuation on these records, they are all rare and I would have thought some are far more desirable to have, my cat has 100% provenance and was played to DANCERS at WIGAN so it is a bit of unique RARE NORTHER SOUL,

If I did get shot of it I think it would be a trade for a missing UK item that I need, if you have such stuff and would like it, this way is a fraction of the cash price? let me know, DAVE

[Jerry Hipkiss]

There was 1 problem in that POPCORN could not remember the name of the singer, so they used BETTY BOO, I think it was DANA VALLERY, however no one else does?

Morning Dave, I thought it was stated that she was Betty from the Adorables - would make more sense than Dana V who has no Popcorn Wylie connection!

[jocko]

not quite everyone Martyn, Jocko had just told you that it, along with a handful of others, had made him into the man he is today

And yes Gogs, it is ok to play it out. However, if it is a DJ that has bought off JM's auction (my guess it is) then he will obviously be saying different

Suck an extra lemon with your tea last night Michelle.

At least you are not anon........

[Len]

So is it ok to play the grapevine label out? or does it have to be the rca acetate copy?. I've got both the grapevine issue and demo but never played them at soul nites.

I think it is.

Len

[dthedrug]

HI ALL..Jerry I meant I thought it was Dana V when I 1st heard the record not now in 2012, I thought was before I become astute. had a does anyone think they no who it is? also I think that certain GRAPEVINE RECORS should be OK to play these days, if they are important to your set & don't get played when another DJ has the rare original copy in his set, and you have cocked it up, if I was doing a spot i would play my Larry Clinton, who wouldn't it cost me bugger all, not £500+ DAVE

[Pete S]

HI ALL..Jerry I meant I thought it was Dana V when I 1st heard the record not now in 2012, I thought was before I become astute. had a does anyone think they no who it is?

It's Betty Winston of The Adorables

[Ged Parker]

So is it ok to play the grapevine label out? or does it have to be the rca acetate copy?. I've got both the grapevine issue and demo but never played them at soul nites.

Herein lies the reason its not been played to death by the oldies only crowd IMHO. Not that they'd averse to playing a Grapevine release. However becuase it got its first legitimate release here in the UK it was never bootlegged (as far as I know) either on a 45 or on a dodgy CD posing as a legitiate release therefore it wasn't fodder for every returnee to the scene in the 90's and beyond to get on a CD from HMV and listen to it endlessly in the car.

So those that want to hear just the familiar tunes just don't find it that familiar.

The other end of the spectrum the OVO crowd somehow baulk at playing something from an essentially reissues label. Perhaps those two reasons are why we never hear it out and about.

[Gary Samways]

It's Betty Winston of The Adorables

is that a documented fact then pete?, or northern soul hearsay?

[Pete S]

is that a documented fact then pete?, or northern soul hearsay?

No it's the truth!

Edited September 6, 2012 by Pete S

[Gary Samways]

No it's the truth!

i wasn't being facetious mate it's just i knew the story that popcorn couldn'y remember her name and this is the first time i've heard it quoted, i just wondered how or who did the detevtive work/

[Steve L]

is that a documented fact then pete?, or northern soul hearsay?

100% Gary, she performed at the Northampton weekender 5/6 years ago, as part of the adorables with Pat & Diane Lewis and she also sang "Say It Isnt So" on her own!

Apparently it was the first time she had sung the song since she recorded it as a teenager

[Gary Samways]

100% Gary, she performed at the Northampton weekender 5/6 years ago, as part of the adorables with Pat & Diane Lewis and she also sang "Say It Isnt So" on her own!

Apparently it was the first time she had sung the song since she recorded it as a teenager

well you learn something new everyday! cheers steve and pete

[Pete S]

i wasn't being facetious mate i

Didn't think you were Gary!

[Steve L]

Herein lies the reason its not been played to death by the oldies only crowd IMHO. Not that they'd averse to playing a Grapevine release. However becuase it got its first legitimate release here in the UK it was never bootlegged (as far as I know) either on a 45 or on a dodgy CD posing as a legitiate release therefore it wasn't fodder for every returnee to the scene in the 90's and beyond to get on a CD from HMV and listen to it endlessly in the car.

