Ebay Snipers

[Guest kev such]

Bloody damn Ebay sniping programmes.

Takes ALL the nail biting, edge of seat excitiment fun out of bidding for tunes.

Bidding on a tune, 3 seconds from the end and 2 seperate snipes come in on the millisecond it finishes, SO DAMN FRUSTRATING.

Rant over just annoyed I didnt get the tune really.

Kev

[Girthdevon]

It is frustrating, but its not really the sniping program....somebody bid more than you did. And the programmes are there for all to use I use them quite alot, and get outbid far more often than I win....

Girf

[Carol Phyllis]

I "sniped" for the first time on Sunday, it was great, it meant I could go out & have a dance & come home to a positive result

Will definately do it again, sorry Kev!

[Guest Dante]

Bloody damn Ebay sniping programmes.

Takes ALL the nail biting, edge of seat excitiment fun out of bidding for tunes.

Bidding on a tune, 3 seconds from the end and 2 seperate snipes come in on the millisecond it finishes, SO DAMN FRUSTRATING.

Rant over just annoyed I didnt get the tune really.

Kev

It's frustrating, but there's one simple solution: snip bid yourself.

[NEV]

It's frustrating, but there's one simple solution: snip bid yourself.

As they say "WHEN IN ROME "

[Guest in town Mikey]

As they say "WHEN IN ROME "

Drive like a loon?

[NEV]

Drive like a loon?

Don't drive at all

[Liljimmycrank]

Or just bid more.

Fact is, if someone uses a snipe and out bids you, they've still outbid you. No matter what method used, they were prepared to pay more. Tis an auction after all, win some lose some

[NEV]

Or just bid more.

Fact is, if someone uses a snipe and out bids you, they've still outbid you. No matter what method used, they were prepared to pay more. Tis an auction after all, win some lose some

Hi Azza

Another way to look at it though or should i say advantage :-

If your using the old fashioned method of sitting in front of your PC till the dying seconds ,with your finger on the trigger, ready to put in a manual last minute or 10 second bid ..(.whilst having a mild heart attack )....you can see how the bid's going

You can be infuenced by the amount you see in front of you ...lets say ,it's looking like your gonna get a bargain cos not many people have shown an interest on a so called $200 record thats currently only at $10 ....you might be ready to bang in a $40 bid rather than go high ...but at the dying last 4 seconds the sniper kicks in with $42.. you cannot possibly react quick enough to change your bid

Trust me i've got a sniper and have on occasion tried the old fashioned technique ,but been beaten by a sniper ,even though i would have wilingly bid more than the winner ... it's no good tellin me i should have put a higher bid in now...could have kicked myself but i thought i was gonna win easy cos the bid was very low until the last bloody minute

Win some you lose some and chances are they all come round again eh that's how i console myself

[Jnixon]

thing to fall back on with ebay is at least you have the luxury of over biding and possibly not being charged the full price of your bid figure. you don't get that with many dealer sites. your bid is your bid with those guys.

[Liljimmycrank]

Hi Azza

Another way to look at it though or should i say advantage :-

If your using the old fashioned method of sitting in front of your PC till the dying seconds ,with your finger on the trigger, ready to put in a manual last minute or 10 second bid ..(.whilst having a mild heart attack )....you can see how the bid's going

You can be infuenced by the amount you see in front of you ...lets say ,it's looking like your gonna get a bargain cos not many people have shown an interest on a so called $200 record thats currently only at $10 ....you might be ready to bang in a $40 bid rather than go high ...but at the dying last 4 seconds the sniper kicks in with $42.. you cannot possibly react quick enough to change your bid

Trust me i've got a sniper and have on occasion tried the old fashioned technique ,but been beaten by a sniper ,even though i would have wilingly bid more than the winner ... it's no good tellin me i should have put a higher bid in now...could have kicked myself but i thought i was gonna win easy cos the bid was very low until the last bloody minute

Win some you lose some and chances are they all come round again eh that's how i console myself

I agree Nev.

I don't use Snipers as much as I probably should. Only really when they end at stupid o'clock.

But I think in terms of original post if you're not prepared to bid higher than the other person is prepared to bid up front (whether in hindsight you wouldve happily paid more to bag a bargain) I don't see why you should then moan if you lose out..........I will openly confess to such moans which does make me a hypocrit! :-)

[NEV]

I agree Nev.

