Hit With Big Customs Duty & Import Vat Charges

[Guest sharmo 1]

Best thing here is to take it on the chin get the record and bare in mind any "add on's" that may evolve with future deals , With the state of the world at the moment people selling to the U.K may have to face the fact that we're looking at devaluation to offset exspence's incured here in the U.K. it's bad enough in the U.K with fuel duties ect they even tax you on a bit of music .As Steve said you don't get vat on top of the value of the record but it is inclusive when buying from a dealer/company who's turnover exceeds the vat threashold so if a guy sells for a hundred he's only going to realise eighty quid .I think there's the odd loophole records over a certain age can be deemed antiques who's vat rating is low or zero I'm not sure which and some people or company's can charge vat on commision as in auctions so they can charge vat only on the profit and not on the total.For some dealers becomming vat regestered can be devistating as automaticly their stock becomes devalued by 20% also any imports will be 20% less profitable as imports from non European country's will not be subject to vat and therefore there is nothing to offset the vat total.No wonder the small independant music outlets are struggling .regards Simon.

[NEV]

Sorry - didn't mean to stir up a hornets nest of controversy

Thanks for the positive comments guys.

Now I have a dilemma. The seller has agreed to take the item back and re-post it - but uninsured.

The warnings about the item going missing or taking ages are scary.

Think I might ask them to do a 3rd party insurer like Bob suggested.

For those interested the customs fees were in excess of 25% of the price I paid.

Cheers

Richard

HI Richard

Moralistic issues aside ,I would agree with Bob ....its a bitter pill to swallow ,but i would pay the fee and draw a line under it.

If your a collector and value the record and don't want all the stress of waiting a long time and off chance it may not turn up .

The fact is ,a minority of non Usa buyers have been a bit naughty and duped innocent sellers by saying items have not arrived and falsified Paypal claims,leaving some sellers with no choice but to protect their interests by declaring full value .

In future make a point of asking seller beforehand about posting preferences?

It's all about communication and most Usa sellers are happy to tailor a deal but if you don't discuss prior ,it could prove costly.

It's all about trust so its worth while to suggest a registered mail option to give the seller some protection.This option can be done without declaring value..After all..a fully insured post does not guarantee delivery anymore so than registered.

[Premium Stuff]

Thanks for all the advice guys - much appreciated

I'm going to sleep on it and decide what to do in the morning

Cheers

Richard

[Steve G]

welcome to the soul source unpopular members club, we have meetings every tuesday night from 7-8PM.

Is this when you discuss the merits of British comedy Bob?

Edited September 8, 2011 by Steve G

[MELS]

Got to agree with Julesp on this. If you can afford a reasonably high priced single, don't complain when you're asked to pay the tax it should attract. If you can get away with it, fine, but if you get caught then pay up - you'll be a long way ahead overall.

I buy records to play; not to sell, not to dj with. To quote Richard "I think the 'gift' limit is GBP £40 and for commercial items it is GBP £18." So if I buy a moderately priced record for £20 from an American dealer, theoretically I could be charged tax plus £10 handling charge from the carrier? A hefty percentage on a not so high priced single.

If I'm an MP fiddling expenses and can afford a flight to the States and a fortnight in a penthouse would I be able to carry the record through customs as part of my duty free allowance or would I just escape the carrier charge?

[AlanB]

boba, on 08 September 2011 - 11:20 PM, said:

welcome to the soul source unpopular members club, we have meetings every tuesday night from 7-8PM.

Is this when you discuss the merits of British comedy Bob?

No, it's where they suggest playing CDs at venues and making a movie about Northern Soul.

Alan

[Steve G]

Bob A playing CDs????? - in the words of the Detroit classic "NEVER in a million years".

[Marc Forrest]

.

Edited September 9, 2011 by Marc Forrest

[Guest julesp1905]

I agree with Steve at this point, it's worth eating the 150 pounds to ensure you get the record, rather than gambling that it will get back ok, paying shipping again, etc.

Also, Julesp1905, welcome to the soul source unpopular members club, we have meetings every tuesday night from 7-8PM.