So those that want to hear just the familiar tunes just don't find it that familiar.

The other end of the spectrum the OVO crowd somehow baulk at playing something from an essentially reissues label. Perhaps those two reasons are why we never hear it out and about.

Ged my theory on that is it's because it was played post 77. When the returnees returned en masse, in the mid 90s - as you say they wanted to hear familiar records.

In the main this was records played during the "golden period" of say 72-76. Hence they never heard Betty Boo, (and Cecil Washington, Vicki Baines and all the big sounds of the latter casino years) when they were in their prime.

Your other points are spot on, loads of good records fall into that space between the oldies and what the big time DJ's play

Edited September 6, 2012 by Steve L

[Ged Parker]

HI ALL The BETTY BOO come from Richard Wylie to John Anderson SOULBOWL as John did a lot of business with him, the story was given to PCRL in a excellent interview 15 years ago,

The link between Richard John & RCA RECORDS Meant all was in place to release this classic, there was 1 problem in that POPCORN could not remember the name of the singer, so they used BETTY BOO, I think it was DANA VALLERY, however no one else does? the acetate, along with a few other releases is pretty unique to own & BETTY BOO is worth a bit more than most as it was not released in any other form, or was it?? as a owner of Larry Clinton "she's wanted in 3 states" & Jimmy Burns"I realy love you" RCA ACCITATE and seeing how valuable these discs are going for, a part of me would and should let it go up for sale the collector/s who have won the 2 copies that have been auctioned by John.

Also I have to think what would I like as their is no proper valuation on these records, they are all rare and I would have thought some are far more desirable to have, my cat has 100% provenance and was played to DANCERS at WIGAN so it is a bit of unique RARE NORTHER SOUL,

If I did get shot of it I think it would be a trade for a missing UK item that I need, if you have such stuff and would like it, this way is a fraction of the cash price? let me know, DAVE

I have everything released on Grapevine purchased (or gifted) when they were first released and mostly unplayed. I can understand the interest and value of Betty Boo as its an acetate from the master tape and probably one of the first acetates ever made from the original recording.

These are interesting acetates for the fact they were played at Wigan but for no other reason than that in my opinion. They come from way after the official legitimate release of the records, not beforehand like the Betty Boos. They are also dubbed from vinyl rather than master tape I believe.

I'm not trying to belittle what you have there D but just trying to draw a distinction between the Betty Boo auction and these from the view of a label completist.

[Ged Parker]

Ged my theory on that is it's because it was played post 77. When the returnees returned en masse, in the mid 90s - as you say they wanted to hear familiar records.

In the main this was records played during the "golden period" of say 72-76. Hence they never heard Betty Boo, (and Cecil Washington, Vicki Baines and all the big sounds of the latter casino years) when they were in their prime.

Your other points are spot on, loads of good records fall into that space between the oldies and what the big time DJ's play

A valid view Steve but take another massive post '77 tune actually big at the same time as Betty Boo - Rita and Tiarras. That was out there for the returnees to hear on CD. Even those Goldmine 'This is Norther Soul' LP's which had Tommy Navarro, The Admiration and Sam Fletcher on I think will have given some prior exposure to some tracks.

Using your logic those tracks (and others like Doug Banks, Howard Guyton etc) would be unfamiliar too but they have all been dancefloor favourites at one time or another favourites since the mass return started in the mid 90's.

The difference with Betty Boo is it was never a part of those compilations precisely because the people putting them out couldn't risk it.

[Pete S]

A valid view Steve but take another massive post '77 tune actually big at the same time as Betty Boo - Rita and Tiarras. That was out there for the returnees to hear on CD. Even those Goldmine 'This is Norther Soul' LP's which had Tommy Navarro, The Admiration and Sam Fletcher on I think will have given some prior exposure to some tracks.

Using your logic those tracks (and others like Doug Banks, Howard Guyton etc) would be unfamiliar too but they have all been dancefloor favourites at one time or another favourites since the mass return started in the mid 90's.

