play that acetate...and other tales

[Mike]

word going round that someone playing out a cobbled together version of "a certain famous one off"

alledgely dub made up from putting together radio clips

lol with this, cant wait till hear "this is jazz fm" come out over the speakers at a event

seems that theres a fair few similar things going on, with more tales of "djs" passing off stuff that isnt what they say it is

[Guest Stuart T]

seems that theres a fair few similar things going on, with more tales of "djs" passing off stuff that isnt what they say it is

What, covering up the artist and label and calling it something else? What will the sneaky buggers think of next!

[Mike]

yeah the devils

nah meant along lines of originals, lookalikes, laser scans etc etc

give me a hour of a honest enthusastic soul dj with a box full of 10 quid records rather than a set by dj who has to lie about them

[Chalky]

What's the knocked together track you mention Mike and dare I ask who is spinning it? Would be funny hearing the Jazz FM jingle like you say over the speakers ;-)

[Guest]

The owner of the record is VERY VERY ANGRY. the record was pieced together and played (apparently) but now its been copied and is being played by other DJ's all pretty sad stuff! Chalky you really must read some DJ's play lists :-)

[Guest]

Are we also talking about that record on the blue label? teehee

The Devil made me do it ;-)

[Chalky]

The owner of the record is VERY VERY ANGRY.  the record was pieced together and played (apparently) but now its been copied and is being played by other DJ's all pretty sad stuff!  Chalky you really must read some DJ's play lists :-)

The one I'm thinking of that I saw on a DJ's playlist belongs to Rob Thomas/Andy Rix and was being played by someone else. It ain't knocked together though.

[Guest]

The one I'm thinking of that I saw on a DJ's playlist belongs to Rob Thomas/Andy Rix and was being played by someone else. It ain't knocked together though.

No its a copy!

And the knocked together one is obviously no longer needed since its now been copied

[Chalky]

No its a copy!

And the knocked together one is obviously no longer needed since its now been copied

I know it's a copy, we both know who copied it :-/

[Guest]

I can only assume the person who borrowed it copied the record, I have no idea if that is true or not!

[grant]

what's the record????????????/

[Guest Johnny One Trout]

Is this another one? presumably not the Butch and Ady thing?

JoT

[Guest]

Is this another one? presumably not the Butch and Ady thing?

JoT

This has nothing to do with Butch and Ady

[Guest in town Mikey]

And to think, I took a few knocks when I criticised the fact that people put up scans and song sound clips. And people actually asked for both!!

I thought it was a little niave to think that nobody would abuse this. The goings on since Modstock have not calmed any fears I have over the morals of SOME on the scene.

I am not saying for one second this is what has happened. I just wanted another chance to fight my corner ;-)

[Guest Stuart T]

give me a hour of a honest enthusastic soul dj with a box full of 10 quid records rather than a set by dj who has to lie about them

Too right. A friend was behind the decks with a former Rocket DJ (not the obvious one) a few years back and half his big sounds were cuts with lookalike labels. What a twat. Sadly most people didn't care and won't care about this latest rip off.

[Guest in town Mikey]

Is that why people were discouraged from going up to the decks to ask for requests??

[Guest Stuart T]

I think that was a certain large ego who had already decided what he was going to play, and was probably also worried that people might take the piss and ask for things that they knew he hadn't got. After all, everyone already knew that his big sounds were a complete bloody con.

[stomper45]

mike, you started another thread bout this sorta thing "crimewatch or a soul site"

i dont get over to many uk events so not well up on scene but cant understand

1) Why is this dj invited to play at NS venues

2) why do other NS dj's agree to play at same event.

3) why do NS people go to pay/hear this dj.

4) Why doesnt someone get off the fence and confront/name them if they have proof.

if this person is playing/promoting himself at a non 100% NS venue where people are hearing music for 1st time and are unaware of NS ethics then i wouldnt care labels he uses though agree his methods of obtaining some sounds are out of order and must be stopped.

maybe its more complicated (is he in the mafia or masons?) as said am detached from uk scene but ask again who invites/co djs/attends the events where this person is appearing...shouldnt you confront him and promoter there and then?

hope these "outside" thoughts make sense.

Danny D

[Mike]

yeah Danny its all getting a bit surreal and now wondering why bother with all this crap, its supposed to be a soul site and ....

You ask 4 valid questions that deserve an answer

going offline to try and answer them meself now and post when done

for simple reason feel that if myself or others can't answer anyone asking such basic questions then ... whats the point of it all

[Guest Stuart T]

1) Why is this dj invited to play at NS venues

2) why do other NS dj's agree to play at same event.

3) why do NS people go to pay/hear this dj.

4) Why doesnt someone get off the fence and confront/name them if they have proof.

if this person is playing/promoting himself at a non 100% NS venue where people are hearing music for 1st time and are unaware of NS ethics then i wouldnt care labels he uses though agree his methods of obtaining some sounds are out of order and must be stopped.

maybe its more complicated (is he in the mafia or masons?) as said am detached from uk scene but ask again who invites/co djs/attends the events where this person is appearing...shouldnt you confront him and promoter there and then?

hope these "outside" thoughts make sense.

