Northern Soul Deejay's Of The Future ?

[Md Records]

Do you think that the age of the D.J. is necessarily relevant to the scene they are playing to?

Des Parker

[Mark Howell]

No Des, it's all about the audience enjoyment, as surely that is the aim of the DJ?

Our lot are into the music and that visceral, indescribable thrill of when a DJ gets it bang on. Be they 25 or 65, whether a tune is worth £1 or £10k.

(although I'd kill for an original JD Bryant )

[Dave Moore]

with respect dave shouldnt that be "post wigan" northern alnighter scene....i was too young to go but im sure ive read AND HAVE heard from people who did go that the flamingo,wheel and torch alnighters all played mod ,rnb,latin, ska and reggae (depending when they were ofcourse)alongside rare soul ,most of which was later called northern

dean

Hi Dean

I've no idea Mate I'm only a young whippersnapper.

Plus, if these clubs did play the range of music styles it must have soon petered out as I can't recall anyone in UK playing Reggae, ska or any of that stuff at Northern venues apart from peripheral scenes like Scooterists etc.

Regards,

Dave

[Mark Bicknell]

A question? 360 degree turn here and a question to the younger people, how would a time served DJ fair at a younger crowd based event? just a thought.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

[KevH]

A question? 360 degree turn here and a question to the younger people, how would a time served DJ fair at a younger crowd based event? just a thought.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

Anyone in mind Mark.?

[Guest Brett F]

Hello all, my first ever post..... i got into Soul through being a young Mod and the Scooter scene in the mid-eighties and have been DJing at Local scooter Club Do,s and running local club playing 60,s/Soul/Ska for the last 5 years on COMPACT DISC.

I have decided recentlly that a would like to build a SOUL record collection with a veiw to hopefully playing a few dedicated Soul events. I have only been collecting 45,s for a couple of months and finding its very difficult to get a decent box at any pace because of availibility/cost. The Northern/Rare Soul needs to allow new faces to be allowed interpret the scene in their way as with the posts above and not worry so much wether their records are on the right labels or originals etc.

If current DJ,s get a little more relaxed around the unwritten rules of being on the decks it would help others young or old to come through.

Thanks, enjoying being on here...

Hi mate, you say you've only collected for a couple of months, well i'm not here to kill any enthusiasm you have far from it, i wanna' encourage you..but...it will take more than a few months to get a decent collection of records together (money, availability etc )...also one of the main elements of any of the various soul scenes (northern, crossover, modern...)is the collecting and playing of 'original' records, for me thats the difference, yeah it may be elitist and at times frustrating, but any worthwhile event needs that as its core principal, this is my view and i know there are others that might not be as strict on that philosophy as me.....But that has always been an element of the rare soul scene, and i think it gives the scene its uniqueness, the collecting and playing of original records, it doesn't mean they have to be super expensive, Mark Bicknell, has already correctly mentioned the myriad of affordable originals out in the market place.....for me the difference in a good or bad DJ is his or her ear.

good luck in your quest.

Brett

Edited February 16, 2011 by Brett F

[Mark Bicknell]

Anyone in mind Mark.?

Lol smart arse, no I was simply curious to know how this would work or go down to a younger crowd as I thought it was more about the music being presented than the age of the person playing it.

Regards - Mark Bicknell - age 50 1/2 lol

[KevH]

Lol smart arse, no I was simply curious to know how this would work or go down to a younger crowd as I thought it was more about the music being presented than the age of the person playing it.

Regards - Mark Bicknell - age 50 1/2 lol

[Mark Bicknell]

Hi mate, you say you've only collected for a couple of months, well i'm not here to kill any enthusiasm you have far from it, i wanna' encourage you..but...it will take more than a few months to get a decent collection of records together (money, availability etc )...also one of the main elements of any of the various soul scenes (northern, crossover, modern...)is the collecting and playing of 'original' records, for me thats the difference, yeah it may be elitist and at times frustrating, but any worthwhile event needs that as its core principal, this is my view and i know there are others that might not be as strict on that philosophy as me.....But that has always been an element of the rare soul scene, and i think it gives the scene its uniqueness, the collecting and playing of original records, it doesn't mean they have to be super expensive, Mark Bicknell, has already correctly mentioned the myriad of affordable originals out in the market place.....for me the difference in a good or bad DJ is his or her ear.

good luck in your quest.

Brett

Brett it's in the glasses mate lol and I've had a pair for ages lol

[Guest Brett F]

Brett it's in the glasses mate lol and I've had a pair for ages lol

Jesus Mark....i thought it was 'Crippen'.....

[Mark Bicknell]

Jesus Mark....i thought it was 'Crippen'.....

Lol magic no it's Dr Glasses the soul doctor lol

[Soulboy69]

If you join Steve Cato's initial post with Paul B's, that about sums it up for me really.

As a 41 year old that's been on the scene for the last 20 years or so, i class myself as in the middle (too old to be young and too young to be old) .

I think it's a natural progression to explore and embrace new sounds and that's why the smaller events like "Soul Or Nothing" with it's upfront music policy appeal to me more these days.

It's exactly where i see the scene going when the 'young' folk are eventually in the driving seat and i certainly see myself as part of that scene.

I spent a few hours at a local pub do in Chorlton (Manchester) on New Years Day run by a young crowd and the music and passion in that small room

was a complete eye (and ear) opener and if this same music and passion is the future of the soul scene, i can't fookin' wait!!!!

