Funky 4 Corners Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 In a recent post I prepared on groovesvilleusa.com/blog I mentioned that the story behind Darrell Banks being released on London and then Stateside within days has never been fully explained (to me anyway). I did consult half a dozen collectors whose knowledge I respect but no one could offer any facts. Does anyone know what the true story was?
Dave Pinch Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 decca probably jumped the gun when they issued it as the contract wasnt finalised. stateside put it out but then they never took up the option on other releases. the other few bits that came out here seem to have been issued by polydor dave
Guest POTTERIESPECK Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 RICHARD SEARLING USED TO HAVE A LONDON DEMO COPY, DON'T KNOW IF HE STILL OWNS IT.
Julianb Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 Thought they were all yellow demos - never seen an issue!
Guest TONY ROUNCE Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 The audio is better on the Stateside, which was mastered from a tape. The London demo is mastered from a mint minus Revilot 45. I've heard the Stateside and London tape transfers for both, and can confirm this as absolute fact....
Dave Pinch Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 Thought they were all yellow demos - never seen an issue! there is a south african london silver top copy.................thats the nearest youll get i`m afraid dave
Pete S Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 there is a south african london silver top copy.................thats the nearest youll get i`m afraid dave I think that's a 'supposedly' to be honest - I remember it being a very strong rumour in the early 2000's as someone is meant to have found one at Brighton record fair, but I don't think anyone's seen it - happy to be proved wrong
Guest TONY ROUNCE Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 I think that's a 'supposedly' to be honest - I remember it being a very strong rumour in the early 2000's as someone is meant to have found one at Brighton record fair, but I don't think anyone's seen it - happy to be proved wrong Indeed. SA London 45s from the period that OTDTYH would have been released out there did not have a silver top - in fact they had the old 'script' top like pre-1959 UK London 45 issues. Oh, yes, and most (if not all) SA London's from that mid 60s period have a red label, not a black one.... ...So highly 'supposedly', then!
45cellar Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 Here's the Green & White DEMO. What kind of time span did this all happen. London American, Stateside Red & White, Green & White.
Dave Pinch Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 Here's the Green & White DEMO. What kind of time span did this all happen. London American, Stateside Red & White, Green & White. green and white is 1969 roger as are the broader typeface issue copies dave
Dave Pinch Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 Indeed. SA London 45s from the period that OTDTYH would have been released out there did not have a silver top - in fact they had the old 'script' top like pre-1959 UK London 45 issues. Oh, yes, and most (if not all) SA London's from that mid 60s period have a red label, not a black one.... ...So highly 'supposedly', then! i`m sure i saw a scan of this one.......... might have been an irish pressing. wasnt it on ebay
Bigsoulman Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 (edited) Sorry I'm talking bollox Lenny Edited July 5, 2011 by BIGSOULMAN
45cellar Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 green and white is 1969 roger as are the broader typeface issue copies dave Thanks Dave.
De-to Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 Here's the Green & White DEMO. What kind of time span did this all happen. London American, Stateside Red & White, Green & White. and the uk red/white demo spelt wrong,"door of your heart",!!!
Billywhizz Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 I think that's a 'supposedly' to be honest - I remember it being a very strong rumour in the early 2000's as someone is meant to have found one at Brighton record fair, but I don't think anyone's seen it - happy to be proved wrong Kev Johanson picked up silver top copy in Brighton, played it at the Rocket 2001 I believe there was a big thing about it, px for Jim Gilstrap on Bell. Can anyone confirm that? Cheers Billy
De-to Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 (edited) and from canada... Edited July 5, 2011 by de-to
Pete S Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 (edited) Kev Johanson picked up silver top copy in Brighton, played it at the Rocket 2001 I believe there was a big thing about it, px for Jim Gilstrap on Bell. Can anyone confirm that? Cheers Billy Well he probably can seeing as he is Wiggyflat on here (posts up loads of UK's)! Edited July 5, 2011 by Pete S
Billywhizz Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 Well he probably can seeing as he is Wiggyflat on here (posts up loads of UK's)! u r joking young pete
Steve Plumb Posted July 5, 2011 Posted July 5, 2011 https://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300572366456&ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT I've a lovely issue copy on ebay at the moment Cheers Steve
Funky 4 Corners Posted July 6, 2011 Author Posted July 6, 2011 Around the mid 70s I went to the late Chris Savory's house on Sheppey and he showed me a single sided, dark green London test pressing of `Our Love is in the Pocket`, what a great coup it would be to have the pair!
