Only Dancing To What You Know

[Missgoldie]

Having DJ'd funk for years I know to keep the dancefloor full you need pepper your set with some tracks the dancers know but for the most part, when you have established the floor, people will dance all night.

Not so in the northern scene, I can't think of any other scene where dancers choose what they dance to on a track by track basis.

It can't have always been like this because all the records were unknown at some point, so when did this start happening and why?

Edited June 15, 2010 by missgoldie

[grant]

can vouch for that, stockport guild hall is such a place, they never dance to anything they dont know, just the same old, same old, but you just have to keep plugging away with a few tunes untilthey get to know 'em, otherwise it gets boring

[Steve G]

Hi Missgoldie,

It's mainly a UK thing. And more limited to NS as you say. I think it changed when the average age on the dancefloor went over 40

Not that way in Europe where as long as the music is good people will dance.

Not that way (much) on the modern scene either.

[paup-ine]

Hi,

Some find it out of their comfort zone dancing to something unknown, after just danced maybe to your fave known track, then finding they are not sure of the pace, breaks and even the words to silently sing along to.

I like to have a bit of space on the floor, so its not such a bad thing whne the floor clears a little.

AS said, keep plugging the unknowns, or no one will ever know them!

P

[Guest]

Having DJ'd funk for years I know to keep the dancefloor full you need pepper your set with some tracks the dancers know but for the most part, when you have established the floor, people will dance all night.

Not so in the northern scene, I can't think of any other scene where dancers choose what they dance to on a track by track basis.

It can't have always been like this because all the records were unknown at some point, so when did this start happening and why?

What a great question, interested to hear the replies.

Best r

Bob

[Spacehopper]

umm would like to say its cos of knowing the breaks etc but c'mon we didnt know the breaks years ago either and still danced....i think it is more to do with age...most cant dance all night without a rest anymore so pace theirselves by dancin to faves

europe and america have younger crowds who seem to be how we once were...as does go go children in bristol where only half the crowd are 'soulies' on the scene over the age of 30,the rest are in their twenties and hardly know any of the tunes but are well up for them as long as they are quality dancers....rnb,northern,funk,ska or beat

and remember we all get a little bit more....'not so good as the old days...this would have never been played at wigan!!' as we get older.......

or maybe jus cos there are not so many drugs being taken now

[John Elias]

fact is you gotta play to the floor!

your punters pay to hear and will dance to what's on the flyer

easy........

oldies night....play oldies (don't drop anything different in if you don't want an empty floor)

rare night........play rare (don't play mitch ryder )

nighter..........big nighter spins (lovely jubbly)

[Steve L]

A lot of people wont listen to anything they dont know let alone dance to em

[Guest]

Having DJ'd funk for years I know to keep the dancefloor full you need pepper your set with some tracks the dancers know but for the most part, when you have established the floor, people will dance all night.

Not so in the northern scene, I can't think of any other scene where dancers choose what they dance to on a track by track basis.

It can't have always been like this because all the records were unknown at some point, so when did this start happening and why?

Gosh

Its not really like that these days is it ?

I used to just have a great night out back in the 80s / early 90s on the Soul scene, used to dance all night and listen to all sorts.

so it seemed did everyone else.

the scene was really vibrant, people were open minded and intrested in records, new tunes to be heard every time you went out.

it was also a very freindly scene that was GREAT FUN to be part of !

great times, great memories and fantastic music !

Can't comment on the todays scene, Never have any spare time to go any where !

But I imagine as people have got older they can't dance all night anymore, so they must be dancing to their favs

and then sitting down again for a nice rest !!

Edited June 15, 2010 by mossy

[Dean]

I think familiarity has led a lot of us into being more critical (I include myself in that), ........ "I'll dance to this" ......... "I'll dance to this"........"I aint bloody dancin' to that!"

That critical approach can in my opinion go a step too far with the alignment of different tribes, only dance to oldies, only dance to modern, only dance if nobody else knows it.

Age, mood and agility also paly a part. For KevH it's if he's moved a piano recently or not. For Steve L there's a link to lager.

My memory tells me that it was common at nighters, for a DJ to introduce a new play, then play it again later in the set. This could sometimes take weeks to establish. I seem to remember Paris Blues by Tony Middleton clearing the floor at Cleethorpes before becoming an established nighter floor filler.

I think I probabaly dance so similar to most records that I'm quite comfortable dancing to something i don't know. I often find myself dancing to something I don't know only to realise after 40 to 50 seconds "Oh, I know this!"