The difference with Betty Boo is it was never a part of those compilations precisely because the people putting them out couldn't risk it.

Ged sorry but this is incorrect, Rita & The Tiaras wasn't big until early 1979.

[Ged Parker]

Ged sorry but this is incorrect, Rita & The Tiaras wasn't big until early 1979.

Ok I'll trust you on that Pete I just know I remember them in the main room and I didn't start going to Wigan until just before the 4th Anniversary so they are both still post '77 tunes which was more my point.

[Pete S]

Ok I'll trust you on that Pete I just know I remember them in the main room and I didn't start going to Wigan until just before the 4th Anniversary so they are both still post '77 tunes which was more my point.

Think Betty Boo was late 77 or early 78, problem was Richard unleashed 3 or 4 of those unissueds at exactly the same time so it's a bit confusing (I'd have to check my live tapes), Rita & Tiaras I'm positive on that one, I'd just left home, the Lafayette was on a monday night, things like Rita & Tiaras were just taking off.

[Steve L]

A valid view Steve but take another massive post '77 tune actually big at the same time as Betty Boo - Rita and Tiarras. That was out there for the returnees to hear on CD. Even those Goldmine 'This is Norther Soul' LP's which had Tommy Navarro, The Admiration and Sam Fletcher on I think will have given some prior exposure to some tracks.

Using your logic those tracks (and others like Doug Banks, Howard Guyton etc) would be unfamiliar too but they have all been dancefloor favourites at one time or another favourites since the mass return started in the mid 90's.

The difference with Betty Boo is it was never a part of those compilations precisely because the people putting them out couldn't risk it.

As always there's no black and white with these things Ged. I take your point about Rita & the Tiaras and others that slipped through to the other side but I still reckon that 95% of the records wanted/accepted by that crowd were/are plays from pre 77. My views are based on the East Midlands scene when all this was happening, mid 90s onwards - countless times I saw a record played from outside the golden years clear the floor. Next record - Salvadors, Epitome of sound, Tomangos floor full again! The later sounds were familiar to me cos my time at Wigan was 78/79 and at that time most of the older lads from Mansfield had stopped going anywhere. I used to and still think what the f*8k is wrong with these people?

[Mike]

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Edited September 7, 2012 by mike

[Guest martyn]

Think Betty Boo was late 77 or early 78, problem was Richard unleashed 3 or 4 of those unissueds at exactly the same time so it's a bit confusing (I'd have to check my live tapes), Rita & Tiaras I'm positive on that one, I'd just left home, the Lafayette was on a monday night, things like Rita & Tiaras were just taking off.

I had Ginger playing Betty Boo instrumental on a tape I recorded at St Ives in late summer early autumn 77 ...Deffo before November 77 anyway because thats when St Ives shut, so if Richard had it before Ginger (which seems logical but I somehow doubt (or he didn't like it !) as I didnt hear at Wigan till early 78) then it would have been known to most before the turn of 78....Like you say Rita & The Tiaras far , far later.

Edit.....Don't remember hearing the vocal at St Ives though - anyone else remember ??

Edited September 7, 2012 by martyn

[Guest martyn]

Because 70s emidiscs were actually illegal boots but this was properly licensed and cut proffesionally with all the paperwork required.

Sorry mate, I just don't get it. IMO it shouldn't be worth much more than a Grapevine demo......But looking at what it went for its me that needs to give my head a wobble for having that opinion

[Ian Dewhirst]

Sorry mate, I just don't get it. IMO it shouldn't be worth much more than a Grapevine demo......But looking at what it went for its me that needs to give my head a wobble for having that opinion

It's because it was sold as an artefact rather than anything else. The audio quality will be inferior to the commercial pressing and only has a finite amount of plays in it anyway. So whoever bought it would probably want to frame it rather than actually play it. View it more as the Northern Soul version of an Andy Warhol piece of art rather than anything else.

In fact Damien Hirst probably bought it.

That'd make perfect sense.