[Corbett80]

The soul scene is very much a closed shop dj wise, in my opinion. It is what it is. A scene thta has been kept alive by the same people for 40 years. Quite amazing really, but do those people want some fresh faced young pup behind the decks giving their take of what rare soul is? I don't think so. They want the names they know and thats the reality of it.

We started Beat Boutique to get young people into the music - and it worked. We has to close the doors at midnight last month as it was packed with around 300 in the venue. The crowd is 95% under 35 and they come because they love the music. They don't have the knowledge or understanding or dancefloor etiquette, but they genuinely love the music.

Quite a few of our regulars have gone on to start collecting records and putting their own nights on but not many have joined the soul scene. Only the ones that really get it will ever latch onto the nighter scene as its too much to comprehend for most newbies. Does a room full of 50 yr olds put them off - yes. Does the venue put them off - yes. I didn't put me off, but I'm one of the minority. It has to be a city centre venue and it has to be relevent and exciting and unfortunately it has to be a young crowd.

The soul scene will undergo a massive change in the next ten years. Maybe one decent monthly night to attend with a much more varied music policy and many of the soul "rules" will have to go. The thing is, this excites people like me and I dare say most young people who are on the scene. We want to hear it all, soul, funk, rnb, ska, the lot. Mix it up and keep it fresh.

Soul music will always be around, but the wigan casino grip will be loosened and eventually forgotten and people like me and my friends will be able to have our input in the evolution of the scene.

Unfortunately there is a lot of truth in this i think...

Edited February 16, 2011 by corbett80

[Realpeoplesmusic]

A question? 360 degree turn here and a question to the younger people, how would a time served DJ fair at a younger crowd based event? just a thought.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

quite good timing really.....

I've got new night starting in Newcastle on May 14th 2011 in a city centre venue....and check this out for the name of the building 'Curtis Mayfield House' how cool is that!. The club is 'World Headquarters' and already has a large following of music lovers, the club has a vinyl ethos and I'm not just saying it but the venue is awesome...perfect for a soul night, it's cool, it's dark got so much charactor and has an amazing sound system.....watch this space.

Answer to your question regarding time served soul dj's playing to younger audiences and there's not many who i think could pull it off but one dj stands out a mile IMO and that is Karl Heard....he has a flair for dj-ing like no other soul DJ that I've came across....

P.s - for me it has to be original vinyl otherwise you may aswell be playing off cd's...

Callum

Edited February 16, 2011 by callum_64

[Timid Tomas]

Interesting thread and I thought I would add my piece - qualifying for a young DJ

Loads of interesting points and can't really add much to what Steve, Paul and Callum have said but...

I find it interesting that people think that there has to be such a sharp distinction between what will become of soul nights in the future and their current status. I appreciated it maybe a difficult ladder to climb, but why can't you have older DJ's at events aimed at a newer fresher crowd? For example Callum's choice of Karl Heard I reckon would go down well with any crowd up for a dance!

It maybe different as you travel around the country (speaking from limited experience) but I think that in London/Brighton you are able to have a good mix. For example at Crossfire/The Brighton "Mod" weekender you had all the older bunch DJing to a crowd that was mostly under 30 and they were dancing all night... surely that is a healthy sign? Personally I do think that the "mod scene" is healthier than (what I have seen of the) soul scene with alot more people coming onto it all the time and attending events. But people move from one thing to another and tastes evolve.

I think as Callum said it is alot to do with the venues, their location and to a certain extent the people attending. Sometimes when at Radcliffe for example I think, what the feck am I doing at 19 with all these old c**nts (no offence ), but then you hear a record your love and thats all that matters...

I know also that its well trodden ground but the topic of "its hard to build up a collection if your a new DJ" seems to come up all the time. Every fecker does want to be a DJ (me being part of the problem ) - but why should this be such a problem? Surely competition is a good thing. I mean its not hard to build up a collection of good records anyway - you just got to have your ear to the ground and your ear to the tunes and pick up things that you like and get people dancing! Doesn't have to be the same fucking records from the Wigan vaults every bloody time! There are hundreds of good records for under £50 and probably hundreds more still to be discovered - thats one of the things I love about the soul scene. I don't think original vinyl should ever be phased out either and I hope this is never the case - not only do I love it from a nerdy collectors point of view, but it also it forces DJ's to be creative with their sets and keep them trying to be original...

However without nights such as Soul or Nothing, The Beat Boutique and Pow Wow I think it would be hard to attract new people into digging soul... its a difficult one!

Maybe I am contradicting myself at some points here, but oh well!

Tomas

[KevH]

Interesting thread and I thought I would add my piece - qualifying for a young DJ

Loads of interesting points and can't really add much to what Steve, Paul and Callum have said but...

I find it interesting that people think that there has to be such a sharp distinction between what will become of soul nights in the future and their current status. I appreciated it maybe a difficult ladder to climb, but why can't you have older DJ's at events aimed at a newer fresher crowd? For example Callum's choice of Karl Heard I reckon would go down well with any crowd up for a dance!