[Guest livelikeasailor]

I love dancing,and I still get excited when I here something I've never heard before and its brilliant!

Just like when I was taken to see The Jungle Book at the pictures for the first time!!!

You just cant help yourself,you just have to get up and dance.

book early ................Katy.

ps......The Longacres, Willenhall was BRILLIANT !!!!!!!

[KevH]

.But...there's always a fear of the unknown with some.That awful moment half way thru a 80 mph tune - and wham - stops dead in a most unexpected break.And you're left wondering if its finished.....or going to pick up again.Always a good time to roll a fag,or check your mobile.Of course next time you'll be ready for it.Won't you.

[Sean Hampsey]

I guess the difference is that on many scenes, people 'dance' just for the sake of 'dancing' (therefore they'll dance to owt) whereas Soul fans tend to dance 'in appreciation of' and for the sake of the record.

E.g. At Cleethorpes on Saturday I wasn't there for the 'dancing' but was on the floor like a shot when Shirley Lawson's 'One More Chance' came on.

No doubt the 'Northern' Scene is a dance scene but with such a broad base of records and such a knowledgeable audience it's easier to be more 'selective' in how one expends ones energy.

The Modern scene is also a 'dance' scene, but probably less selective.

They really do dance to owt.

Sean

[Jumpinjoan]

For me it is a passion thing. I only dance to tunes that 'move' me.

Tunes that I have never heard before can't do that because I don't know them.

Simple really. Well for me anyway

[Gold Band]

As you must be aware by now Missgoldie, Northern Soul covers a vast array of different Genres it's a mixture of Soul, Funk, Popcorn, R&B, 60's, Ballads, Crossover, Sal Soul, Jazz, Motown & a bit of Disco. All of which have a different beat to the bar. It takes a very good dancer to adapt & to change as quickly as some DJ's can especially at across the board venues so people get up & down to their own comfort zone albeit the exceptional dancers who can change his or her dance style to any of the afore mentioned. Some individuals do have singular tastes, some have crossover tastes ie crossing over specific different genres or era's but what all have is a love of a great music. I have heard some say that they hate certain genres & then I've witnessed them on the dance floor maybe sometimes after a few drinks but still on the dance floor strutting stuff. So we may not all like all of the records we hear & some may be selective as to what they will dance too but at the end of the day it's all about enjoying yourself & the music that counts.

[Otis Smith]

The first time cecil washington c/u was played at wigan, I and a few others stayed on the dance floor( to dance of course), and Richard Searling, actually thanked us with his appreciation. Happy days, vickie baines etc.

[ImberBoy]

There are different audiences who are after very very different things.

The strangest thing about this is the vast differences between these audiences, you would think that there would be little to no separations but they are poles apart.

What we have now are venues who cater for these differences and those who wander into the wrong venues will find themselves at odds with the music and this manifests it self on the dance floor.

Sad as it is, we now have intolerant punters who insist on "their" music.

We can analyze the reasons behind this but an example or to first.

The couple who have a nostalgic look back at thier music that represents a 3/4/5 year slice of their life don't want to pay their money on a Saturday night to hear any thing other than those tunes embedded into their memories and any think else is a disaster.

The allnighter crowd traveling a good few hours to hear and dance to rare soul don't want to arrive and hear a set full of tunes they could of heard at their local pub soul night.

There are loads in-between but these two examples are the "oil and water" differences.

Analyzing this a little further, there will be loads of theories but age and financial constraints must play their part?

With the sheer volume of soul nights on offer locally there is hardly any effort needed now days to find soul music that taps into your perception of the Northernsoul Scene.

The saddest reality is that Northernsoul now is not the progressive celebration of soul, music any more; there are large slices of punters wanting to be hit with some thing special but most want the nostalgia fix and literally nothing else will do.

I find it impossible to believe that back in the day every one knew all of the records and that they would only venture out onto the floor to dance to familiar tracks, I am convinced that the CD years have given an artificial comfort blanket and fake memories of twirling and sliding to favorite tracks, the volume of Northernsoul records churning out month after month back in the day makes me suspect that most would have danced to new fresh tunes back then?

Where did it all go wrong/right? We got older and some got stuck in the mud all be it glorious mud, mud it is.