Don't consider it a bad thing, after all didn't had any problems with pete smith taking my money previously lol, pretty sure he won't turn it down again.

[boba]

boba, on 08 September 2011 - 11:20 PM, said:

No, it's where they suggest playing CDs at venues and making a movie about Northern Soul.

Alan

We do love playing CDs (and bootlegs), making movies about northern soul, and watching monty python. This week though we're having an hour long chin-stroking session.

[Guest julesp1905]

We do love playing CDs (and bootlegs), making movies about northern soul, and watching monty python. This week though we're having an hour long chin-stroking session.

I'll grow a beard, and get some tesco cd's , shall i bring the counterfeit cigarettes and booze?

[Pete S]

Don't consider it a bad thing, after all didn't had any problems with pete smith taking my money previously lol, pretty sure he won't turn it down again.

Yes he will. As if I'm going to sell to someone calling me a crook.

Edited September 9, 2011 by Pete S

[Guest julesp1905]

Yes he will. As if I'm going to sell to someone calling me a crook.

Really, please highlight where I have called you a "Crook" think you really need to take the time to read what has been written

[Pete S]

Really, please highlight where I have called you a "Crook" think you really need to take the time to read what has been written

"no better than bent MP's and filthy bankers"

[Premium Stuff]

How about here?

You lot sound like a bunch of petty criminals discussing ways of avoiding paying tax. no better than bent MP's and filthy bankers

Please don't say you only said "sound like ..." rather than "are a bunch of petty criminals ..." and think that makes it a different post.

Richard

Edited September 9, 2011 by Premium Stuff

[Guest julesp1905]

"no better than bent MP's and filthy bankers"

Don't see me calling you a crook there! as a said take care to read what has been written, not what you conclude

[Guest julesp1905]

How about here

Richard

Think your find it says "Sounds Like" at no time have i directly called anybody a crook, again please take time to read and understand what has been written

[Premium Stuff]

Think your find it says "Sounds Like" at no time have i directly called anybody a crook, again please take time to read and understand what has been written

And I had said:

Please don't say you only said "sound like ..." rather than "are a bunch of petty criminals ..." and think that makes it a different post.

In any case, the test is how your post came across to people reading it - regardless of your intent in writing it.

Whether inadvertently insensitive, or deliberately provocative the outcome was the same.

No point in you splitting hairs about it now.

Richard

Edited September 9, 2011 by Premium Stuff

[Guest julesp1905]

And I had said:

In any case, the test is how your post came across to people reading it - regardless of your intent in writing it.

Whether inadvertently insensitive, or deliberately provocative the outcome was the same.

No point in your splitting hairs about it now.

Richard

I am quite within my rights to defend my posts and as you have highlighted, i havn't called anybody a crook. thank you

[Docfish]

Discussing on a public forum, how to avoid custom fees is not really a clever move. Of course julep is right when saying it is against the law to trick around with an issue like that, custom fees are taxes and avoid paying them is tax evasion. It doesn't really matter, whether you feel this is fair or not. Do you guys think, that customs are not able to use google?

[Upthejunction]

Discussing on a public forum, how to avoid custom fees is not really a clever move. Of course julep is right when saying it is against the law to trick around with an issue like that, custom fees are taxes and avoid paying them is tax evasion. It doesn't really matter, whether you feel this is fair or not. Do you guys think, that customs are not able to use google?

Agree entirely with your comment, think a lot of these issues can be directly linked back to paypal and their attitude towards sellers, they invariably come down on the side of buyers, so sellers are sh*t scared about sending items without insurance and full tracking. Our world used to be an honorable one , but a few unscrupulous buyers and yes they are crooks, online fraudsters etc have changed all that IMHO

ATB Steve

[Premium Stuff]

Discussing on a public forum, how to avoid custom fees is not really a clever move.

As the topic starter I take your point. That said I have received a lot of good advice from this thread and I am very probably going to take the hit and pay the fees.

On picking which topics to discuss on SS I suppose the same could be said for threads about drugs, stealing cars to go to allnighters, selling and buying counterfeits.

