Funky Soul

[Chalky]

Funky Soul, Funk edged Soul...however you wish to describe it. Good or bad?

Does it have a place at venues or is a lot of it a case of the Emperors New Clothes.

[Guest MrC]

I'm sure it has it's place, but I'm not sure if it's at a rare soul weekender......

(Although I do quite like it, always fits in well at Burnley, and that is one of my favourite nighters)

Edited July 5, 2012 by MrC

[Kris Holmes]

i love it, one of my favorite sounds.

[Steve G]

some of it is fabulous, some of it is awful.

You need DJs that can actually sort the wheat from the chaff. Sadly some of them can't.

Edited July 5, 2012 by Steve G

[KevH]

Yes got as much place as any other non NS genre.As with other genres, there's good and bad.If it's funky ,its got to be gritty with a NS feel,not too "disco".

Edited July 5, 2012 by KevH

[Markw]

I like quite a lot of what I've heard. From a personal point of view, I could never figure out why so much of the Northern scene went so doggedly down the R&B route for 'new' sounds for so long, in particluar the early stuff and the stuff that is very 'country' etc to my ears, when the funkier stuff always seemed a more natural 'progression' . Just my taste and view.

[Chalky]

Yes got as much place as any other non NS genre.As with other genres, there's good and bad.If it's funky ,its got to be gritty with a NS feel,not too "disco".

There is a lot, probably a majority, that lose that northern feel though. I've seen many an empty floor at all-nighters, even to top DJ's simply because they probably feel the DJ has gone to far or over stepped the mark?

[Guest john s]

some of it is fabulous, some of it is awful.

You need DJs that can actually sort the wheat from the chaff. Sadly some of them can't.

Might as well lock the thread there, I'd have thought - can't see that a more sensible (and succinct) post will be made over the next few pages...

[Chalky]

Might as well lock the thread there, I'd have thought - can't see that a more sensible (and succinct) post will be made over the next few pages...

It was quite sensible and a good answer. It is the answer you could give to any genre of this broad scene of ours.

[Guest john s]

It was quite sensible and a good answer. It is the answer you could give to any genre of this broad scene of ours.

Exactly.

[Benji]

Pure Sh*te. It's not 'funky soul' it's just funk. And I hate funk.

[KevH]

Pure Sh*te. It's not 'funky soul' it's just funk. And I hate funk.

Example please of said "Sh*te".Funk is funk.

[boba]

"funky soul" is too generic a title, I think you specifically mean the early 70s funky cuts that specifically appeal to the northern scene now right? because sam and dave is funky soul.

[Benji]

Example please of said "Sh*te".Funk is funk.

You want examples of which funky stuff is sh*te? Pretty easy, take 90% of what's been played over the last few years. Remaining 10% are just crap.

[KevH]

You want examples of which funky stuff is sh*te? Pretty easy, take 90% of what's been played over the last few years. Remaining 10% are just crap.

Thanks for clearing that up Benji.

[boba]

Thanks for clearing that up Benji.

yeah, i was shocked to find a hater on soul source, everyone is always so positive about everything

[Pete S]

Pure Sh*te. It's not 'funky soul' it's just funk. And I hate funk.

Good to see someone saying what they mean

[Kris Holmes]

yeah, i was shocked to find a hater on soul source, everyone is always so positive about everything

yeah Benji, tell us how you really feel.

[KevH]

Good to see someone saying what they mean

And meaning what they say.

[Jordirip]

Might as well lock the thread there, I'd have thought - can't see that a more sensible (and succinct) post will be made over the next few pages...

Yep, we've already descended into the meat headed, "funk is shite" comments already. Where's my Judy Street boot, I need to hear some proper music.

[Dylan]

can someone put up a few key examples of this genre ?

when we've discussed this before the funky soul I like isn't actually the same as funky soul........

[Tricky]

Funky soul has always been played on the scene for flip sake.Its not a new thing at all.Why oh why everything has to be pigeon holed is beyond me.Good is good and bad is bad in every sub genre of our music.