[Guest]

A lot of people wont listen to anything they dont know let alone dance to em

God yeah Steve , i couldnt agree more but on the upside , if i like the first few bars i'll get up and dance even if i dont know it xxx

[Stubbsy]

For me it is a passion thing. I only dance to tunes that 'move' me.

Tunes that I have never heard before can't do that because I don't know them.

Simple really. Well for me anyway

What she said

[funkyfeet]

fact is you gotta play to the floor!

your punters pay to hear and will dance to what's on the flyer

easy........

oldies night....play oldies (don't drop anything different in if you don't want an empty floor)

rare night........play rare (don't play mitch ryder )

nighter..........big nighter spins (lovely jubbly)

Don't agreed John I could do a full spot of Wigan Oldies and a certain crowd would stand about moaning that I wasn't playing oldies, they only dance to about 50-100 records when there are thousands of classic oldies.

Edited June 15, 2010 by funkyfeet

[Missgoldie]

One of the main points of this thread I stupidly left out... and that is, the dance policy of dancing to what you know is at odd's with what has driven the scene IMO and that's for dj's to play new discoveries.

[Sean Hampsey]

One of the main points of this thread I stupidly left out... and that is, the dance policy of dancing to what you know is at odd's with what has driven the scene IMO and that's for dj's to play new discoveries.

Agree, although the 'scene' is a bit like a bus ride - some folk decided to get off at the first stop, others at various stops along the way, while some just wanna stay on the bus to see where the journey leads!

That's people I guess!

Sean

[Jumpinjoan]

One of the main points of this thread I stupidly left out... and that is, the dance policy of dancing to what you know is at odd's with what has driven the scene IMO and that's for dj's to play new discoveries.

Absolutely!

That said, I never dance to a tune the first time I hear it.

But once I have heard a tune that I like I will dance to it the next time I hear it.

Like I said, I need to feel passion for a record for me to dance to it. And for that to happen I need to hear it first.

So no dancing to a tune first time for me I am afraid.

[Guest Mark Holmes]

Must say that my comfort zone is to dance what I know but I also love the feeling of hearing a record that I have never heard before and seeing a bunch of eager dancers who have heard it dive to the dancefloor, I think "hmm can't be that bad lets give it a try" do my generic "putting my toe in the water" dance steps until I see if it is grabbing me and then turn it up a bit and then a bit more and within a few seconds (coz thats all you reallly have) as the riffs and rhythm repeat and chorouses or girly wa wa's take hold get into the full swing.

[Ian Parker]

Having DJ'd funk for years I know to keep the dancefloor full you need pepper your set with some tracks the dancers know but for the most part, when you have established the floor, people will dance all night.

Not so in the northern scene, I can't think of any other scene where dancers choose what they dance to on a track by track basis.

It can't have always been like this because all the records were unknown at some point, so when did this start happening and why?

I know we all like to dance to our fav tunes but if i heard something i did not know..............if i liked it, i would dance to it

Even our fav tunes were unknown to us at some point

So i think its good to hear something that might not of been played for years, or even the odd tune that i have not heard before................... it makes a nice change

I have said this before......................i do get a bit bored of hearing the same top ten tunes, especially when there is so many other great tunes that don't get played

Debbie x

[Guest GFAS03]

Hi Missgoldie,

It's mainly a UK thing. And more limited to NS as you say. I think it changed when the average age on the dancefloor went over 40

Not that way in Europe where as long as the music is good people will dance.

Not that way (much) on the modern scene either.

Great thread overall.

I have to back Steve here regarding the UK / overseas split - I did a spot in Dresden a couple of weeks ago, and once the people got on the dance floor, they hardly got off it; yes, there was a lot of know stuff, but even throwing in cheap underplayed stuff kept them moving. There's a level of enthusiasm that I think comes from the lower average age and the fact that a lot of younger people getting into the scene really feel as if they're on a journey of discovery...

[Guest Matt Male]

I can't understand anyone that only dances to what they know. At the last Radcliffe i danced to five funk tracks straight played by Big George, i didn't know a single one, but i loved ever minute of dancing. I regularly dance to things i don't know at Move On. If i don't like it i'll get off the floor, if it grabs me i'll stay on.

In my opinion people who only dance to what they know are f**king idiots. Imagine sitting there thinking, 'oooh this is good but i'll wait until i hear it out next time before i dance'.

Edited June 15, 2010 by Matt Male

[Wilxy]

Having DJ'd funk for years I know to keep the dancefloor full you need pepper your set with some tracks the dancers know but for the most part, when you have established the floor, people will dance all night.

