Over Rated Records

[Garethx]

If you are referring to my comments about Eddie Parker I'm Gone,let me explain.

I think the record is average at best, FFS what has it got going for it other than its rarity ?.

Its just a big stomping record with little or no lyrical content, sweet FA in terms of melody or

production/arrangement.Billy Sha Rea's version is better.There are a 1000 and one records

that have been played on the scene that a miles better than it.

Kegsy (cant be arsed listing 1001 better records)

Can we have an un-like button? Everything about this post is wrong.

Whenever this topic comes around it's practically always the iconic records that get pot shots taken at them. Why not the vast number of mediocre filler records everyone's got in their collections bought in the expectation they'd be decent Northern?

90% of the records mentioned in this topic are actually great records. It's impossible to like them all but the ire is often misdirected because of a record's price tag, reputation or notoriety. George Pepp? Spellbinding. Frankie & Johnny? Magical. George Lemons? Strangely fascinating. I could go on.

Records which piss me off are the barrel-scrapings which often get touted on sales threads as being 'so right for now' etc. because they at last fit into a currently in-vogue sound or approach. I wouldn't mind if they were priced realistically but often they aren't.

[Corbett80]

The point Bob made is completely right, but it's not actually the fact of the ranting and going on about what is and isn't shit, it's the repetitive constant nature of the same threads saying the same stuff over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over.

It's like this site has thread Alzheimer's....

And before you start yes I know I don't have to read it.....

[Pete S]

The point Bob made is completely right, but it's not actually the fact of the ranting and going on about what is and isn't shit, it's the repetitive constant nature of the same threads saying the same stuff over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over.

It's like this site has thread Alzheimer's....

And before you start yes I know I don't have to read it.....

Theres not an infinite amount of topics you can have though, eventually then run out and have to be recycled, hence OVO every month, best dj's every 6 months, how to get a warp out of a 45 every 9 months..

[Guest chorleybloke]

Have I mentioned how much I detest the Professionals - Thats Why I Love You?

I really do you know.

Good grief, I think you'll be in a tiny minority (of perhaps 1 person) there. My pet hates are Stemmons Express, Blanche Carter and the Del-Larks (although strangely I do like "Such Misery" by the Precisions).

Not forgetting the "IMHO" disclaimer ;-)

Cheers......Pete

Edited July 24, 2012 by chorleybloke

[macca]

Personal tastes doesn't mean the record is 'shite' just not your cup of tea.

Majestics - I Love You So Much ... Seems like it would be better placed at a Salsa Class but hey, it packs the floor wherever it's played. !!

mariachi class more like. it's got 'eff all to do with the cuban sound. pure east LA...

[Tezza]

mariachi class more like. it's got 'eff all to do with the cuban sound. pure east LA...

Bow to your superior knowledge - Mariachi ?? New one on me that, more investigations required me thinks Lol !!

[Kegsy]

Kegsy, on Yesterday, 10:34 PM, said:

If you are referring to my comments about Eddie Parker I'm Gone,let me explain.

I think the record is average at best, FFS what has it got going for it other than its rarity ?.

Its just a big stomping record with little or no lyrical content, sweet FA in terms of melody or

production/arrangement.Billy Sha Rea's version is better.There are a 1000 and one records

that have been played on the scene that a miles better than it.

Kegsy (cant be arsed listing 1001 better records)78664']

Garethx replies

Can we have an un-like button? Everything about this post is wrong.

There is nothing wrong with the post, it just goes against your particular grain.

I genuinely think the record is over rated, along with Bobby Kline,Kurt Harris,,Laura Green (Moonlight Etc),Court Davis and a whole load

of others. I'm Gone has been known for donkeys years and IMHO never really got played

until standards started to slip.

Kegsy

Edited July 24, 2012 by Kegsy

[Pete S]

Have I mentioned how much I detest the Professionals - Thats Why I Love You?

I really do you know.

Good grief, I think you'll be in a tiny minority (of perhaps 1 person) there. My pet hates are Stemmons Express, Blanche Carter and the Del-Larks (although strangely I do like "Such Misery" by the Precisions).

Not forgetting the "IMHO" disclaimer ;-)

Cheers......Pete

I don't know anyone who likes Blanche Carter!