[KevH]

Is this the sort of stuff that scares you?

[Guest]

i'm not digging it man, where thats nice ballad thread gone....

[arnie j]

i get confused sometimes with the genres that this scene frets on,is this funky soul ? i think it is and i love it and i love loads more in the same vein,i dont care wat box it has to go in under what description someone wants to give it,i just know that i bloody love it and thats all that matters to me

jason

[Reg Scott]

The tunes you're talking about Chalky, I think, have in the main been in around forever.

It's a danceable tune with an edge for me call it what you will (funky soul etc etc)

A number spring to mind that are considered classics on the Northern scene:

World Column - So Is The Sun

NF Porter - Keep On Keeping On

Rufus Wood - Before 2001

etc

Always been around just seems a focus on them and some newer / less heard tunes - as you say Emperors New Clothes - but give me that anytime over insipid pop tunes hat passed for soul music!

[Pete S]

Is this the sort of stuff that scares you?

[media=]

That's okay but pretty boring, would not want to hear it at at a Northern Soul do. Why would anyone play something like that at a Northern Soul do anyway?

[Pete S]

The tunes you're talking about Chalky, I think, have in the main been in around forever.

It's a danceable tune with an edge for me call it what you will (funky soul etc etc)

A number spring to mind that are considered classics on the Northern scene:

World Column - So Is The Sun

NF Porter - Keep On Keeping On

Rufus Wood - Before 2001

etc

Always been around just seems a focus on them and some newer / less heard tunes - as you say Emperors New Clothes - but give me that anytime over insipid pop tunes hat passed for soul music!

Those three are stupendous Northern Soul records though, funky or not - the example on Tayster above is not.

[Pete S]

Actually I'll keep out of this, I like many of the funky type things that I've heard but I wouldn't want to hear them at avenue, that's all I have to say really, same as I wouldn't want to hear tons of hardcore late 50's r&b.

[boba]

I think the delreys inc destination unknown is funk

[Pete S]

I think the delreys inc destination unknown is funk

I think it's Northern

[boba]

I think it's Northern

they're mutually exclusive? play it for anyone who is into soul but doesn't know about northern, they will agree it's funky soul.

[Guest Bearsy]

Soulful funk, funky soul, For me it has to have some kind of soulful feel to it and there are plenty I like and just like all the other pigeon holed genres in the scene I like a bit but not all, out and out wah wah funk NO there is a scene for that already :-)

[boba]

Soulful funk, funky soul, For me it has to have some kind of soulful feel to it and there are plenty I like and just like all the other pigeon holed genres in the scene I like a bit but not all, out and out wah wah funk NO there is a scene for that already :-)

Aren't there known "wah wah funk" records on the scene:

I think parliament or something like that wouldn't get played

[Pete S]

One of my favourites is The Gaturs - Yeah You're Right, You KNow You're Right, that's got a bit of wah wah in it if I remember correctly.

[Chalky]

The tunes you're talking about Chalky, I think, have in the main been in around forever.

It's a danceable tune with an edge for me call it what you will (funky soul etc etc)

A number spring to mind that are considered classics on the Northern scene:

World Column - So Is The Sun

NF Porter - Keep On Keeping On

Rufus Wood - Before 2001

etc

I'm not talking about any records really Greg, it's a topic that was being debated in another topic but the sort of records mentioned so far are nothing like what I mean by today's funky soul. Most of those mentioned are simply northern, have a northern feel and are not alien to the majority of dancers.

I'm talking about records like Clip Info: Sir Guy - I Need You, Gamith, King Roosevelt, William C Belton and John Harris and the Soul Sayers if that's the correct name off top of my head. Four of the above are from a Paul Sadot mix I put in refosoul for him.

Funk edged soul has been around for decades on the scene but te last few years there is more funk than soul in many of the tracks championed under the name funk edged soul, good or bad?

Like Steve said there is some good stuff but like he also says there is some rubbish that IMO is only played by others trying to be the next Paul Sadot or Karl Heard and failing miserably.