I don't use Snipers as much as I probably should. Only really when they end at stupid o'clock.

But I think in terms of original post if you're not prepared to bid higher than the other person is prepared to bid up front (whether in hindsight you wouldve happily paid more to bag a bargain) I don't see why you should then moan if you lose out..........I will openly confess to such moans which does make me a hypocrit! :-)

Well if it's confession time Azza ..i've cried tears over not puting in a high enough bid

Only kidding mate ...i find kicking the cat usually helpsbut don't tell the wife

[Guest kev such]

I put way over the odds bid, thinking it would be in the bag. Im not meaning putting stingy bids on and being annoyed when it doesnt come off. I can fully appreciate that if I dont put a "its in the bag and then some" maximum bid in then I only have myself to blame. Thats common sense.

I meant when you have put an over the odds maximum and it still gets swiped in the last second or 2, by a program.

Also I suppose I was just annoyed I didnt get it.

Kev

Oh well, thats how it goes.

[Chalky]

maybe everyone should be made to use a bidding tool, enter your top bid and see what happens. Might stop the crazy bidding we see at times

[Mrtag]

Got A Good One Now !! Bought One Once That Didnt Work Cost Me About 7 Good Records ! !

[Spanner]

I put way over the odds bid, thinking it would be in the bag. Im not meaning putting stingy bids on and being annoyed when it doesnt come off. I can fully appreciate that if I dont put a "its in the bag and then some" maximum bid in then I only have myself to blame. Thats common sense.

I meant when you have put an over the odds maximum and it still gets swiped in the last second or 2, by a program.

Also I suppose I was just annoyed I didnt get it.

Kev

Oh well, thats how it goes.

So what MODERN record was you bidding on m8

[boba]

anyone who complains about being outbid, sniper or not, didn't bid their true max, which is slightly higher than you want to pay so you think "screw it, I didn't want it anyways" when you are outbid. snipers take out of the equation people who will rebid out of spite and not bidding their true max, bumping up your bid unnecessarily. if everyone bid once with their true max, snipers would be unnecessary.

[Paul Shirley]

yeah but another problem with a snipe in the wrong hands lol .is this .i was selling some camera gear the other day on ebay after 9 days i started to get exited with some strong bids coming in towards the end ,then some prick with no feedback and never bought anything in 4 years wins the auction using a snipe .with seconds to go its obvious you canot remove the bid and result is the moron has buggerd up the auction. he did this using another id and a snipe as he was the same guy who i had exchanged a few words with over why i didnt want to desclose my reserve , he then sends a short message saying sorry i bid on the wrong camera :thumbsup:

[Guest Phoenix8049]

yeah but another problem with a snipe in the wrong hands lol .is this .i was selling some camera gear the other day on ebay after 9 days i started to get exited with some strong bids coming in towards the end ,then some prick with no feedback and never bought anything in 4 years wins the auction using a snipe .with seconds to go its obvious you canot remove the bid and result is the moron has buggerd up the auction. he did this using another id and a snipe as he was the same guy who i had exchanged a few words with over why i didnt want to desclose my reserve , he then sends a short message saying sorry i bid on the wrong camera :thumbsup:

Can't you e mail the next highest bidder and tell him the other guy defaulted and now the camera is his.

Or can't you do that anymore on e bay.

Stu.

[Spacehopper]

yeah think you can ...i had a false bidder on a reggae reissue i was selling and messaged the second highest bidder who had it after seeing all the false bidders history !!!

as far as sniping is concerned i joined the darkside a few months back,got fed up with missing too many tunes i had upto the last few seconds,very slow computer at times !...i still miss some but if someone elses snipe is more thats fairer than some one whos got a quicker pc..

and anyway theres always another tune

dean

[Ljblanken]

Auction theory is a fairly well developed sub-field of economics. One of the most robust results across many auction designs is that it is a dominant strategy to bid your true valuation of an item, regardless of others' behavior. The key is to think hard about what your true cut-point is (what the item is worth to you), bid, and then walk away.

For a non-technical introduction to formalized model of auction behavior, I recommend Paul Klemperer "Auctions: Theory and Practice" (Princeton University Press 2003).