It maybe different as you travel around the country (speaking from limited experience) but I think that in London/Brighton you are able to have a good mix. For example at Crossfire/The Brighton "Mod" weekender you had all the older bunch DJing to a crowd that was mostly under 30 and they were dancing all night... surely that is a healthy sign? Personally I do think that the "mod scene" is healthier than (what I have seen of the) soul scene with alot more people coming onto it all the time and attending events. But people move from one thing to another and tastes evolve.

I think as Callum said it is alot to do with the venues, their location and to a certain extent the people attending. Sometimes when at Radcliffe for example I think, what the feck am I doing at 19 with all these old c**nts (no offence ), but then you hear a record your love and thats all that matters...

I know also that its well trodden ground but the topic of "its hard to build up a collection if your a new DJ" seems to come up all the time. Every fecker does want to be a DJ (me being part of the problem ) - but why should this be such a problem? Surely competition is a good thing. I mean its not hard to build up a collection of good records anyway - you just got to have your ear to the ground and your ear to the tunes and pick up things that you like and get people dancing! Doesn't have to be the same fucking records from the Wigan vaults every bloody time! There are hundreds of good records for under £50 and probably hundreds more still to be discovered - thats one of the things I love about the soul scene. I don't think original vinyl should ever be phased out either and I hope this is never the case - not only do I love it from a nerdy collectors point of view, but it also it forces DJ's to be creative with their sets and keep them trying to be original...

However without nights such as Soul or Nothing, The Beat Boutique and Pow Wow I think it would be hard to attract new people into digging soul... its a difficult one!

Maybe I am contradicting myself at some points here, but oh well!

Tomas

[Timid Tomas]

I meant to write a record you love

[Mark Bicknell]

Interesting thread and I thought I would add my piece - qualifying for a young DJ

Loads of interesting points and can't really add much to what Steve, Paul and Callum have said but...

I find it interesting that people think that there has to be such a sharp distinction between what will become of soul nights in the future and their current status. I appreciated it maybe a difficult ladder to climb, but why can't you have older DJ's at events aimed at a newer fresher crowd? For example Callum's choice of Karl Heard I reckon would go down well with any crowd up for a dance! It maybe different as you travel around the country (speaking from limited experience) but I think that in London/Brighton you are able to have a good mix. For example at Crossfire/The Brighton "Mod" weekender you had all the older bunch DJing to a crowd that was mostly under 30 and they were dancing all night... surely that is a healthy sign? Personally I do think that the "mod scene" is healthier than (what I have seen of the) soul scene with alot more people coming onto it all the time and attending events. But people move from one thing to another and tastes evolve.

I think as Callum said it is alot to do with the venues, their location and to a certain extent the people attending. Sometimes when at Radcliffe for example I think, what the feck am I doing at 19 with all these old c**nts (no offence ), but then you hear a record your love and thats all that matters...

I know also that its well trodden ground but the topic of "its hard to build up a collection if your a new DJ" seems to come up all the time. Every fecker does want to be a DJ (me being part of the problem ) - but why should this be such a problem? Surely competition is a good thing. I mean its not hard to build up a collection of good records anyway - you just got to have your ear to the ground and your ear to the tunes and pick up things that you like and get people dancing! Doesn't have to be the same fucking records from the Wigan vaults every bloody time! There are hundreds of good records for under £50 and probably hundreds more still to be discovered - thats one of the things I love about the soul scene. I don't think original vinyl should ever be phased out either and I hope this is never the case - not only do I love it from a nerdy collectors point of view, but it also it forces DJ's to be creative with their sets and keep them trying to be original...

However without nights such as Soul or Nothing, The Beat Boutique and Pow Wow I think it would be hard to attract new people into digging soul... its a difficult one!

Maybe I am contradicting myself at some points here, but oh well!

Tomas

I asked that very same question but as yet no reply.

Mark Bicknell.

[TOAD]

if the " MOD SCENE" is so good why are you lot bothering with the Northern Scene ?

FFs youngsters create something !and not go retro

[Little-stevie]

I asked that very same question but as yet no reply.

Mark Bicknell.

you can Mark no problem at many places in the uk and around the world....

There are no rules... Just the way it should be...

On the whole young people want to be around young or young minded people.. The music can be from djs of any age though.. Its the same on the dance scene and many other scenes....

[Timid Tomas]

if the " MOD SCENE" is so good why are you lot bothering with the Northern Scene ?

FFs youngsters create something !and not go retro

At no point did I say the "mod scene" is "better" than the northern scene, I just stated that I think its healthier because it tends to attract more young people - feel free to prove me otherwise.

If I wasn't interested in Northern why would I be writing on this forum/buying records?

Just because I wasn't alive in the 60's/70's means my interest in music and clothing from that period is retro and purely a novelty? Maybe I should leave this site and go back to dubstep...

[Little-stevie]

At no point did I say the "mod scene" is "better" than the northern scene, I just stated that I think its healthier because it tends to attract more young people - feel free to prove me otherwise.

If I wasn't interested in Northern why would I be writing on this forum/buying records?

Just because I wasn't alive in the 60's/70's means my interest in music and clothing from that period is retro and purely a novelty? Maybe I should leave this site and go back to dubstep...

No stick around mate..

Its a very broad church here with many aspects of black music..

And some a little blue eyed too...

[Geeselad]

Only a few " Blue Beat " records where played at The Wheel according to my Wheel Friend he said that West Indians had there own " venues"

check out Dave Haslam's musing of this in his Madchester England book, he talks indepth about Moss sides shabeen's and also the provincial nature of the Northern scene.