Do you guys think, that customs are not able to use google?

Dunno - are they, and do they?

Cheers

Richard

[Chalky]

Stick to the topic please, which is should Richard pay the fees. Really no need for some of the posts just because you don't agree with what someone said, something that is, whether you like it or not technically/legally correct.

[Docfish]

Why is it off topic to discuss the legal matter of this?

[Chalky]

Why is it off topic to discuss the legal matter of this?

it isn't, I wasn't referring to those posts. Some of the posts directed at Jules are nothing to do with the paying of tax on imported goods or whether Richard should pay the tax.

[Pete S]

Stick to the topic please, which is should Richard pay the fees. Really no need for some of the posts just because you don't agree with what someone said, something that is, whether you like it or not technically/legally correct.

Talk about over moderating.

Did anyone look at this example, what do you think?

This is what I don't get.

Say 2 copies of a record go on ebay.

One sells for $5 because no one spots it.

The other is seen by everyone and goes for $500.

They both get sent to the Uk, one gets through as it's only worth $5, the other gets done for £100 tax.

However, it's the same identical record.

How does that work then?

Edited September 9, 2011 by Pete S

[Marc Forrest]

.

Edited September 9, 2011 by Marc Forrest

[Chalky]

Pete why do you have to challenge everything said? Already said (which I'm sure you've read but thought you'd post anyway) the discussion of tax isn't off topic however some of the posts are little or nothing to do with Richards q or the payment of tax on imported records.

In reply to your query how on earth do the officers at customs and excise know what is in the package? They can only go on what the sender has declared.

And if you can't buy and sell for a profit after paying your dues then you shouldn't really be making the purchase in the first place. If import duty is say £15 and that is your profit then it is bad business buying in the first place is it not?

[Guest MBarrett]

How does that work then?

Pete,

I would say it's because it's the transaction that is being taxed not the item - and the transactions are different.

Don't shoot the messenger . . . . . . . !

MB

[Guest julesp1905]

Talk about over moderating.

Did anyone look at this example, what do you think?

This is what I don't get.

Say 2 copies of a record go on ebay.

One sells for $5 because no one spots it.

The other is seen by everyone and goes for $500.

They both get sent to the Uk, one gets through as it's only worth $5, the other gets done for £100 tax.

However, it's the same identical record.

How does that work then?

You pay import duty on the value of the goods you are importing, one is valued @$5 so attracts no tax, the other is valued @$500 so does, the fact they are the same record has no bearing on the matter, all that counts is their value at the point of sale.

[MrsWoodsrules]

Hi folks,

What is the threshold for an imported record to become liaible for import tax?

I've never been hit with this, don't know if I've not been liable or just lucky in the way my records were dispatched, mind you, I've never paid more than low hundreds in my life.

Got to say, although I wouldn't knowingly avoid any taxes due (cough cough), I would certainly think twice in the first place about making a purchase that's gonna cost me 25% more on my doorstep.

Good job I'm a cheapstake & got a good eye for a bargain, others call it tight.

Cheers Aid.

[Chalky]

Hi folks,

What is the threshold for an imported record to become liaible for import tax?

I've never been hit with this, don't know if I've not been liable or just lucky in the way my records were dispatched, mind you, I've never paid more than low hundreds in my life.

Got to say, although I wouldn't knowingly avoid any taxes due (cough cough), I would certainly think twice in the first place about making a purchase that's gonna cost me 25% more on my doorstep.

Good job I'm a cheapstake & got a good eye for a bargain, others call it tight.

Cheers Aid.

£36.

https://reviews.ebay.co.uk/U-K-Import-Duty-And-Taxes-Hidden-Charges-To-Remember_W0QQugidZ10000000002543327

[Pete S]

Pete why do you have to challenge everything said? Already said (which I'm sure you've read but thought you'd post anyway) the discussion of tax isn't off topic however some of the posts are little or nothing to do with Richards q or the payment of tax on imported records.