Jerry Hipkiss Posted July 6, 2011 Posted July 6, 2011 Around the mid 70s I went to the late Chris Savory's house on Sheppey and he showed me a single sided, dark green London test pressing of `Our Love is in the Pocket`, what a great coup it would be to have the pair! Some years back an acetate of what would have been the London issue which was part of Pirate ship Radio London's library went through ebay - can't find any record of it now sadly...
Guest TONY ROUNCE Posted July 6, 2011 Posted July 6, 2011 I've done a ton of in-depth research on London, all over the world, for a 'Year By Year' series that I've been working on for Ace for the past couple of years. As far as I have been able to ascertain, the only two countries that used the same (or a similar) Silver Top design that UK London employed during the mid 60s, besides the UK, were Eire and New Zealand. All other countries that had a London label then had their own variations, most of which were based to one degree or another - as I said earlier- on the pre-ST designs that London used here between 1948 and 1959. Thus if OTDTYH does exist on a Silver Top, it's likely to be either ROI or NZ in origin....
Derek Pearson Posted July 6, 2011 Posted July 6, 2011 Couldn't stop myself chipping in even though it doesn't answer any of Keith's original posting. When I was a nipper and still wearing shorts at all-nighters in the late seventies I regularly used to hear about a Darrell Banks black London issue that somebody had or had once seen. Grown men used to gasp just at the thought of it. Over the years with no copy ever surfacing I put its mythology down to a combination of over enthusiasm and white powder confusion. Then sometime in the 1990's this long term mystery was solved. The copy people were talking about wasn't infact a UK London black issue, it was a South African London black issue that looked very similar to the UK released black London issues of the day. I've got a sneaking feeling I might have even been sent a label scan of it which I duly posted up in a copy of 'Shades Of Soul' at the time. Does this story ring any bells with anyone? derek x And I don't think it was some sort of label mock up like the Volumes on UK Pama one which I fell for Roy Wright style...
Pete S Posted July 6, 2011 Posted July 6, 2011 The copy people were talking about wasn't infact a UK London black issue, it was a South African London black issue that looked very similar to the UK released black London issues of the day.
Dave Pinch Posted July 6, 2011 Posted July 6, 2011 Couldn't stop myself chipping in even though it doesn't answer any of Keith's original posting. When I was a nipper and still wearing shorts at all-nighters in the late seventies I regularly used to hear about a Darrell Banks black London issue that somebody had or had once seen. Grown men used to gasp just at the thought of it. Over the years with no copy ever surfacing I put its mythology down to a combination of over enthusiasm and white powder confusion. Then sometime in the 1990's this long term mystery was solved. The copy people were talking about wasn't infact a UK London black issue, it was a South African London black issue that looked very similar to the UK released black London issues of the day. I've got a sneaking feeling I might have even been sent a label scan of it which I duly posted up in a copy of 'Shades Of Soul' at the time. Does this story ring any bells with anyone? derek x And I don't think it was some sort of label mock up like the Volumes on UK Pama one which I fell for Roy Wright style... might be where i saw it derek. i certainly saw it somewhere as i`m not in the habit of making things up. there was certainly a scan of it . and it did say south africa........ but as tony rounce says i cant be south african as the label design doesnt tie in. therefore i think it was probably irish or even a mock up by somebody to get us all going and lets face it ......they suceed dave