[Guest Bearsy]

if they are good enough they are old enough

[Davekd]

Do you think that the age of the D.J. is necessarily relevant to the scene they are playing to?

Des Parker

Des I've only DJ'd a few times to a younger crowd and, in fairness, it didnt deem to matter at all to them that I was an old git - the fact it was off vinyl didnt seem to register either and on original vinyl, was right over their heads lol

The good thing about the younger crowd is most of them seem determined to throw themselves into the music and have a good time, regardless of whether they know the tunes or not!

Dave

[Daz Mc]

Ditto Chalky , me & the wife had a great nite at Azza's venue , think it was the wardrobe in Leeds , a lot younger crowd and all very up for it , a great atmosphere had by all and a very friendly bunch.

[viphitman]

Hi mate, you say you've only collected for a couple of months, well i'm not here to kill any enthusiasm you have far from it, i wanna' encourage you..but...it will take more than a few months to get a decent collection of records together (money, availability etc )...also one of the main elements of any of the various soul scenes (northern, crossover, modern...)is the collecting and playing of 'original' records, for me thats the difference, yeah it may be elitist and at times frustrating, but any worthwhile event needs that as its core principal, this is my view and i know there are others that might not be as strict on that philosophy as me.....But that has always been an element of the rare soul scene, and i think it gives the scene its uniqueness, the collecting and playing of original records, it doesn't mean they have to be super expensive, Mark Bicknell, has already correctly mentioned the myriad of affordable originals out in the market place.....for me the difference in a good or bad DJ is his or her ear.

good luck in your quest.

Brett

100 % with ya on that + people should also learn how to dance to Northern or at least give it o good try.

[viphitman]

Interesting thread and I thought I would add my piece - qualifying for a young DJ

Loads of interesting points and can't really add much to what Steve, Paul and Callum have said but...

I find it interesting that people think that there has to be such a sharp distinction between what will become of soul nights in the future and their current status. I appreciated it maybe a difficult ladder to climb, but why can't you have older DJ's at events aimed at a newer fresher crowd? For example Callum's choice of Karl Heard I reckon would go down well with any crowd up for a dance!

It maybe different as you travel around the country (speaking from limited experience) but I think that in London/Brighton you are able to have a good mix. For example at Crossfire/The Brighton "Mod" weekender you had all the older bunch DJing to a crowd that was mostly under 30 and they were dancing all night... surely that is a healthy sign? Personally I do think that the "mod scene" is healthier than (what I have seen of the) soul scene with alot more people coming onto it all the time and attending events. But people move from one thing to another and tastes evolve.

I think as Callum said it is alot to do with the venues, their location and to a certain extent the people attending. Sometimes when at Radcliffe for example I think, what the feck am I doing at 19 with all these old c**nts (no offence ), but then you hear a record your love and thats all that matters...

I know also that its well trodden ground but the topic of "its hard to build up a collection if your a new DJ" seems to come up all the time. Every fecker does want to be a DJ (me being part of the problem ) - but why should this be such a problem? Surely competition is a good thing. I mean its not hard to build up a collection of good records anyway - you just got to have your ear to the ground and your ear to the tunes and pick up things that you like and get people dancing! Doesn't have to be the same fucking records from the Wigan vaults every bloody time! There are hundreds of good records for under £50 and probably hundreds more still to be discovered - thats one of the things I love about the soul scene. I don't think original vinyl should ever be phased out either and I hope this is never the case - not only do I love it from a nerdy collectors point of view, but it also it forces DJ's to be creative with their sets and keep them trying to be original...

However without nights such as Soul or Nothing, The Beat Boutique and Pow Wow I think it would be hard to attract new people into digging soul... its a difficult one!

Maybe I am contradicting myself at some points here, but oh well!

Tomas

Good post mate !!!! Although over here in Germany pure soul nights are more popular then the ones that mix soul, ska, funk and reggae in one room. It really worked well in the early 80's and 90's to mix it all up but now only smaller events or two separate rooms playing either style will do alright in mixing it all up.

[Dave Abbott]

Hi mate, you say you've only collected for a couple of months, well i'm not here to kill any enthusiasm you have far from it, i wanna' encourage you..but...it will take more than a few months to get a decent collection of records together (money, availability etc )...also one of the main elements of any of the various soul scenes (northern, crossover, modern...)is the collecting and playing of 'original' records, for me thats the difference, yeah it may be elitist and at times frustrating, but any worthwhile event needs that as its core principal, this is my view and i know there are others that might not be as strict on that philosophy as me.....But that has always been an element of the rare soul scene, and i think it gives the scene its uniqueness, the collecting and playing of original records, it doesn't mean they have to be super expensive, Mark Bicknell, has already correctly mentioned the myriad of affordable originals out in the market place.....for me the difference in a good or bad DJ is his or her ear.

good luck in your quest.

Brett

Nutshell

[Mark Bicknell]

Des I've only DJ'd a few times to a younger crowd and, in fairness, it didnt deem to matter at all to them that I was an old git - the fact it was off vinyl didnt seem to register either and on original vinyl, was right over their heads lol

The good thing about the younger crowd is most of them seem determined to throw themselves into the music and have a good time, regardless of whether they know the tunes or not!