Not so in the northern scene, I can't think of any other scene where dancers choose what they dance to on a track by track basis.

It can't have always been like this because all the records were unknown at some point, so when did this start happening and why?

Great thread missgoldie! and alas the answer is as diverse as the question, and very well answered by most......Personally I collect mainly oldies(vinylwise), however I prefer only travel to hear sounds "unknown" to me (or thereabouts) but rarely dance nowadays to either ......."If Carlsberg made statements with regards to age and excuses not to dance to Northern Soul".....mine would probably be a poor one nevertheless...

[Casper]

I like to hear and dance to 15 out of twenty i know ...and learn about the other five ...that way I get best of both worlds you

cant "really" dance to something you dont know....you can just adlib as it goes on...hey, ....nowt wrong in that , but many like to know where the breaks, the slides, the fast bits n' the slow bits are... only then are you really dancing to the tune........just my take

one other thought is that in packed dancefloors you would stay on the floor cos you could not get off lol...n' if yer did you lost your space....so many people danced to what they did not know or had never heard cos they were stuck there not wanting to give up that space you just made

pete ktf

Edited June 15, 2010 by casper

[Guest Matt Male]

you cant "really" dance to something you dont know....

pete ktf

Totally disagree Pete.

If you get the rhythm and anticipate what's coming, it's easy.

Edited June 15, 2010 by Matt Male

[Guest Dante]

Totally disagree Pete.

If you get the rhythm and anticipate what's coming, it's easy.

Agree. It's not like you're dancing to a Beethoven symphony.

If you have a good ear you can know where the breaks are coming or ending. The structure is pretty much the same in most tracks.

And, on the other subject, I think there's few things more enjoyable and passionate than hearing a tune for the first time that grabs you by the boll^cks and drags straight into the dance floor

Edited June 15, 2010 by Dante

[Casper]

to anticipate is really to guess.....to think you know whats coming....not to say you cant have a good time dancing to something you dont know....but guessing is not like knowing... ......depends on how you dance perhaps ? one way suits all ? or full changes of pace and style ? ...i don't know ? as I said ...just my take, i'll get my coat lol

pete

[Bazza]

Totally disagree Pete.

If you get the rhythm and anticipate what's coming, it's easy.

This is true,makes no difference to me if I know it or not

Bazza

[Godzilla]

to anticipate is really to guess.....to think you know whats coming....not to say you cant have a good time dancing to something you dont know....but guessing is not like knowing... ......depends on how you dance perhaps ? one way suits all ? or full changes of pace and style ? ...i don't know ? as I said ...just my take, i'll get my coat lol

pete

I think Matt means anticipate as in to have a pretty good idea about something that's going happen - based on feel, what's happened before or or how it works in similar cases. Guessing sounds like something less evidence based.

Fact is, if it's blues based record, as tons of soul records are, you can see the changes coming about a week beforehand.

[Julie Moore]

God yeah Steve , i couldnt agree more but on the upside , if i like the first few bars i'll get up and dance even if i dont know it xxx

Me too Di and especially if im on a roll on the dance floor i`ll stay on it got to love quite a few choons that way

[Guest BigPaul]

I aint got a clue what im dancing to, so i just make it up as i go along anyrode

[Jumpinjoan]

I can't understand anyone that only dances to what they know. At the last Radcliffe i danced to five funk tracks straight played by Big George, i didn't know a single one, but i loved ever minute of dancing. I regularly dance to things i don't know at Move On. If i don't like it i'll get off the floor, if it grabs me i'll stay on.

In my opinion people who only dance to what they know are f**king idiots. Imagine sitting there thinking, 'oooh this is good but i'll wait until i hear it out next time before i dance'.

I could say that people who dance to records they don't know are f**king idiots but who am I to say what people should or should not do.

Or that they are f**king idiots because they do or do not do it.

[Julie Moore]

I could say that people who dance to records they don't know are f**king idiots but who am I to say what people should or should not do.

Or that they are f**king idiots because they do or do not do it.

Good post Joan everyone to their own

[Guest joecool]

Good post Joan everyone to their own

My feeling on this is there aint no new northern soul now just dirges that sound the same as the one that was played before , what ever hapened to the stompers uptempo sounds that defined NORTHERN SOUL ?.