Guest enchantedrythm Posted July 14, 2011 Posted July 14, 2011 THE STATESIDE CAME OUT 3 OR 4 TIMES ON THE SAME NUMBER-RED AND GREEN WHITE DEMOS THE REPORTED LONDON STOCK WAS A SOUTH AFRICAN RELEASE BLACK AND MAROON DEMOS (BRIAN RAE INFO) LONDON DEMOS IVE SEEN IN THREE DIFFERNT DESIGNS-FULLY TYPEFACED DARK YELLOW HAND WRITTEAND UNWRITTEN JUS 10700-BBC STAMP OWNED THE FIRST TWO THE MINT TYYPEFACED ONE AND HANDWRITTEN ONE CAME FROM JOHN ABBEY'S SOLD RECORD WHEN HE LEFT HIS WIFE FOR TAMIKO? 1979- JOHN MANSHIP HAD THE MINT TYPEFACED COPY OF ME A YEAR AFTER- £70 ITHINK WAS IT JOHN? STILL HAVE THE HANDWRITTEN JOPB SOMWHERE-ROUGH COPY THAT THE UNWRITTEN ONE I JUST CANT REMEMBER NOT RICHARD THOUGH-ANY VIEWS THERE SOULJER6 THE OTHER DEMO ISAW FROM A RADIO NMOTTS D.J-DENNOIS MCARTHY WHO HAD BBC MAIN LIB ACCESS-THE ONLY LEON YOUNG STRINGS PYE CAME TO STEVE ELLIOT SELECTA DISC VIA HIM, BUIT I DONT THINK HE WANTED TO MISSLAY TO MANY RECORDS- NEEDED MONEY TO BREED AFGANS
Kris Holmes Posted July 14, 2011 Posted July 14, 2011 New Zealand press, it never made it out on London here as far as I know.
Guest enchantedrythm Posted July 14, 2011 Posted July 14, 2011 very nice indeed,!!! THIS IS THE ABBEY-FLETCHER MANSHIP EXACT COPY
Pete S Posted July 14, 2011 Posted July 14, 2011 (edited) THIS IS THE ABBEY-FLETCHER MANSHIP EXACT COPY Well there's 250 - 300 of them look exactly the same as that, only difference is where the 225 timestamp is on the label Edited July 14, 2011 by Pete S
Guest TONY ROUNCE Posted July 14, 2011 Posted July 14, 2011 [quote name='enchantedrythm' timestamp='1310638687' post='160529 THE REPORTED LONDON STOCK WAS A SOUTH AFRICAN RELEASE BLACK AND MAROON DEMOS (BRIAN RAE INFO)
dthedrug Posted July 14, 2011 Posted July 14, 2011 Hi All ... Just to add my info on the London UK issue, I forget the name of the people who printed the labels for DECCA but I do recall reading about the London Issue way back in the 70s and not in a soul fanzine, but in a music trade magazine, where the question was asked if DECCA had pressed the copy as a stock issue, the reply was along the lines of the Demo came out right near the end of there license deal and EMI was going to distribute, Normally the record (Darrel Banks) would have come out as a LONDON issue, but as it was a minor hit in the US, EMI wanted to use it to launch it's new acquisition, And there was no objection from DECCA to argue over this record so the planned issue was stopped and I think there is about 14 weeks between the London Yellow Demo and the STATESIDE RELEASE, ii have never worked out the actual time, adding to this the LONDON STOCK Labels where printed at the same time as the yellow demo labels, now the only way a London stock copy can exist is if a worker got a label and did a 1 off? and although thee is no proof of a stock copy existing, it can not be ruled out, there is a similar situation with a T-REX single? I rate the RED & WHITE DEMO as rare what ever the answer is All the UK DEMOS are rare but the GREEN & WHITE DEMO is nice it is not in the same league as the RED & WHITE or the YELLOW and BLACK LONDON that does not exist would be worth a fortune, it would be good though if someone had some labels, as the T-REX missing number has labels?? I wish i could remember where I read this, but it is along them lines, DAVE