Dave

How refreshing that sounds, no soul police, no judging if the records are rare or not, just getting into the music wonderful, has it should be.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

[Mark Bicknell]

Des I've only DJ'd a few times to a younger crowd and, in fairness, it didnt deem to matter at all to them that I was an old git - the fact it was off vinyl didnt seem to register either and on original vinyl, was right over their heads lol

The good thing about the younger crowd is most of them seem determined to throw themselves into the music and have a good time, regardless of whether they know the tunes or not!

Dave

How refreshing that sounds, no soul police, no judging if the records are rare or not, just getting into the music wonderful, as it should be.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

Edited February 17, 2011 by Mark Bicknell

[Chalky]

The Mod scene and the northern scene are two different scenes and shouldn't be confused. Plenty of what is played on the Mod scene wouldn't go down too well at many Soul nights/nighters.

Paul B, can I ask how much of what your club plays is NS, rare soul?

Also would a place like Beat Boutique work in a town that doesn't have a large Student population?

Don't know why people keep wanting to change something that has survived over 40 years. Sure we are getting older but there are venues and DJ's that cater for all styles, many of them stale playing the same old same but there's plenty of them playing something different and keeping it fresh, it doesn't necessarily need a younger DJ to make it any better. Granted we want more youngsters on the scene to keep it going and the youngsters turn will come behind the decks as they gain more experience, knowledge and bigger and better collections and as the old guard gives it up.

There's enough going on to keep everyone happy.

I also keep reading how the scene is a closed shop when it comes to DJ's, maybe it is in some cases, maybe it's because what some promoters do works so why change, maybe the music cannot be bettered by simply putting on a younger DJ???

[Winnie :-)]

Des I've only DJ'd a few times to a younger crowd and, in fairness, it didnt deem to matter at all to them that I was an old git - the fact it was off vinyl didnt seem to register either and on original vinyl, was right over their heads lol

The good thing about the younger crowd is most of them seem determined to throw themselves into the music and have a good time, regardless of whether they know the tunes or not!

Dave

I get that they throw themselves into it as you say, but if they don't know that it's being played off vinyl are they not missing what many consider the backbone of the scene? Also, if they don't know the tunes they're dancing to are they at all worried that they're even at a northern soul event? If the scene is going to be restocked with 'the youth', surely some of the old ethics/etiquette has to be maintained if it's to remain the scene we all know?

Winnie

[Mark Bicknell]

I get that they throw themselves into it as you say, but if they don't know that it's being played off vinyl are they not missing what many consider the backbone of the scene? Also, if they don't know the tunes they're dancing to are they at all worried that they're even at a northern soul event? If the scene is going to be restocked with 'the youth', surely some of the old ethics/etiquette has to be maintained if it's to remain the scene we all know?

Winnie

I think it's very much the case as Chalky said two different scenes with the common ground being 60's/retro influenced soul music, I did ask the question which Steve Cato kind of replied to being would an older DJ go down at a younger crowd event? someone else also mentioned that it mattered very little who was playing the music and off what format and the OVO ethos had little or no relevence to the younger retro cluber, the difference between the two scenes if you like is one has history and certain ethics it works to and the other is using some of the backbone rules if you like to develop it's own slant on things and good for them I say, still would be interesting to see how some records they have not been exsposed to would go down perhaps presented by older DJ's, we harp on about the younger coming to the older scene how about the older going to the younger otherwise it all seems a bit one sided.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

[Guest Matt Male]

Hello all, my first ever post..... i got into Soul through being a young Mod and the Scooter scene in the mid-eighties and have been DJing at Local scooter Club Do,s and running local club playing 60,s/Soul/Ska for the last 5 years on COMPACT DISC.

I have decided recentlly that a would like to build a SOUL record collection with a veiw to hopefully playing a few dedicated Soul events. I have only been collecting 45,s for a couple of months and finding its very difficult to get a decent box at any pace because of availibility/cost. The Northern/Rare Soul needs to allow new faces to be allowed interpret the scene in their way as with the posts above and not worry so much wether their records are on the right labels or originals etc.

If current DJ,s get a little more relaxed around the unwritten rules of being on the decks it would help others young or old to come through.

Thanks, enjoying being on here...

Why do you think allowing playing CDs and non-originals will help young or old upcoming DJs?

At the end of the day putting together a decent playbox isn't just about cost/availabilty it's about imagination and providing an alternative to the other DJs on the night, unless you only want to play the same classic oldies off CD as everyone else, and who needs another DJ doing that?

[Winnie :-)]

I think it's very much the case as Chalky said two different scenes with the common ground being 60's/retro influenced soul music, I did ask the question which Steve Cato kind of replied to being would an older DJ go down at a younger crowd event? someone else also mentioned that it mattered very little who was playing the music and off what format and the OVO ethos had little or no relevence to the younger retro cluber, the difference between the two scenes if you like is one has history and certain ethics it works to and the other is using some of the backbone rules if you like to develop it's own slant on things and good for them I say, still would be interesting to see how some records they have not been exsposed to would go down perhaps presented by older DJ's, we harp on about the younger coming to the older scene how about the older going to the younger otherwise it all seems a bit one sided.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

I must have got the wrong end of the stick, I thought it was about the lack of young DJ's breaking through on the current northern scene, they surely have no problem breaking through in events they've organised themselves?