[Chalky]

If you cant find examples of the above tracks I mentioned to listen to I'll try and put some on my soundcloud page over the weekend.

[Tricky]

Its all down to personal taste.People say on here they want to hear new stuff.Well like in the old days some will hit the spot and others won't,but its not the same old same old.I welcome it mixed into spots.

[Jumpinjoan]

John Harris is as far as you can get from the stuff I'm talking about. As is Sir Guy (not my fave tune but it's ok). I'm talking the second rate blaxploitation (for want of another way of putting it) type stuff that just isn't good enough. Please don't ask me to give examples - I don't make any effort to know stuff I'm not interested in.

If your taste has changed and you want to listen to that type of sound is there not a scene for that already? No disrespect meant, serious question.

Edit: I consider myself pretty open minded and can put up with tunes that I don't personally rate no problem at all but it is getting to the point now where it spoils a night because there is so much of it. Maybe I should just avoid those venues

Edited July 6, 2012 by jumpinjoan

[Guest gordon russell]

funk edged is o.k.....example soul power gene redding bell....slotted in sparingly as with well known oldies. It goes wrong when dj's are put on playing whole sets of durge funk/blacksplotation stuff.........the dj and his half dozen mates are in heaven and the rest of us are in hell and played like that it,s certainly WRONG at nighters does what sets of mid tempo durge does KILLS IT....... mixed in very very sparingly if you don,t like it,it,s gone in a flash (we hope). TEZZA

[Steve G]

Edit: I consider myself pretty open minded and can put up with tunes that I don't personally rate no problem at all but it is getting to the point now where it spoils a night because there is so much of it. Maybe I should just avoid those venues

Isn't that about having DJs who can do a varied set Joan, rather than one trick Ponies?....

PS: Can we called it funky edged northern or something? Funk to me is stuff like Ray Frazier & Shades of Madness, Soul Dynamics, Vernon Garrett, Hard Drivers etc. Fabulous records, by the way "Bunji".

Edited July 6, 2012 by Steve G

[boba]

I'm talking the second rate blaxploitation (for want of another way of putting it) type stuff that just isn't good enough.

like the JJ Callier pusherman?

[Roburt]

I just like soul ......... all soul ........ tall soul, small soul, fat soul, thin soul, gay soul.

If it's good, then play it out .... don't matter if the Wigan stomper / Brid Weekender main room / Stafford / 100 Club fans don't rate it ....

......... don't matter if it's rare or common ...... don't matter if it's 'blaxplotation soul' even ........ if it gets the feet moving, play it.

Edited July 6, 2012 by Roburt

[jocko]

funk edged is o.k.....example soul power gene redding bell....slotted in sparingly as with well known oldies. It goes wrong when dj's are put on playing whole sets of durge funk/blacksplotation stuff.........the dj and his half dozen mates are in heaven and the rest of us are in hell and played like that it,s certainly WRONG at nighters does what sets of mid tempo durge does KILLS IT....... mixed in very very sparingly if you don,t like it,it,s gone in a flash (we hope). TEZZA

You mean I Got Soul by Gene Redding, being playing both sides of that for years in my silky smooth sets, just ask Mr Challoner, I did have a chuckle when that and Bobby Patterson got covered up by the Funky Young Thangs, both been standards for us straight ahead smooth as silk stocking soul boys with no categories for years.

Anyway as I guessed you wouldn't even be able to agree on what sort of records you mean, never mind who is playing it. where and what is relevant. (Edit by you I don't mean the artist formerly known as Stig anymore, this is a general comment on this thread aimed at all the cheesy funky boys as are all others following, don't want one of those dodgy Black Leather coated Northampton dodgy geezers from 1971 paying me a visit!)