In reply to your query how on earth do the officers at customs and excise know what is in the package? They can only go on what the sender has declared.

And if you can't buy and sell for a profit after paying your dues then you shouldn't really be making the purchase in the first place. If import duty is say £15 and that is your profit then it is bad business buying in the first place is it not?

You have to take what you can get Chalky.

[Chalky]

You have to take what you can get Chalky.

Suppose you do Pete, never bought for resale, or only odd one or two, always been for me and rarely use it these days as all the charges often render it not worth the effort.

[MrsWoodsrules]

£36.

https://reviews.ebay.co.uk/U-K-Import-Duty-And-Taxes-Hidden-Charges-To-Remember_W0QQugidZ10000000002543327

Bloody heck... Thought it was much higher than that.

If I was buying & mint Gene Toones or Chico Lamaar (which I won't be) I'd take the hit on the import tax, otherwise, take my chances that the disks gets to me in one piece tax free.

[Pete S]

Suppose you do Pete, never bought for resale, or only odd one or two, always been for me and rarely use it these days as all the charges often render it not worth the effort.

Well I'll give you an example, I bought a record off Ebay for myself the other week, The Volumes - Just can't help myself, it was the black demo which is pretty rare - cost me about 70 quid. If I was going to resell it, which I inevitably will in a few months, I'd want 100 for it I think. But if it gets stopped and I get charged 25/30 on it, the profits gone straight away. A lot of people buy for a tenner to sell at twenty cos at the end of the day, it all adds up. I've sold two dozen ten and twenty quiders this week I think, and am well pleased with that.

[Premium Stuff]

Hi folks,

What is the threshold for an imported record to become liaible for import tax?

I've never been hit with this, don't know if I've not been liable or just lucky in the way my records were dispatched, mind you, I've never paid more than low hundreds in my life.

Got to say, although I wouldn't knowingly avoid any taxes due (cough cough), I would certainly think twice in the first place about making a purchase that's gonna cost me 25% more on my doorstep.

Good job I'm a cheapstake & got a good eye for a bargain, others call it tight.

Cheers Aid.

£36.

https://reviews.ebay....000000002543327

The info sent to me by Parcelforce said the thresholds differ:

Gift - limit is GBP £40

Commercial - limit is GBP £18

Cheers

Richard

[Chalky]

I bought a record few months ago for around £18 and ended up paying £11 in tax cause the muppet I bought it off didn't mark as gift.

[Pete S]

I bought a record few months ago for around £18 and ended up paying £11 in tax cause the muppet I bought it off didn't mark as gift.

That's exactly the sort of example I'm talking about.

[Guest julesp1905]

I think the real problem lies with the fact that people don't take into consideration potential duty taxes when buying from outside the EU, the vast majority of records get through without incurring charges. it is then taken as the norm and comes as a shock when it's applied.

What gripes most people is the handling charge

i understand the frustration at having to pay a £10 handling charge to the postal carrier, though i do know for a fact that Royal Mail pay the import duty on the buyers behalf to get the item released from customs, they have to employ dedicated units to handle the stuff. Postcomm the independant body appointed by the government approve the charge, it is not one that carriers dictate themselves but one they are allowed to levy to cover their costs.

Duty excess charged packet and parcels use to come through the RM network with normal mail, many going uncollected as items were delivered as normal, it is only in the last few years that items have started coming through with tracked and special delivery items, hence an increase in items getting caught and charged, though i still believe it is still a very small percentage of items that could attract charges

Edited September 9, 2011 by julesp1905

[Chalky]

That's exactly the sort of example I'm talking about.

Think I paid $27 then the £11. Record was still worth more than I paid plus it was something I wanted so wasn't too worried.

P.S. I think ten quid was the handling charge to Royal Mail....£1 tax....b*stards!

[Ady Potts]

Some years ago I got hit for something like £175 duties/vat/handling fee on a record, we contacted the seller to let her know. She replied "Just enjoy the record".

I will say, I'm glad I didn't risk refusing to pay the fee & have the record sent back, because years have passed & the value of the record has gone up so much from the original purchase price.