Danny D

Danny, (I hope Mike doesn't mind me diving in but I'm feeling opinionated) my views on the first three:

1. Many promoters only care that they have a DJ on that they think will attract punters (there are honourable exceptions, of course) or hes a mate of the promoter.

2. A lot of other DJs just want a booking (again, there are exceptions). Quite a few of them are up to the same sort of thing.

3. Probably the majority of the people attending clubs don't know about these shenanigans, nor do they care (see comments about people not caring whether a DJ plays originals, reissues, CDs etc). They are only out to have a good time, not that interested in what goes on behind the scenes. They may only have one event a month/quarter/year locally so its hard to expect them to miss an event because of one dodgy DJ (who they probably don't know is dodgy, nor do they understand what all the fuss is about). NS ethics are probably only relevant to a limited number of people, and we appear to have made up our own rules - although I think that they are the right ones.

Of course, this may not be giving enough credit - for instance did people stop going to The Rocket because it was undermined by the 4 Vandals etc saga, or did they just not think it was worth the effort? Bit of both? It started off with a lot of people attending (albeit a large amount on freebies, people who never came again) and then ended up more than half empty.

All IMHO of course. I'm sure that theres other reasons which other people will come up with.

[Simon T]

Come on and put me out of my misery - "name that tune"! Is it Jimmy Radcliffe The Thrill of Loving You?

[stomper45]

Hi Stuart thanks for your views, i noticed that you didnt reply to question 4 either and so for me and many others still dont know who the dodgy dealer/promoter's are,

the wrongdoing will continue, maybe we will unknowingly pay to attend a gig or hire them in future?

yeah many just might flit in/out and have a good time...I think most soulies dedicated enough to view this and other sites deserve to know the information and make informed decisions themselves.

you mention the rocket, it was well marketed but after a while like many clubs it couldnt hold onto punters, maybe some didnt find it passionate enough! trouble is when too many clubs compete for same punters unless its better it can affect the longer established outlets...the "four vandals" saga was by all accounts a claim that this was a rare 6ts "find",If track was presented as a reworked instrumental that would have been ok, luckily collectors are knowledgable lot not to be hood-winked, i dont see this record gaining many plays or exchanging hands for vast sums now (tho as said dont get out alot in uk).

What i couldnt understand is that later some sites were promoting and people purchasing a cd for this "rare" track? even when rumblings about its authenticity started.

if my information is correct then this was a discraceful episode, however if i'm wrong i will apologise.

Mike i hope you keep going with all the crap, you run a good site, albeit imo it went a little too monkey for a while but is now back to its best. theres alot of good will and soulies out there to keep the thing going and hopefully have a few more good times and friendships to make yet.

Danny D

[Chalky]

Come on and put me out of my misery - "name that tune"! Is it Jimmy Radcliffe The Thrill of Loving You?

No it's not Jimmy Radcliffe. That record is widely available on the internet anyway if you know where to look.

[Ady Croasdell]

If it's who I would think it is, he's probably a good indicator as to the moral values of the venue; ie if he's on they ain't got none. He's never DJed at a 6TS dance and never will.

[Simon T]

"switch around"?

[Markw]

the "four vandals" saga was by all accounts a claim that this was a rare 6ts "find",If track was presented as a reworked instrumental that would have been ok, luckily collectors are knowledgable lot not to be hood-winked, i dont see this record gaining many plays or exchanging hands for vast sums now (tho as said dont get out alot in uk).

Unfortunately, there were a surprising number of well-known and supposedly knowledgeable collectors and DJs who were sucked into this particular scam. Brings into question how discerning are many people on the scene.

[Mike]

no probs jumping in Stuart

have to say Danny, that after giving your qs a bit of thought sad to say all can't come up with ought worthwhile on 1 2 or 3

and though a cop out have to say only way can find out why people are willing to support thieves, liars and all the rest of them is to ask them direct !

as after thought all

only reasons I could come up with is

ignorance, greed or involvement

surely that can't be right

perhaps anyone reading this who supports such types can answer , I will from now on certainly ask them at every opportunity

on Q 4

can give an answer fom my point of view at least

Simply mis-placed sense of "do the right thing"

time after time, myself has bit the bullet and said keep this to myself, dont put this up as do no good and so on

time has proved that this does not work

as each time have done this, the people involved have come back with even more dirtier and greater outrages

as it doesn't work, its time for other ways

[Guest]

We're still no closer to knowing what the track is...I'm intrigued. Obviously the name of the DJ can't be mentioned, will it be obvious when the track is mentioned who it is?

Cobbling together stuff off the radio/net is not on but where do we sit on getting acetates cut of unissued stuff? Obviously getting an acetate cut of a rare track and playing it out is also not on but acetates of unissued stuff? If acetates are to be played should they be only studio acetates? There's some great unissued Motown knocking about and with most venues and DJs refusing to use CD players isn't it better to get an acetate cut of that unissued tune and see people dance to it?