Love Stemmons Express and The Del Larks though.

Don't like The Precisions version!

Takes all sorts.

[Pete S]

Bow to your superior knowledge - Mariachi ?? New one on me that, more investigations required me thinks Lol !!

Mariachi brass Tezza, have a listen to this hip hop tune to hear one of the best mariachi samples ever! I think it might be John Barry...

[Tezza]

Mariachi brass Tezza, have a listen to this hip hop tune to hear one of the best mariachi samples ever! I think it might be John Barry...

Cheers Pete

[Guest lambrettanik]

wank frilson-do i love you,parliaments-dont be sore at me,dells-wear it on our face.just make me cringe!!!!!

[Garethx]

I don't think it's a case of standards starting to slip, certainly not in the mid-late 70s period you seem to be referring to; I think it's more a case of tastes changing and maturing. "I'm Gone" has a darker, harsher sound than many records which were big earlier in the scene's history. One thing to bear in mind always is how young a lot of the punters would have been in the very early 70s. By the time Wigan was closing everyone was nearly a decade older and peoples' tastes tend to change over time. Maybe that's what a lot of this topic is about. Sometimes I'm sure we all shudder at our own youthful tastes.

I think a lot of what happened in Northern history was that the most instant or hook-laden records became ingrained in the popular conscience first. The less obvious or 'deeper' sounds got overlooked in favour of the very catchy early on in that history. I think it's a mistake to say the quality slipped or dropped off. Of course it's tapered off over time, that's natural over a forty five year period of looking for something which is essentially finite.

The odd great record is still getting found. It's just much harder these days.

[macca]

Bow to your superior knowledge - Mariachi ?? New one on me that, more investigations required me thinks Lol !!

Definitely not superior Tezza, Peggy, Gordon etc. I just saw the word salsa and thought I'd have me tuppence worth. To me those horns in The Majestics are reminiscent of those in Johnny Caswell, a definite Mexican feel to them (to these ears). My contribution to this thread is Patrinell Staten - Little Love Affair. I find that duff in every way, the arrangement, the vocal, everything. I'venever felt so underwhelmed by a record, especially after hearing so much about it on here. I bet you don't like it either Tezza, right?

[Tezza]

Definitely not superior Tezza, Peggy, Gordon etc. I just saw the word salsa and thought I'd have me tuppence worth. To me those horns in The Majestics are reminiscent of those in Johnny Caswell, a definite Mexican feel to them (to these ears). My contribution to this thread is Patrinell Staten - Little Love Affair. I find that duff in every way, the arrangement, the vocal, everything. I'venever felt so underwhelmed by a record, especially after hearing so much about it on here. I bet you don't like it either Tezza, right?

Ok Macca, you have got me interested in something new (to me).

Will be busy on You Tube tonight !!!

Cheers matey

[Mike]

The point Bob made is completely right, but it's not actually the fact of the ranting and going on about what is and isn't shit, it's the repetitive constant nature of the same threads saying the same stuff over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over.

It's like this site has thread Alzheimer's....

And before you start yes I know I don't have to read it.....

nah, dont agree

just look at the thread list here

https://www.soul-sour...about-the-soul/

last 50 threads - how many are "negative" ?

go here

https://www.soul-sour...ok-at-your-box/

how many negative threads?

are we talking 1 or 2 in last 100 ??

look at this thread

its just a knockabout thread

sure get various views - some repeated, some off the cuff

but its just the same as recent funk one

if you actually look at all the comments and take time to read them, then to me it gives a different picture than what you say

look at recent posts on this thread

discussion has widen beyond the original posters point and some imo interesting and some entertaing discusssion has gone on

its just a knockabout thread

1 in a 100 ?

we do allow them

if get too many of them we do step in

[KevH]

Definitely not superior Tezza, Peggy, Gordon etc. I just saw the word salsa and thought I'd have me tuppence worth. To me those horns in The Majestics are reminiscent of those in Johnny Caswell, a definite Mexican feel to them (to these ears). My contribution to this thread is Patrinell Staten - Little Love Affair. I find that duff in every way, the arrangement, the vocal, everything. I'venever felt so underwhelmed by a record, especially after hearing so much about it on here. I bet you don't like it either Tezza, right?