So I'd personally just grit my teeth & pay it. But there's nothing then stopping you from contacting the seller & see if they'd perhaps give you a bit of a refund to help towards it.

Good luck !

pottsy

[Premium Stuff]

Some years ago I got hit for something like £175 duties/vat/handling fee on a record, we contacted the seller to let her know. She replied "Just enjoy the record".

I will say, I'm glad I didn't risk refusing to pay the fee & have the record sent back, because years have passed & the value of the record has gone up so much from the original purchase price.

So I'd personally just grit my teeth & pay it. But there's nothing then stopping you from contacting the seller & see if they'd perhaps give you a bit of a refund to help towards it.

Good luck !

pottsy

Thanks for the advice Pottsy - I actually emailed the seller earlier today suggesting just that.

I guess some sellers could potentially just pay the fees and write them off for business tax purposes? Anyone know for sure how it works in the US please?

I'm definitely being persuaded along the lines of paying the charges, rather than sending the record back.

Cheers

Richard

Edited September 9, 2011 by Premium Stuff

[Guest julesp1905]

Thanks for the advice Pottsy - I actually emailed the seller earlier today suggesting just that.

I guess some sellers could potentially just pay the fees and write them off for business tax purposes? Anyone know for sure how it works in the US please?

I'm definitely being persuaded along the lines of paying the charges, rather than sending the record back.

Cheers

Richard

Import Duties are the sole responsibility of the buyer, the seller has nothing to do with them, as previously said, with the way paypal is now, it is becoming unwise for sellers to send high value items uninsured, they have to cover themselves, that in most cases means declaring full value of the item.

[Premium Stuff]

Import Duties are the sole responsibility of the buyer, the seller has nothing to do with them, as previously said, with the way paypal is now, it is becoming unwise for sellers to send high value items uninsured, they have to cover themselves, that in most cases means declaring full value of the item.

We have covered all this above thank you very much :sleep3:

You already implied I'm a 'petty criminal' - please don't start suggesting I'm stupid too

Richard

[Steve G]

But there's nothing then stopping you from contacting the seller & see if they'd perhaps give you a bit of a refund to help towards it.

Good luck !

pottsy

Doesn't look very good does it? You sell a record for an agreed price, get paid net of paypal deductions, then someone comes back with a tale of their customs charges and asks for some money back? It's probably a good job I'm not a record seller

[Guest julesp1905]

We have covered all this above thank you very much :sleep3:

You already implied I'm a 'petty criminal' - please don't start suggesting I'm stupid too

Richard

Really then why write "I guess some sellers could potentially just pay the fees and write them off for business tax purposes"

these are your own words not mine

I do Hope you enjoy your record "Richard"

Edited September 9, 2011 by julesp1905

[Ady Potts]

Doesn't look very good does it? You sell a record for an agreed price, get paid net of paypal deductions, then someone comes back with a tale of their customs charges and asks for some money back? It's probably a good job I'm not a record seller

I was talking about the customs duty, not the record cost. It doesn't hurt to ask the seller, does it ? Richard has said "I am planning to contact the seller....." so obviously the seller doesn't even realise that Richard has had to pay this fee.

But you are a record seller, I've bought off you in the past.

[Ged Parker]

Take the hit pay the fees would be my advice.

Some years ago I got hit for almost £2k in customs charges and VAT. I had 123 boxes of records delivered and it was the 122nd box that customs stopped and then charged me on the whole consignment.

Didn't like the fact thats that the customs charge was on the whole value of the transaction including the shipping and then the VAT was on the whole transation including the customs charge.

Still paid it though.

[Premium Stuff]

Take the hit pay the fees would be my advice.

Some years ago I got hit for almost £2k in customs charges and VAT. I had 123 boxes of records delivered and it was the 122nd box that customs stopped and then charged me on the whole consignment.

Didn't like the fact thats that the customs charge was on the whole value of the transaction including the shipping and then the VAT was on the whole transation including the customs charge.

Still paid it though.

Puts my little example into perspective Ged

Cheers

Richard