I know Andy Rix has been playing Kim Weston's Don't Let Me Down for a couple of years now I don't know if that's an original studio acetate or whether he got it cut off the master tapes but I paid £50 for an acetate of it and feel justified in playing it out because it's unissued. The flip however is a Barbara McNair track from one of her rare albums which has never seen a needle at a venue as I wouldn't spin it. It's really down to the ethics of the DJ. If you run the type of venue where reissues or boots are accepted then by all means play whatever you want but don't try to pass it off as something it's not.

[TheBigO]

Agree with Paulie on the whole on this one. We supply CD decks for that purpose (also as a back up if the decks go tits-up on us!) and I have no problems with the spinning of unissued material, be it on CD or acetate cut from it. At the end of the day it's the music that is all important and if it's only available on CD then play it. On the whole the majority of punters don't care, they are out for a good time. If anyone asks what a track was then I tell them it's off a CD or whatever, I can't see the point of getting a copy of the label and passing off an acetate as a 'real' one. I think we all know this debate is going to go on and on, like many of the fueds on the scene in the past, and we have to accept that as fact with little chance of changing it, or any of the old debates (60's Vs 70's etc etc). Just a quick reply as I'm off out the door now.

[stomper45]

Mike & all i will respond after THE match, "come on u boys in green"

[stomper45]

hey well footballwise not too bad for all cept Scotland tonite.

Mike H, in hindsight as you run this site you really should stay impartial. The big O well I aint lyin ... a change is gonna come.

Having bought my mel britt/Anderson bros/skull snaps etc in mid 7ts I realised (slowly) all aint what it seems on paper(label)... djs being "fed" records, car "boots" to supply the kids did this really take place in them innocent once upon a times.

I have no problem with people running clubs selling records/magazines/cds/records/weekends or djn and making good money if end result is we all have a good time too if (they) have a genuine passion for this thing well that's an added bonus.

The irish scene could be a microcosm of the uk.

(This is not meant as an advertisement and feel free to slag me....as u do)

When we started Sleepless Nights over 2years ago the scene here was justabout dead. I decided to allow boots/reissues to be played at our new club in order to encourage the new dj's on the scene and the fact new soulies njoy dancing to Salvadors, Del Larks, F Beverley et al., just as u guys do in the established "legal" scene of uk...

Got loads of smart remarks bout this from within Ireland and various "cool" UK sites. but say ur startin a club in North Albania (is there any difference to living in Southern Albania) well I'd use c90 tapes, mp3's and radio recordings if it helps. Yes lots of good £ 10 records out there but we didn't have the time/opportunity to source, remember not talking about the established (healthy!) accessible/well paid sometimes UK scene. But we were open about it, people can knock policy and dicuss agree to disagree and being upfront..

Each month we have progressed, stakes get a little higher, most djs play no boots now that's evolution, no dj/promoter is making a killing here from appearance/event money we, like most do it for love...but we now hav a passionate young crowd as will be testified by those that visit here.

I've had people knocking the playlists, regular dj format, attempting to start opposing clubs but tell me a promoter who aint... called it as I see it and when SN goes stale and stops adding to the Irish scene I'll b 1st to know.

Boots- (the lazymans way of adding to ur playlist) locally I feel is ok, know one is gonna b a big time player playin solely say stardust in Dublin, given time/experience professionally a dj realises he needs to try find his own tunes and that he will never hear his top 5 all time favourites, coz he's now constantly looking for such tunes. The new punter likewise for most part at least initially doesn't care wot the format is but like the dj there is progression.

But truly we should realise the pain and cost that allows the constant unearthing of "new" tunes, keeping this scene moving on.. respect to those main movers who spend small fortunes in time/money on this passion...(even if working within the record industry makes it easier and am not talking bout the djs who just "buy" their playlist or even worse the dj who "creates/copies" his set.

Cd- am not a big lover of these things, sexless, sterile compared to a slab of spinning vinyl...., only good in a car so why do new album compilations in particular from motown appear just in this format?.. Its our passion for vinyl that is the main catalyst for its release aint it..so LP please. Can I pay for converting an mp3 of Barbara Mercer's "My dear heart" too vinyl? I wanna dance to it but only on vinyl (odd behaviour I know)

Anyway the tribulations of a paddy aren't a big issue for most of you.

Andy Rix find "switch around" Nige Brown u found another one (didn't you?) great!

Ady's "Strings a go go" lo and behold someone else (is it Kev Roberts?) has it on his playlist too... I need tips on tracking down these sorta things.

Somebody reckons Manchester can support 2 monthly all niters on same night wow the scene is positively gushing with new material/opportunities now, time for another compilation CD... hey if all artists are dead/washed up we can send royalties to a nominated trust...................

Excuse me if there are inaccuracies in above am not that close to the UK scene ....nor do I wanna be but am aware this is where its all happening at the moment.

Let me know where I'm going wrong, probably should stay quiet but I just pressed the send button.. f8ck maybe when I awake it'll b ok (hope).

Danny D