Ian D

Edited September 7, 2012 by Ian Dewhirst

[Guest martyn]

It's because it was sold as an artefact rather than anything else. The audio quality will be inferior to the commercial pressing and only has a finite amount of plays in it anyway. So whoever bought it would probably want to frame it rather than actually play it. View it more as the Northern Soul version of an Andy Warhol piece of art rather than anything else.

In fact Damien Hirst probably bought it.

That'd make perfect sense.

Ian D

Well, I supose looking at it that way does make more sense Ian

[Ian Dewhirst]

Well, I supose looking at it that way does make more sense Ian

Well John's obviously no slouch when it comes to assessing the value of indididual records and their potential worth. For that price I'd whack it in a cool frame and call it art.........

Mind you, I don't blame him at all. I'm selling unique records which may not be considered to be rare but which I consider priceless and people are happy to buy 'em. Somebody somewhere in the world will always want a unique copy of a great record...........

Ian D

[dthedrug]

I had Ginger playing Betty Boo instrumental on a tape I recorded at St Ives in late summer early autumn 77 ...Deffo before November 77 anyway because thats when St Ives shut, so if Richard had it before Ginger (which seems logical but I somehow doubt (or he didn't like it !) as I didnt hear at Wigan till early 78) then it would have been known to most before the turn of 78....Like you say Rita & The Tiaras far , far later.

Edit.....Don't remember hearing the vocal at St Ives though - anyone else remember ??

HI ALL,,,It was never played in 77 anywhere!. I can't say that I am 100% sure, however if you look at my Jimmy Burnsand my Larry Clinton, they were issued on GRAPEVINE #118 & #120, IN MY OPINION! #115 EXISTS on a accitate as #123, #125,#127 & possible #135. #138, all the others as such there was no need, again this is only my opinion,

So if what I am saying is part right (some unrealeased numbers may exist) the rare accitate copys were made available to at best 3 DJ's only and proberly only 12 weeks before release date, a

s it is a sur bet any longer, someone would get hold of one. I have worked this out on the fact that some of the known accitates had a US demo or Issue,

most of us did not see an AL WILLIAMS until the 1980s, if JOHN had the SHRINE CAT,he would have done the same again with Richard,

The only doubt about when it got played is based on the month it was release minus 12 weeks so after March 78 it's 100% Jan & Feb 78 it would be 90%,

I agree totaly with Ian how rare is rare? I had a CHRIS JACKSON on 444 LABEL, that's rare, so are these, and I am waiting for more scans, DAVE K

Edited September 8, 2012 by dthedrug

[TOAD]

i say 79 for betty boo

[Ernie Andrews]

Sorry mate, I just don't get it. IMO it shouldn't be worth much more than a Grapevine demo......But looking at what it went for its me that needs to give my head a wobble for having that opinion

I agree with you Martyn its worth £100 at the most

Could have bought quite afew of those RCA acetates only a couple of years ago for around £30 -£50 each on ebay.

I have one of the 2 original cut acetates for the Sidney Barnes Orch that was unnisued and was withdrawn before pressing on Destiny. That went for something like £350 on manships aution and I paid around £300 off Phil T for it I think- he will remind me if he sees this thread. So those 2 acetates are the only legal way to get the tune where as I think the argument here is that they were released and therefore the acetate was cut for purpose on a reissue label however this was never reissued and thats what makes it a bit complicated and why the acetate might command a silly price. Strange world of Northern soul - I think someone said that !