Hey Macca,you've got your Peggy's mixed.This is a different Gordon to the one you think.Goes by the name of Stig Lindberg as well.

[Winnie :-)]

I don't know anyone who likes Blanche Carter!

Love Stemmons Express and The Del Larks though.

Don't like The Precisions version!

Takes all sorts.

I like it, and not because you've said you don't know anyone who likes it. When the scene was a northern scene, it fitted perfectly IMO, and would still dance to it now

[Pete S]

I like it, and not because you've said you don't know anyone who likes it. When the scene was a northern scene, it fitted perfectly IMO, and would still dance to it now

I remember the 3rd anniversary when it was probably at it's peak, they played it 3 times that night, even I liked it then.

[Guest Paul]

There are so many records that are overrated (in my opinion) but it's all subjective and it's worth noting that some tracks which sound really mediocre (musically and sonically) can sound okay when played loud in a club with an atmosphere.

There's no point in me saying which tracks I think are overrated but I'd like to wander a bit off-topic and admit that back in 1974 when I was 16 I remember thinking "why on earth are they playing a Paul Anka record at The Casino when there so many great soul records to play?"

I automatically assumed it would be just another overrated track but when I got there and heard it I had to admit it wasn't bad and it worked well in that place at that time.

So there's a record which was underrated by me until I actually heard it! Teenagers think they know it all, don't they?

These days I try to actually hear tracks before I slag them off.

[Winnie :-)]

I remember the 3rd anniversary when it was probably at it's peak, they played it 3 times that night, even I liked it then.

I don't think I'll ever truly understand the northern scene (probably why I've given up trying) I honestly can't remember a record I liked and no longer do, there are records I don't want to hear again, because I've heard them so many times, but that's obviously different.

I can't stand 'you're ready now', and yet I love 'one wonderful moment', but I can't explain the reasons why, I know one triggers the gotta dance impulse, whilst the other causes inertia. It's not because it's Frankie Valli, I still like 'touch the rainchild'. Who knows, I certainly don't.

[Pete S]

I don't think I'll ever truly understand the northern scene (probably why I've given up trying) I honestly can't remember a record I liked and no longer do, there are records I don't want to hear again, because I've heard them so many times, but that's obviously different.

I can't stand 'you're ready now', and yet I love 'one wonderful moment', but I can't explain the reasons why, I know one triggers the gotta dance impulse, whilst the other causes inertia. It's not because it's Frankie Valli, I still like 'touch the rainchild'. Who knows, I certainly don't.

I never thought I'd know a day when Yvonne Baker wasn't it my top 10 but I just compiled a new top 100 and it's about number 78! It's not that I dont like it anymore, it's just "not as good as it used to be"

[paultp]

wank frilson-do i love you,parliaments-dont be sore at me,dells-wear it on our face.just make me cringe!!!!!

The Parliaments is almost the perfect example of Detroit Northern Soul, it has absolutely everything a Detroit tune should have from the sound to everyone playing on it and right down to the writing credits.

If it was rare it would be on everyone's wants list and most DJ play lists, same as Take it Baby would be.

I also used to love Blanche Carter, still really like it as a fantastic Girlie tune, but I have no Wigan snobbery to speak of as I only went once.

Just trying to balance the negative v positive slant of the thread

[Guest JIM BARRY]

there was any amount of "northern" played at wigan circa 1976 that i would class as rubbish!....joe 90 theme as the main culprit, i approached russ about 10 years ago on the subject of these particilar tunes and his answer was "they were popular"....not to me they wern't.

[Chalky]

The Parliaments is almost the perfect example of Detroit Northern Soul, it has absolutely everything a Detroit tune should have from the sound to everyone playing on it and right down to the writing credits.

If it was rare it would be on everyone's wants list and most DJ play lists, same as Take it Baby would be.

I have to agree with you about the Parliaments, as you say Northern Soul perfection!

[Steve G]

I have to agree with you about the Parliaments, as you say Northern Soul perfection!

Yes maybe picture it as a Butch cover up exclusive rocking niters to a full floor, and people would see it in a better light methinks.