[Realpeoplesmusic]

I aint got a clue what im dancing to, so i just make it up as i go along anyrode

It shows mate

[Julie Moore]

My feeling on this is there aint no new northern soul now just dirges that sound the same as the one that was played before , what ever hapened to the stompers uptempo sounds that defined NORTHERN SOUL ?.

Dirges

[Guest joecool]

Dirges

Sorry Julie but yes , same intro same middle bit and same end , the new stuff must be rare to the degree that it dont matter what it sounds like (within reason ) as long as no one else plays it.

[Guest CapitolSC]

My feeling on this is there aint no new northern soul now just dirges that sound the same as the one that was played before , what ever hapened to the stompers uptempo sounds that defined NORTHERN SOUL ?.

I love dancing to tunes I love, new tunes that suit me and uptempo, which is my taste personally, Solid Hit Soul provides that for me

[Ted Massey]

here we go again

[Julie Moore]

Sorry Julie but yes , same intro same middle bit and same end , the new stuff must be rare to the degree that it dont matter what it sounds like (within reason ) as long as no one else plays it.

Joe my dear friend ive been listening to SOUL music for the last 30 odd yrs so your telling me it all sounds the same so a lot of the stuff ive been listening to lately is same as

yours confused

[Guest joecool]

here we go again

O.K Ted tell me mate what have the tunes that have been played for a few years now got to do with nothern soul ? why was it not renamed smooth soul , girly soul , or even rare soul ,instead of jumping on the back of a nothern scene created 40 yrs ago , i just wish you guys had the guts to seperate what you play now from northern soul , or is it that if you actually advertised what you were going to play the takings on the door would go down?.

[Guest Phoenix8049]

Speaking from just a personal point of view myself.

I am not the greatest dancer in the world and to be perfectly honest.

I cant dance to a record that i dont know.

I feel lost and very self conscious not knowing whats coming next in the song.

Once i have heard it a few times i will get up and dance to it.

That does not mean i dont enjoy listening to the new ones though cause i do.

I have always been like that even back in the days at wigan.

I went to Cleggy at the week end and because i have been off the scene for sometime they played a lot of sounds i did not know but they packed the floor out.

I still enjoyed myself immensley though.

I suppose you could get a 1000 people giving a 1000 different reasons why they dont dance to certain tunes.

On the commrcial scene you can dance to anything cause all you have to do is look like you are moving your body and you dont look out of place.

But i think Northern Soul dancing is a bit of an art.

Stu.

[Guest Bearsy]

its not just about dancing to a tune you know or dont, for me wether it be an oldie night or a rare soul night it all depends on how the flow of tunes is going, if a dj is playing a mixed and fucked up tempo and all over the place then its hard to get a rythum going but if a dj is playing a set that just grabs me cos it flows and is just right for that venue at that time of night etc etc then i will dance to a tune if i know it or not cos the dj has built a vibe and when im in that groove i just love to dance, unfortunately there are too many djs that aint that good or just too predictable and even passionless so for me please mr/mrs dj play with a bit of passion and play what you love from the heart

[Ted Massey]

O.K Ted tell me mate what have the tunes that have been played for a few years now got to do with nothern soul ? why was it not renamed smooth soul , girly soul , or even rare soul ,instead of jumping on the back of a nothern scene created 40 yrs ago , i just wish you guys had the guts to seperate what you play now from northern soul , or is it that if you actually advertised what you were going to play the takings on the door would go down?.

Margret Littles

Henry C and the Ivy leagers

Parliaments rainy day

celebrities i choose you

im sure there are others people will list but these woud have beem well received 40 years ago

Ive been to some of the west mids venues and been suprised what gets the floor moving and it aint all 40 years old in fact now we have turned the Stables around with oldies have a guess what fills the floor as much as any other the Jokers Soul Sound

[Guest Polyvelts]

Of course its great to dance to stuff you know , but, if you hear something for the first time that totally moves you - you gotta just get up there and do it !!!

On a personal note Miss Goldie (hi Sam !) I know your spins via podcasts etc and tho I didnt know half the tunes first time if I was at one of your gigs - I would not leave the floor !!! Fellow soul sourcers check out her current playlists at

https://www.pbsfm.org.au/Documents.asp?Action=Playlist&ID=6308&Title=Boss+Action&PlaylistID=7442

and downloads at

https://daptonerecords.podbean.com/2009/06/30/beautiful-philosophy-by-miss-goldie/

and

https://rvamag.com/podcasts/clip/7882/midnight-soulstice-miss-goldie-aus-funk-and-soul-set

Rob