[Guest martyn]

HI ALL,,,It was never played in 77 anywhere!. I can't say that I am 100% sure, however if you look at my Jimmy Burnsand my Larry Clinton, they were issued on GRAPEVINE #118 & #120, IN MY OPINION! #115 EXISTS on a accitate as #123, #125,#127 & possible #135. #138, all the others as such there was no need, again this is only my opinion,

So if what I am saying is part right (some unrealeased numbers may exist) the rare accitate copys were made available to at best 3 DJ's only and proberly only 12 weeks before release date, a

s it is a sur bet any longer, someone would get hold of one. I have worked this out on the fact that some of the known accitates had a US demo or Issue,

most of us did not see an AL WILLIAMS until the 1980s, if JOHN had the SHRINE CAT,he would have done the same again with Richard,

The only doubt about when it got played is based on the month it was release minus 12 weeks so after March 78 it's 100% Jan & Feb 78 it would be 90%,

I agree totaly with Ian how rare is rare? I had a CHRIS JACKSON on 444 LABEL, that's rare, so are these, and I am waiting for more scans, DAVE K

It was played in 1977 at St ives. I recorded it sitting on the stage.....I.m not in the habit of making things up FFS ....Ask Ginger or Richard if they had it in 77 if you don't belive me !

[Pete S]

i say 79 for betty boo

I stopped going in August 78 and it had been and gone way before then Tim

[Pete S]

HI ALL,,,It was never played in 77 anywhere!.

Pretty sure it was played at Wigan late 77, absolutely nothing to do with any Grapevine release, it was just played as a newie.

[Guest martyn]

I stopped going in August 78 and it had been and gone way before then Tim

Spot on Pete, it seemed to peak in spring 78 & was old news soon after

[dthedrug]

It was played in 1977 at St Ives. I recorded it sitting on the stage.....I.m not in the habit of making things up FFS ....Ask Ginger or Richard if they had it in 77 if you don't believe me !

IN RESPONCE HI ALL...Tell you what Martyn, you remember me, don't you,? the topic was about the acetate sold by John Manship at the end of his last auction, £600+, my input is about similar RCA acetates that I have or still have? and my posting has to reiterations stating that it is my opinion, and knowledge about the music industry in the 7T's when I has close friends starting companies in SOUND & LIGHT, WORKING BOTH, I also had the privilege to tour with a few bands stay in POST HOUSES & HOLIDAY INNS not BERNI INNS thinking it was cool yo take a sort for chicken in a basket, I have been to many All-Nighter and most of my records come from the TOP COLLECTORS, who also went to WIGAN & ST IVES Selling to many DJs, I will admit that these people were very knowledgeable and had good business heads, unlike myself who in comparison was a joker & immature,

THE GRAPEVINE LABEL was just getting started when I dropped of the scene in May 78, there release of ROSEMARY & WHAT, meant nothing to me what so ever, as I had the original records, in the case of JUDY STREET my copy was from ADY CROSDALE, he was the first to sell copies on STRIDER,

I must state to you, I have a strong dislike of cowards lies & hypocrites, also I take offence when someone thinks I doubt their opinion and become confrontational about it, however at that time I had to disappear from the scene as I was poisoned by all the intake of chemicals, in 77 I got busted for the 3rd time this was going to ST IVES, (We no a song about a man going to ST IVES, don't we children?) the old bill missed the wraps £10 deals in the corners of record sleeves?

As I say I did not state anything about you or GINGER (HE HAD THE OTHER VERSION FROM JOHN?),

Finally just to remind you I'm not a I'm A ex NORTH HERTS GANGSTER,

MANY THANKS May the SPIRIT of 69 be with you!

Mr K.

[Chalky]

According to the booklet I posted in the above topic the first Grapevine release was May 1977 and hat acetates didn't appear till the following year, dunno if this helps?

[Guest martyn]

IN RESPONCE HI ALL...Tell you what Martyn, you remember me, don't you,? the topic was about the acetate sold by John Manship at the end of his last auction, £600+, my input is about similar RCA acetates that I have or still have? and my posting has to reiterations stating that it is my opinion, and knowledge about the music industry in the 7T's when I has close friends starting companies in SOUND & LIGHT, WORKING BOTH, I also had the privilege to tour with a few bands stay in POST HOUSES & HOLIDAY INNS not BERNI INNS thinking it was cool yo take a sort for chicken in a basket, I have been to many All-Nighter and most of my records come from the TOP COLLECTORS, who also went to WIGAN & ST IVES Selling to many DJs, I will admit that these people were very knowledgeable and had good business heads, unlike myself who in comparison was a joker & immature,