Pete S Posted July 14, 2011 Posted July 14, 2011 (edited) Hi All ... Just to add my info on the London UK issue, I forget the name of the people who printed the labels for DECCA but I do recall reading about the London Issue way back in the 70s and not in a soul fanzine, but in a music trade magazine, where the question was asked if DECCA had pressed the copy as a stock issue, the reply was along the lines of the Demo came out right near the end of there license deal and EMI was going to distribute, Normally the record (Darrel Banks) would have come out as a LONDON issue, but as it was a minor hit in the US, EMI wanted to use it to launch it's new acquisition, And there was no objection from DECCA to argue over this record so the planned issue was stopped and I think there is about 14 weeks between the London Yellow Demo and the STATESIDE RELEASE, ii have never worked out the actual time, adding to this the LONDON STOCK Labels where printed at the same time as the yellow demo labels, now the only way a London stock copy can exist is if a worker got a label and did a 1 off? and although thee is no proof of a stock copy existing, it can not be ruled out, there is a similar situation with a T-REX single? I rate the RED & WHITE DEMO as rare what ever the answer is All the UK DEMOS are rare but the GREEN & WHITE DEMO is nice it is not in the same league as the RED & WHITE or the YELLOW and BLACK LONDON that does not exist would be worth a fortune, it would be good though if someone had some labels, as the T-REX missing number has labels?? I wish i could remember where I read this, but it is along them lines, DAVE The T Rex record is just labels only Dave, no vinyl ever made. It's called something like Christmas Bop. * unless you mean Ride A White Swan which has test pressings with a matrix for OCTOPUS records but they renamed it FLY at the last minute Edited July 14, 2011 by Pete S 1
Dave Pinch Posted July 15, 2011 Posted July 15, 2011 (edited) only 2 weeks between the london demo and R & W stateside demo........................ london 19th aug 66 & stateside 2nd sept 1966.......... where as labels of the christmas bop 45 have been sighted darrell banks uk london has not .if it had been pressed it would surely have surfaced in the last 45 years dave Edited July 15, 2011 by dave pinch
Citizen P Posted July 15, 2011 Posted July 15, 2011 As an aside, when was this finally deleted on Stateside ??? As, it would have been one of the first " Northern" records I bought-ordered from the Catalogue in my local record shop-when you could still do such things- around late '72. Tony
Gene-r Posted July 15, 2011 Posted July 15, 2011 As an aside, when was this finally deleted on Stateside ??? As, it would have been one of the first " Northern" records I bought-ordered from the Catalogue in my local record shop-when you could still do such things- around late '72. Tony Good point Tony - I could be wrong, but I'm sure I once saw the later Stateside issue with fat lettering, but with a 'tapered' edge - typical of EMI 7" vinyl from 1972 onwards. Would that be right?
Citizen P Posted July 15, 2011 Posted July 15, 2011 Good point Tony - I could be wrong, but I'm sure I once saw the later Stateside issue with fat lettering, but with a 'tapered' edge - typical of EMI 7" vinyl from 1972 onwards. Would that be right? Now, I'm good but I'm not that good Don't have it anymore, so, I can neither confirm nor deny. ATB Tony
Dave Pinch Posted July 15, 2011 Posted July 15, 2011 (edited) Good point Tony - I could be wrong, but I'm sure I once saw the later Stateside issue with fat lettering, but with a 'tapered' edge - typical of EMI 7" vinyl from 1972 onwards. Would that be right? 70`s issues should have the fat typeface and be minus the `sold in uk ` on the center...............any body put up a scan of one.emi started using thinner `tapered edge vinyl in mid 72... i personally cant recall seeing an OTDTYH like that....i would like to see it dave Edited July 15, 2011 by dave pinch
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