I do agree with my Furniture designer here though, a good DJ can play some of this stuff, as they should, but with the lower tempo also obviously, and do it right, in a balance with just good records and forget this genrification of each individual record. And by these I mean the people who were doing this before the village idjuts tried to claim it as a separate scene, Mr Heard, Mr Sadot, Mr Santucci and Mr Thorley, but the stuff they were playing was just hard edged soul, the aggro soul we loved. It sounds like a whole load of people with limited exposure to the wider world of Black music are just shoving their tied back ears into the wider world of Black music to try and find some of the same as the above used to play but just getting it wrong. Sounds like our Scottish Chef going to the larder for material for an apple pie wearing oven gloves but pulling out soor plums instead as he can't feel the texture. There are guys, not least the Rippoles, who seem to be able to put sets of this together but I have never heard them in a niter context and not sure how it would work there.

I love the stuff Joan seems to be describing, or at least the good stuff of which there is lots, but if I heard it out at a Norvern Niter (the new variation, I refuse now to use the word rare as in my opinion it has been tainted by recent debates on here) I would piss my baggy pants (the underwear that is not the outerwear favoured by some). Its fantastic music in a context and will keep students dancing for years, the odd tune will work in Norvern do;s but much of that genre only works in its own context for me.

So it sounds like the same old issue, too many DJ's, not enough knowledge, playing Black music they don't understand and getting it wrong. Sounds like Micheal Procter/Bob Sinclair all over again!

And before anyone reminds me, I don't go out, so technically I shouldnt post or care, but I just cant help shaking my head with a gin bottle stuck in my mouth at some of the pash that goes on with people masquerading as the New Breed. My mojo isnt only bust it is now under the rear wheels of my car that as soon as I am sober enough to stop seeing triple I will be reversing over to ensure I never get tempted again!

PS Interesting to see the best examples of this that most people put up clips of come from a certain Chunky's you tube channel, yet the Phat one very rarely gets credit or spots. Maybe tied into the nepotism thread......

PPS And off course although as usual although no-one gives credit, the first of this stuff was Butch and Andy D at early Lifelines I would say, and do either of them get mentioned. No. Not once. They don't even get mentioned in the rare weekender, top dj's in the other threads. Its time people who think they are moving forward actually look inwards not outwards at the various Oldies scenes to see why current days are FUBAR.

Off for a lie down, I may be comatose for some days.

Edited July 6, 2012 by jocko

[jocko]

I just like soul ......... all soul ........ tall soul, small soul, fat soul, thin soul, gay soul.

If it's good, then play it out .... don't matter if the Wigan stomper / Brid Weekender main room / Stafford / 100 Club fans don't rate it ....

......... don't matter if it's rare or common ...... don't matter if it's 'blaxplotation soul' even ........ if it gets the feet moving, play it.

Its not about you, as hard as that is to believe, and your taste though is it, its about music played on a scene that I suspect you have had little to do with for 30 years, only 25 years more than me before some smart ass comments!

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[Benji]

"Bunji".

Oi Stove, I saw that!

[jocko]

like the JJ Callier pusherman?

Why would you call that second rate, I get the point you are sort of making, but as this is about scene type records this is going to be judged on differing values of first and second rate than you are making.

Although as always historically and aesthetically you are probably more correct! The Strange World of NS and all that.......

[boba]

Why would you call that second rate, I get the point you are sort of making, but as this is about scene type records this is going to be judged on differing values of first and second rate than you are making.

I didn't call it second rate or offer my opinion of it at all. I was giving it as an example of the "Blacksploitation" style funk which this record clearly is. Does Joan dislike this record?

[jocko]

I didn't call it second rate or offer my opinion of it at all. I was giving it as an example of the "Blacksploitation" style funk which this record clearly is. Does Joan dislike this record?

Sorry Bob, I was just judging it on you responding to Joan's quote.

My best advise is don't try and analyse or understand this sort of categorisation of records or styles, its more about NS tastes. Having spent over 20 years around this world I am not actually sure I understand it....

[jocko]

I didn't call it second rate or offer my opinion of it at all. I was giving it as an example of the "Blacksploitation" style funk which this record clearly is. Does Joan dislike this record?

PS Do you ever sleep? :D