THE GRAPEVINE LABEL was just getting started when I dropped of the scene in May 78, there release of ROSEMARY & WHAT, meant nothing to me what so ever, as I had the original records, in the case of JUDY STREET my copy was from ADY CROSDALE, he was the first to sell copies on STRIDER,

I must state to you, I have a strong dislike of cowards lies & hypocrites, also I take offence when someone thinks I doubt their opinion and become confrontational about it, however at that time I had to disappear from the scene as I was poisoned by all the intake of chemicals, in 77 I got busted for the 3rd time this was going to ST IVES, (We no a song about a man going to ST IVES, don't we children?) the old bill missed the wraps £10 deals in the corners of record sleeves?

As I say I did not state anything about you or GINGER (HE HAD THE OTHER VERSION FROM JOHN?),

Finally just to remind you I'm not a I'm A ex NORTH HERTS GANGSTER,

MANY THANKS May the SPIRIT of 69 be with you!

Mr K.

Yes Dave, I do remember you.................You had rice pudding for brains then as well !

Edited September 8, 2012 by martyn

[dthedrug]

Yes Dave, I do remember you.................You had rice pudding for brains then as well !

MARTYN PLEASE GROW UP! STOP THE INSULTS PLEASE, By all means have your say if it is to do with my reply about when records got played or become available, there is no need to act like my Grandson (in picture) he is 4 years old,? when I next see Mick Smith I will bet the full story of GRAPEVINE,as he gave me the acetates, maybe DAVE WELDING can come up with more info, personally I would rather have the KENT 45s that Mick had, and I never found out if Ady did similar to the KENT6T'S 100 CLUB FREEBEIS? As they would go for decent money, Anyway it seems that all the evidence points to early 78, but it is possible that GINGER had a cut from John in Dec 77, but was it played, please ask him, and put the tape on the TUBE YOU? AND NO MORE OF THIS CRAP PLEASE

Yes Dave, I do remember you.................You had rice pudding for brains then as well !

HOWS THE BROKEN LEG? TUT TUT? DAVE

[Chalky]

personally I would rather have the KENT 45s that Mick had, and I never found out if Ady did similar to the KENT6T'S 100 CLUB FREEBEIS? As they would go for decent money,

There was definitely advanced copies of the Kent releases. I remember at time, be around late 80's or early 90's Kev Orton had all the anniversary releases on a test press of some sort.

[dthedrug]

Hi All They did release the 100 club 45's as advanced cops? Never seen them at all, I was thinking of going to this aniversary, just to get a 45? Dave

[Chalky]

Hi All They did release the 100 club 45's as advanced cops? Never seen them at all, I was thinking of going to this aniversary, just to get a 45? Dave

Yes they were plain white advanced test pressings if I remember rightly, been over 20 years since I saw those of Kev Orton's. Ady will tell you more. Not sure if they still do them or how many were done.

[Louise]

MARTYN PLEASE GROW UP! STOP THE INSULTS PLEASE, By all means have your say if it is to do with my reply about when records got played or become available, there is no need to act like my Grandson (in picture) he is 4 years old,? when I next see Mick Smith I will bet the full story of GRAPEVINE,as he gave me the acetates, maybe DAVE WELDING can come up with more info, personally I would rather have the KENT 45s that Mick had, and I never found out if Ady did similar to the KENT6T'S 100 CLUB FREEBEIS? As they would go for decent money, Anyway it seems that all the evidence points to early 78, but it is possible that GINGER had a cut from John in Dec 77, but was it played, please ask him, and put the tape on the TUBE YOU? AND NO MORE OF THIS CRAP PLEASE

HOWS THE BROKEN LEG? TUT TUT? DAVE

You leave me out of this madness Kilworth, over £600 for a 70's acetate the lunatic's have really taken over the asylum big style

but if there's anymore nutters out there I 've got a rack full of Grapevine and Soul Junction ones available,and I really want to retire early. As for John Anderson, five days on and he's still shakin' his head in disbelief ff's, perhaps we should reissue it

Dave

Edited September 9, 2012 by Louise

[Pete S]

Yes they were plain white advanced test pressings if I remember rightly, been over 20 years since I saw those of Kev Orton's. Ady will tell you more. Not sure if they still do them or how many were done.