Winnie

[Guest Wee Mark]

Thanks all for comments....Quite scary on here!!......Its funny with scenes and peoples status within them...

I,m a 43 year old and a Scooterist(as many are or have been on here) of 27 years standing and have more or less done it all within those realms and i still love it, Started on new Vespa 50 now ride Self-Bulit/restored 1965 TV 225 Lambretta......On this forum with my CD collection and 15 Records i,m the New boy again and that i accept

Point is though that the Scooter Scene went through the same changes and issues that are being faced now by the Northern Soul scene.

To allow youngsters/fresh faces to come through some of the older dyed in the wool attitudes about we should only ride Original Italian Scooters had to be relaxed/softened as these type of machine were unavailible/unobtainable for some. As the the unwritten rules relaxed a little it open upto others.

Standards for those at top are maintained but others are allowed join the fun in a less exacting regime. As these changes in attitude occur the youngsters come through and the scene again begins to flourish and more interest is generated.

One things for sure though Change is gonna come.......Great thread poster!!!

[Ian Dewhirst]

Thanks all for comments....Quite scary on here!!......Its funny with scenes and peoples status within them...

I,m a 43 year old and a Scooterist(as many are or have been on here) of 27 years standing and have more or less done it all within those realms and i still love it, Started on new Vespa 50 now ride Self-Bulit/restored 1965 TV 225 Lambretta......On this forum with my CD collection and 15 Records i,m the New boy again and that i accept

Point is though that the Scooter Scene went through the same changes and issues that are being faced now by the Northern Soul scene.

To allow youngsters/fresh faces to come through some of the older dyed in the wool attitudes about we should only ride Original Italian Scooters had to be relaxed/softened as these type of machine were unavailible/unobtainable for some. As the the unwritten rules relaxed a little it open upto others.

Standards for those at top are maintained but others are allowed join the fun in a less exacting regime. As these changes in attitude occur the youngsters come through and the scene again begins to flourish and more interest is generated.

One things for sure though Change is gonna come.......Great thread poster!!!

Yep. Essentially correct Wee Mark.

Well done.

Ian D

[Guest CapitolSC]

if the " MOD SCENE" is so good why are you lot bothering with the Northern Scene ?

FFs youngsters create something !and not go retro

Well most but not all of the people who got into northern soul in the 70s and 80s in London and the south got into it throught the mod or skinhead scence.

That is still the same today.

The reason the northern scene is thriving in the south and the rest of europe is though people getting into the scene through these avenues weather its mod,,rockabilly

or skinhead.

I never knew what northern soul was till i went to one of Adys nights at the tennis club in Belsize park north london about 1980

i loved it and from there went to every allniter at the 100 club

and started to run my own nights in camden by 1983 i was 19 at the time

Irish Greg Catford Chris Andy Hynde Val Palmer Shane Cox sharnya Haleamazing collections and they were younger than me

Bought all me tunes from soul bowl or pat brady My dj gods were keb,Ian Clark of course Guy mark Bicknell colin law Ady and Randy.

we were spinnin otis lee,ron baxter,ray pollard on shrine etc etc at mod clubs in London.

There was always a mixture of smart dressed individuals at these nights

and its carried on till the present day

For me its always been the music and the clothes it aint retro

ITS smart living under difficult circumstances

Al H

[Realpeoplesmusic]

Thanks all for comments....Quite scary on here!!......Its funny with scenes and peoples status within them...

I,m a 43 year old and a Scooterist(as many are or have been on here) of 27 years standing and have more or less done it all within those realms and i still love it, Started on new Vespa 50 now ride Self-Bulit/restored 1965 TV 225 Lambretta......On this forum with my CD collection and 15 Records i,m the New boy again and that i accept

Point is though that the Scooter Scene went through the same changes and issues that are being faced now by the Northern Soul scene.

To allow youngsters/fresh faces to come through some of the older dyed in the wool attitudes about we should only ride Original Italian Scooters had to be relaxed/softened as these type of machine were unavailible/unobtainable for some. As the the unwritten rules relaxed a little it open upto others.

Standards for those at top are maintained but others are allowed join the fun in a less exacting regime. As these changes in attitude occur the youngsters come through and the scene again begins to flourish and more interest is generated.

One things for sure though Change is gonna come.......Great thread poster!!!

Lets all just keep doing what we are doing and see what happens.....I think NS will always have it''s place and as mentoned on here the next 10 years will see massive change. I think the scene will dwindle as some of the older crowds drop off and people start to sell up etc....One things for sure they'll be some nice records up for grabs and chances are they'll be cheaper than what we are paying these days.

The NS scene will always be around but will almost certainly be different to how it is/was. At the minute Soul all-nighters I'm afraid are not in touch with the modern world apart form SS. The only place you pick up flyers are at nighters....but what if you dont go to nighters, how will you know the nights on or attract any new people.

No offense but i think it'll be cooler (no baggie pants/vests or bele dancers ) and will start to venture into city centre venues attracting younger crowds. I also think you'll see less and less all-nighters and more 2/3am finishes.

I love the soul music, I love the people and the scene in general I find it fascinating...but I'm also looking forward to seeing how it develops in the future and I'm confident it will!