[Pete S]

there was any amount of "northern" played at wigan circa 1976 that i would class as rubbish!....joe 90 theme as the main culprit, i approached russ about 10 years ago on the subject of these particilar tunes and his answer was "they were popular"....not to me they wern't.

Jim I know you'll say I'm splitting hairs here but there were not many rubbish played in 1976 and 77 at Wigan. There were lots in 78 and that includes your joe 90, tim tam, lenny gamble and all that crap, but I could probably count the amount of 'bad' records on both hands played in 76 and 77.

[Cunnie]

Bring the tar to the boil & unbag the feathers but Soul Brothers Inc - Pyramid is without a doubt the most over rated record ever played on the Soul scene bar none.

[MrsWoodsrules]

Tommy Navarro

Caressors - I can't stay away

Johnny Caswell

It just my opinion, but I love Johnny Caswell, even after a thousand times.

Like Tommy Navarro too, not sure how soulful it is, but still love it just the same.

To each their own.

Aid.

[Guest JIM BARRY]

Jim I know you'll say I'm splitting hairs here but there were not many rubbish played in 1976 and 77 at Wigan. There were lots in 78 and that includes your joe 90, tim tam, lenny gamble and all that crap, but I could probably count the amount of 'bad' records on both hands played in 76 and 77.

I stand corrected date wise pete, thats what old age does to ya! lol....yeah i stopped going in 78 till 80...add muriel day into that list as well. .....and the tunes from from 80 till the closure were brilliant.

Edited July 24, 2012 by JIM BARRY

[KevH]

Yes - Muriel day.Ducking stool fodder.

[KevH]

Bring the tar to the boil & unbag the feathers but Soul Brothers Inc - Pyramid is without a doubt the most over rated record ever played on the Soul scene bar none.

Cunnie,you're into modden.What do you know.?

[macca]

Bring the tar to the boil & unbag the feathers but Soul Brothers Inc - Pyramid is without a doubt the most over rated record ever played on the Soul scene bar none.

Nay, nay and thrice nay! I've only just got into this record (didn't do Stafford etc)... Fabulous piece of Soul and I love singing along with it love walrus style. Toon!

[macca]

Ok Macca, you have got me interested in something new (to me).

Will be busy on You Tube tonight !!!

Cheers matey

It's also the horns in ring of fire by johnny cash. kurt harris is a good example too...

[SallieJane]

Most of the blue eyed pop tunes played at Wigan in the mid 70s with not a hint of soul in them ..... dire.

But hey that's just my opinion, sure loads like Helen Shappiro, Dean Parrish, PJ Proby et al. Just not my cup of tea...or coffee.

[KevH]

It's also the horns in ring of fire by johnny cash. kurt harris is a good example too...

Often played those "Air" horns in Kurt Harris,amazingly in tune as well.

Dean Barlow is kak.

[macca]

Most of the blue eyed pop tunes played at Wigan in the mid 70s with not a hint of soul in them ..... dire.

But hey that's just my opinion, sure loads like Helen Shappiro, Dean Parrish, PJ Proby et al. Just not my cup of tea...or coffee.

Which Dean Parrish? Determination is a fabulous record and predates the Casino by at least 5 years.

[Pete S]

Which Dean Parrish? Determination is a fabulous record and predates the Casino by at least 5 years.

All Dean Parrish's records are great. Tell her - best version by a mile. I'm on my way - classic. Determination - one of the best ever. Whats not to like?

[Cunnie]

Cunnie,you're into modden.What do you know.?

OK then, mean's I can have 2 goes.

The terrible Tribute - Bob Sinclair that is getting plays in both Modern & Northern rooms at the moment. Even heard it played at so called Northern Oldies nights but why oh why?

Got a lot of time for Bob Sinclair who own's Defected records but who mysteriously does not sing or play on this & also Ron Caroll who does but this is just a terribly poor supposed Soulful House record that should be hidden away for eternity.

Even when DJ's do play it be it at a Northern, Modern or Northern Oldies night they have to make excuses for playing it like 'Marmite record', 'love it or hate it' etc.

PS, for those that don't know me I'm not having a dig at Soulful House as it's part of the whole scene I love (Soulful Dance music from any era be it 60's up to present day releases).