Chalky I've seen Kent test pressings more recently than that, saw one for Magic Touch and some others, they were all made in Germany (they had that on the label), and the seller was the aforementioned Mick Smith, they were his own copies.

[Chalky]

Chalky I've seen Kent test pressings more recently than that, saw one for Magic Touch and some others, they were all made in Germany (they had that on the label), and the seller was the aforementioned Mick Smith, they were his own copies.

Now you mention it I seem to remember those Maybe others in an auction???

[Guest martyn]

MARTYN PLEASE GROW UP! STOP THE INSULTS PLEASE, By all means have your say if it is to do with my reply about when records got played or become available, there is no need to act like my Grandson (in picture) he is 4 years old,? when I next see Mick Smith I will bet the full story of GRAPEVINE,as he gave me the acetates, maybe DAVE WELDING can come up with more info, personally I would rather have the KENT 45s that Mick had, and I never found out if Ady did similar to the KENT6T'S 100 CLUB FREEBEIS? As they would go for decent money, Anyway it seems that all the evidence points to early 78, but it is possible that GINGER had a cut from John in Dec 77, but was it played, please ask him, and put the tape on the TUBE YOU? AND NO MORE OF THIS CRAP PLEASE

HOWS THE BROKEN LEG? TUT TUT? DAVE

Dave, if you read your posts back to yourself you will see that you have said that you were away at the time we are talking about, I was merely hinting that you should think carefully before branding me a liar - I was actually there when it was being played ! I have also been told by PM on facebook by another SS member who doesn't want to get involved with this spat that Ginger was playing it at other venues up north in the autumn of 77 off of an emi disc.

As for insults, yes I will cut it out, but there is a limit within a debate where a line is crossed & you crossed it by making out I was a liar. End of........

I dont get the broken leg bit - if its a joke, sorry, I just don't get it unless you are mixing me up with a mutual friend who had a broken leg back then ?

Edit

You are thinking of Mick Lewin - I used to drive him about with his leg stuck out of my mini window

Edited September 9, 2012 by martyn

[Guest Nick Harrison]

It was played in 1977 at St ives. I recorded it sitting on the stage.....I.m not in the habit of making things up FFS ....Ask Ginger or Richard if they had it in 77 if you don't belive me !

As a saturday nite regular Betty Boo was first played circa 1979 and became huge during 1979 and was released/pressed on Grapevine Records in 1979. Without looking was it not also pressed on the This Is Northern Soul LP via RCA Grapevine UK. As Tim Fletcher has clearly stated.

You claim Ginger Taylor was playing this !! Incorrect Martyn - Ginger was a full on oldies dee jay and was so out of the loop at this period of time, regarding picking up anything new and demanding around 77. Ginger very much like Soul Sam (1977 period) was banging out a safe set of repeated 45's like Burning Sensation, My World Is On Fire, etc etc and did get a guest spot at the Casino during 1978/79 which would not include Betty Boo, prior to it's release.

[Pete S]

As a saturday nite regular Betty Boo was first played circa 1979 and became huge during 1979 and was released/pressed on Grapevine Records in 1979. Without looking was it not also pressed on the This Is Northern Soul LP via RCA Grapevine UK. As Tim Fletcher has clearly stated.

You claim Ginger Taylor was playing this !! Incorrect Martyn - Ginger was a full on oldies dee jay and was so out of the loop at this period of time, regarding picking up anything new and demanding around 77. Ginger very much like Soul Sam (1977 period) was banging out a safe set of repeated 45's like Burning Sensation, My World Is On Fire, etc etc and did get a guest spot at the Casino during 1978/79 which would not include Betty Boo, prior to it's release.

Nick that's absolutely not true, it was played in late 77 early 78, by 79 it was an oldie. I went more or less every saturday in 77 and every saturday in 78, I have it on tape being played.