Callum

[Realpeoplesmusic]

For me its always been the music and the clothes it aint retro

ITS smart living under difficult circumstances

Al H

I agree mate....but i dont like to put to much emphasis on the clothes these days, thats for the individual. It frusttrates the hell out of me when I see smart mod dress only on flyers, if someone wants to come along and see what it's about let them... althought there does have to be a line though, no liverpool or man city shirts or crocs etc ! I try my best to look smart and will always have mod in me but it's about the music for me these days

as a good freind of mine once said

"music for the soul & clothes for the charactor"

How true!

[Liljimmycrank]

Some really interesting points on here and whilst some ventured off topic slightly I think they've all been relevant, which makes a change.

Steve, Paul and Chalky have all made great points which evaluate where we're at today and what might happen in the future, from a young ens and old ens perspective.

One thing that has annoyed me a tad in all this was that young people can't necessarily afford big ticket items or don't have mortgages??? What a load of old sh*t. If you've got the money and wanna spend it on vinyl being young doesn't make a difference.

Completely agree with Brett in terms of OVO and matt male also...........any DJ worth their salt should play from original vinyl, and I don't actually think that moving away from that script opens a door to more young dj's at all, if anything it stops it. Why? Well I for one (being a youngster who dj's and promotes) would be unlikely to support such events. It's a factor that forms the evolution of this scene and young people do like cults and movements with history, FACT. no need to change this in my opinion.

Mark - to answer your point, as a young en of course, it doesn't matter the age of the DJ and I don't think it puts people off attending prodomently 'young audience' dominated events of they turn up one time and a 50+yr old is behind the decks.

As long as the Dj can cut the mustard then the young audience will love it. That's no different to todays scene. As been mentioned guys like Karl etc feed of a crowd and deliver the goods.

I've put on plenty of the 'old guard' at Driving Beat and they've always gone down extremely well, mainly because i think they fit our music policy and also because we give them the freedom to play what they want within the bounds of the genres we promote. But that's the same fit the young guys too.

Our night, a bit like beat boutique in terms of attracting mixed crowds (although would say BB is more younger prodominantly), plays a mix of genres, and that includes the stuff classed as rare soul. That's because the guys who promote it and DJ at it 'get it'.

A key point which I think has been overlooked in all this in terms of young DJ's is that, whilst we're able to tap into a mass of knowledge built up over years, we also have no prejudice or bias of bygone eras that may have built up over said years. No particular phase of our lives music wise which may now form an influence on DJ styles and our collections, a blank canvas if you like.

I agree with Chalky in that the young DJ's shouldn't be going like for like with the older ones, but on the whole other than the odd 'gimic' ones, I don't think they do. Guys like Callum, Liam, Paul, Maxwell, Rich Evans etc. They have the passion, an ear for great tunes, good knowledge, fantastic varied collections and also, above all else, can knock fantastic spots together full of energy, flow and dancefloor driven tuneage.

These guys should be playing more now, never mind waiting for the future. That's up to the promoters though.

Will be interesting to see how the freestyle room at Rugby goes down in April.

In summary of my answer to the original post, the next generation of dj's are out there with open minds and ears, collections and play boxes bulging tunes across the board both price and genre. If people want to put them on at their events they will, if not then the clock of life is ticking on for everyone and it's only a matter of time :-)

Azza

[Guest]

PAST FUTURE or PRESENT as long as the dj's are spinning quality tunes, try to be a bit different, introducing new sounds left there ego at the door as with the punters then all is good in SOUL land

p.s just for me more sweet and deep at soul do's anytime of the night cant beat a good full on firme rola

Kieran

[Guest Matt Male]

Yep. Essentially correct Wee Mark.

Well done.

Ian D

Hmm, no I think he's essentially wrong Ian. I don't think there is any comparison between the scooter scene's acceptance of newer scooters and the northern scene's acceptance of CDs. Mark was arguing that allowing the use of CDs will encourage younger DJs and older DJs who can't afford originals. I just don't see how it will, like Azza said most of us wouldn't support events where CDs are played all night because we can play them at home and we're unlikely to hear anything we weren't listening to in the car on the way to the venue. There's always a risk of fetishising the format over the music (i'm trying to avoid doing that) but this was a scene built on original vinyl because no other format was available but it's that fact that has kept everyone seeking out different stuff thesedays even when we have lots of other formats, precisely because it isn't available on CD or itunes.

Edited February 18, 2011 by Matt Male

[Chalky]

Steve, Paul and Chalky have all made great points which evaluate where we're at today and what might happen in the future, from a young ens and old ens perspective.

I agree with Chalky in that the young DJ's shouldn't be going like for like with the older ones, but on the whole other than the odd 'gimic' ones, I don't think they do. Guys like Callum, Liam, Paul, Maxwell, Rich Evans etc. They have the passion, an ear for great tunes, good knowledge, fantastic varied collections and also, above all else, can knock fantastic spots together full of energy, flow and dancefloor driven tuneage.

These guys should be playing more now, never mind waiting for the future. That's up to the promoters though.

Will be interesting to see how the freestyle room at Rugby goes down in April.

Azza

Young uns and old uns! I'll go and draw me pension now shall I

As for the dj's you mention, do they offer something other than age that is different to what is already on offer at various venues up and down the country, honest answer please? Any playlists anywhere so we can see some of what they have to offer?

I see you out and about Azza and Callum as well, Liam occasionally but the others I don't think I know from Adam, do they attend venues up and down the country?