For example, I just won a copy of 'hotline' by Reggie Garner (5 minutes ago) with a bid of 8 pounds. for 99% of the auction time i was winning for 1 pound (and would have been psyched to get it for that), but i can buy another (same condition) copy from an ebay seller here in the states for $24.99 (plus shipping). i considered this my "outside option" (working in some bargaining theory lingo - see Abhinay Mithoo "Bargaining with Applications" Cambridge U Press 1999) and, with the exchange rate and 7 pounds shipping, i set my max bid at 11 pounds (which would equal the american item with shipping).

so... the 8 pound result still saved me a couple of dollars off my USA equivalent (and i assume away the difference in shipping time).

there you go!

ps - i often get sniped and kick myself as well. when i feel regret, i realize i hadn't thought hard enough about my true valuation (or simply didn't have the funds to bid my true valuation)

Edited December 1, 2010 by ljblanken

[boba]

Auction theory is a fairly well developed sub-field of economics. One of the most robust results across many auction designs is that it is a dominant strategy to bid your true valuation of an item, regardless of others' behavior. The key is to think hard about what your true cut-point is (what the item is worth to you), bid, and then walk away.

For a non-technical introduction to formalized model of auction behavior, I recommend Paul Klemperer "Auctions: Theory and Practice" (Princeton University Press 2003).

For example, I just won a copy of 'hotline' by Reggie Garner (5 minutes ago) with a bid of 8 pounds. for 99% of the auction time i was winning for 1 pound (and would have been psyched to get it for that), but i can buy another (same condition) copy from an ebay seller here in the states for $24.99 (plus shipping). i considered this my "outside option" (working in some bargaining theory lingo - see Abhinay Mithoo "Bargaining with Applications" Cambridge U Press 1999) and, with the exchange rate and 7 pounds shipping, i set my max bid at 11 pounds (which would equal the american item with shipping).

so... the 8 pound result still saved me a couple of dollars off my USA equivalent (and i assume away the difference in shipping time).

there you go!

ps - i often get sniped and kick myself as well. when i feel regret, i realize i hadn't thought hard enough about my true valuation (or simply didn't have the funds to bid my true valuation)

this doesn't contradict what I was saying, people don't bid their true max / "true valuation" (which is slightly more than you want). However, you STILL should snipe because it's still better to pay less than your true max even if you're willing to pay more. Why throw away that money?

[Paul Shirley]

Can't you e mail the next highest bidder and tell him the other guy defaulted and now the camera is his.

Or can't you do that anymore on e bay.

Stu.

nah the next guy didnt want to know .thinking i had bid the auction up myself and came unstuck , anyway how you doing stu ? hope your well my friend not heard owt from you for a while ,

[Ljblanken]

this doesn't contradict what I was saying, people don't bid their true max / "true valuation" (which is slightly more than you want). However, you STILL should snipe because it's still better to pay less than your true max even if you're willing to pay more. Why throw away that money?

i totally agree with you.

the sniper program is a mechanical tool that punishes folks who are not bidding their dominant strategy (and, by extension, you are reaping what is essentially a "rent" by utilizing that technology).

[Koolkat]

i totally agree with you.

the sniper program is a mechanical tool that punishes folks who are not bidding their dominant strategy (and, by extension, you are reaping what is essentially a "rent" by utilizing that technology).

I thought Id stumbled upon the "VIZ" comic book site by mistake. You are MR LOGIC.

[Ljblanken]

I thought Id stumbled upon the "VIZ" comic book site by mistake. You are MR LOGIC.

no way - i am an idiot! (just ask my wife)

but i have recently been doing joint research with a theoretical economist which required me to dip into auction theory (because one can model all sorts of interesting things - such as wars - as "second price all-pay auctions"). its nice to read these debates on buying-selling records in an auction environment because it shows the mismatch between traditional, axiomatic models of actor behavior (ie. standard game theory) to more 'real' human behavior. BOBA's comments are correct because they lay out a strategy to capture extra 'profit' by exploiting one such common human failure in optimization.

btw, i think this example helps to explain the rise of empirically induced theories of human choice (cognitive heuristic models, prospect theory, bounded rationality, etc) and behavioral economics in general.

Edited December 2, 2010 by ljblanken