[jocko]

Most of the blue eyed pop tunes played at Wigan in the mid 70s with not a hint of soul in them ..... dire.

But hey that's just my opinion, sure loads like Helen Shappiro, Dean Parrish, PJ Proby et al. Just not my cup of tea...or coffee.

Not many people, including lots of other soul singers, would say Dean Parrish has not a hint of soul in him

Another attempt at point scoring comment, and another one about as misguided as most US rockets in Afghanistan.

[jocko]

i can think of somewere were you could load them to.........

Yes very good, wherever it is I will ensure I save them for when you come back from your next 20 year scene break so you can catch up a bit quicker that time........

[macca]

Indeed.

[Pete S]

Yes very good, wherever it is I will ensure I save them for when you come back from your next 20 year scene break so you can catch up a bit quicker that time........

[jocko]

If you are referring to my comments about Eddie Parker I'm Gone,let me explain.

I think the record is average at best, FFS what has it got going for it other than its rarity ?.

Its just a big stomping record with little or no lyrical content, sweet FA in terms of melody or

production/arrangement.Billy Sha Rea's version is better.There are a 1000 and one records

that have been played on the scene that a miles better than it.

Kegsy (cant be arsed listing 1001 better records)

Thank you for explaining, not too difficult to add something worthwhile other than implying that anyone who does like the record is a feckless twat that can't think for themselves and only look at the price tag, aka they aren't as special as you. Which I repeat in the case of that record is just a stupid point scoring exercise hence my scorn at your response.

However spoiled by the rather typical comment later that since it wasn't played for a week in 1973 it can't be any good! Hmmm I give up. .

[jocko]

OK then, mean's I can have 2 goes.

The terrible Tribute - Bob Sinclair that is getting plays in both Modern & Northern rooms at the moment. Even heard it played at so called Northern Oldies nights but why oh why?

Got a lot of time for Bob Sinclair who own's Defected records but who mysteriously does not sing or play on this & also Ron Caroll who does but this is just a terribly poor supposed Soulful House record that should be hidden away for eternity.

Even when DJ's do play it be it at a Northern, Modern or Northern Oldies night they have to make excuses for playing it like 'Marmite record', 'love it or hate it' etc.

PS, for those that don't know me I'm not having a dig at Soulful House as it's part of the whole scene I love (Soulful Dance music from any era be it 60's up to present day releases).

Its always easier to get it right after one right cock up!! :D

If you hear a load of Preston accents outside your house with balaclavas and 60's mafia t-shirts on, just deny your first one

[Steve G]

Most of the blue eyed pop tunes played at Wigan in the mid 70s with not a hint of soul in them ..... dire.

But hey that's just my opinion, sure loads like Helen Shappiro, Dean Parrish, PJ Proby et al. Just not my cup of tea...or coffee.

Dean Parrish? Not a hint of soul? Great singer.

Helen Shapiro is a good singer too (non soul).

The man with the missing Constanant - Paul (W)Anka is I think the example of a soul-less piece of dross that you're looking for. Every one of his so called "northern" records are "charming pop" turnips. Followed by Bobby Goldsboro - more soul in a 10p piece than in that old cowboy .

Edited July 24, 2012 by Steve G

[Guest]

Big Joe Turner - Two loves have I. Just perfect for a bit of Vic Reeves 'club style' frivolity .

I'd forgotten all about that. Big 100club record.. But yeah poo.

Cajun Hart is a brilliant record. Lyrics are a biit suspect but it's a great dancer.

Over rated.. Roosevelt Grier Pizza pie man and one i could never get Ronnie McNier Sitting in my class.

[Steve G]

one i could never get Ronnie McNier Sitting in my class.

Classic detroit double sider...

[Guest]

Classic detroit double sider...

yeah but i've never liked it..

I'll tell ya whats overated an all... Shrine!

[Steve G]

Shrine - the "chequebook collectors" dream A few goodies, backed with quite a lot of mediocrity.

Edited July 24, 2012 by Steve G

[Guest gordon russell]

ain,t there a lot of this dross that people seem to like......interspersed with people not liking some great soul records........mike ought to rename it pop source