[Liljimmycrank]

Young uns and old uns! I'll go and draw me pension now shall I

As for the dj's you mention, do they offer something other than age that is different to what is already on offer at various venues up and down the country, honest answer please? Any playlists anywhere so we can see some of what they have to offer?

I see you out and about Azza and Callum as well, Liam occasionally but the others I don't think I know from Adam, do they attend venues up and down the country?

YES and YES to both answers Chalky, and that's an honest opinion.

I think these guys do offer something different. You only have to step into Steve's room at Radcliff for example when he's had one of them on and they're likely playing something that's not tried and trusted.

I'm not saying every tune in their box is different, or that they're absolutely cutting edge constantly, but then again who is? and for teh very few that are (probably counting them on two hands) there's not enough of em to go round. But the people i mentioned do offer something different, and they have the balls to showcase it. Whether its underplayed, rare or just down right different and never heard of before, they will play it.

I'm not saying that an 'old DJ' can't do that either, just saying you don't see them doing it as often (in general). Obvious exceptions on both sides wouldnt you say mate?

Like i said though, young or old, it's irrelevant as long you can do the bizzo and deliver a cracking set.

P.S - leave the pension for now mate, still plenty of life in you yet

Edited February 18, 2011 by LilJimmyCrank

[Davekd]

I get that they throw themselves into it as you say, but if they don't know that it's being played off vinyl are they not missing what many consider the backbone of the scene? Also, if they don't know the tunes they're dancing to are they at all worried that they're even at a northern soul event? If the scene is going to be restocked with 'the youth', surely some of the old ethics/etiquette has to be maintained if it's to remain the scene we all know?

Winnie

Thats very true Winnie - there seems to be a very prevelant kind of 'this week we'll go to hear some Northern Soul and next week we'll go to hear some Grunge' etc - the hard bit is to get them to come back. With all the variety of music available and lack of the old triablism I don't think the majority will ever become regualr attendee's of one type of event/music, more random visitors.

At my local night, we often get groups of youngsters who have a whale of a time, some almost constantly on the dancefloor, congradulate us on a brilliant night and then dont come back for 6 months or indeed never come back!

The hope is from these events is to properly capture the interest of one or two and as they get into the scene then all the cd/vinyl/original vinyl stuff will make sense to them.

I'd quite happily support youngsters putting on a night and hope, in time, they'll get the musical format right.

Cheers,

Dave

[Corbett80]

'I agree mate....but i dont like to put to much emphasis on the clothes these days, thats for the individual. It frusttrates the hell out of me when I see smart mod dress only on flyers, if someone wants to come along and see what it's about let them... althought there does have to be a line though, no liverpool or man city shirts or crocs etc ! I try my best to look smart and will always have mod in me but it's about the music for me these days

as a good freind of mine once said

"music for the soul & clothes for the charactor"

How true! '

Agree 100%. What Al says as well about many people getting into northern through mod was true for me and for many others. The London soul thing has thrived with mods and vice versa for 20 odd years at least.The scenes bicker but they are closely linked in many ways and maybe all of these scenes need each other to survive by people crossing over, back and forth.

[Ian Dewhirst]

Hmm, no I think he's essentially wrong Ian. I don't think there is any comparison between the scooter scene's acceptance of newer scooters and the northern scene's acceptance of CDs. Mark was arguing that allowing the use of CDs will encourage younger DJs and older DJs who can't afford originals. I just don't see how it will, like Azza said most of us wouldn't support events where CDs are played all night because we can play them at home and we're unlikely to hear anything we weren't listening to in the car on the way to the venue. There's always a risk of fetishising the format over the music (i'm trying to avoid doing that) but this was a scene built on original vinyl because no other format was available but it's that fact that has kept everyone seeking out different stuff thesedays even when we have lots of other formats, precisely because it isn't available on CD or itunes.

When I talk about CD's, I'm not talking about the ones you buy in the shops Matt. I'm talking about about 200 + CD's which have been personally burnt from my own collection, of which somewhere around 20% of the tunes aren't available on any physical format including vinyl. Just to reiterate the point, I got 20 x CD's worth of previously unreleased 60's and 70's material just yesterday. I personally don't use commercially available CD's at all. Naturally, yes, I still have to use a box of 4-500 vinyl for some gigs but I far prefer to have a choice of thousands rather then hundreds of tunes. To me being dogmatic about a format simply limits ones choices.

Ian D

Edited February 18, 2011 by Ian Dewhirst

[Guest Matt Male]

When I talk about CD's, I'm not talking about the ones you buy in the shops Matt. I'm talking about about 200 + CD's which have been personally burnt from my own collection, of which somewhere around 20% of the tunes aren't available on any physical format including vinyl. Just to reiterate the point, I got 20 x CD's worth of previously unreleased 60's and 70's material just yesterday. I personally don't use commercially available CD's at all. Naturally, yes, I still have to use a box of 4-500 vinyl for some gigs but I far prefer to have a choice of thousands rather then hundreds of tunes. To me being dogmatic about a format simply limits ones choices.

Ian D

I think that's the difference, you're talking about using CDs as a format recorded from your own collection whereas Mark was talking about using shop bought CDs to DJ with because original vinyl is too expensive. That's the way I understood it. My point was if you buy CDs to DJ with, then putting together a personal set that doesn't sound like everyone else is impossible, so there's no point doing it if you want to make a name as a new upcoming DJ.