A La Carte ?

[Guest PERMAREPERTERRAM]

In what way is it a 'saving'?

What do you have to show for your cash but a load of CDRs full of poor/compressed recordings?

The main people on the thread commenting are those who have been involved in the release of CDs via the regular route.

Personally I couldn't give a toss if a 45 I own on original is put out on an official CD - and good luck to anyone who buys them.

I.M.O you are comparing different formats to excuse you being a 'handler of stolen goods'/'thief' (of intellectual rather than physical property - but a thief never-the-less).

so you mean to tell me that by buying a cd from alacarte i'm handling stolen goods,what a load of bollocks ,just for a moment consider what if (and its a big "if" i grant you )they are from his own collection all bought and paid for and he is just sharing them with us lesser mortals who cannot justify/will not pay out a small fortune for the kent/ace cd's, i really couldn't give a flying *%^$ where the tracks came from as long as i have the opportunity of hearing something i would never have the chance hearing by ordinary means,the whole argument is identical to the mid 70's scene with boot leg singles being sold,the saying back then was" its whats in the grooves that count"that still stands today the only differences being its whats in the format that counts !, there is also another thing and that was practiced by virtualy everybody back then and that was taping,we all knew it was illegal but we still did it didn't we ?and don't tell me you never taped anything i will assume you have taped something at sometimes so it would make you just as much a thief as what you suggest i and countless others are.

Edited December 28, 2009 by PERMAREPERTERRAM

[Cunnie]

so you mean to tell me that by buying a cd from alacarte i'm handling stolen goods,what a load of bollocks ,just for a moment consider what if (and its a big "if" i grant you )they are from his own collection all bought and paid for and he is just sharing them with us lesser mortals who cannot justify/will not pay out a small fortune for the kent/ace cd's, i really couldn't give a flying *%^$ where the tracks came from as long as i have the opportunity of hearing something i would never have the chance hearing by ordinary means,the whole argument is identical to the mid 70's scene with boot leg singles being sold,the saying back then was" its whats in the grooves that count"that still stands today the only differences being its whats in the format that counts !, there is also another thing and that was practiced by virtualy everybody back then and that was taping,we all knew it was illegal but we still did it didn't we ?and don't tell me you never taped anything i will assume you have taped something at sometimes so it would make you just as much a thief as what you suggest i and countless others are.

What part of 'please post an introduction on the following link before posting again' do you not understand???

https://www.soul-source.co.uk/index.php?/forum/44-new-member-shouts/

[Guest PERMAREPERTERRAM]

Welcome to Soul-source!

Nice to know where you stand, right from your very first post, as we all have different views.

Me? Bootneck, I mean Bootleg? - no, I'd rather have the real thing.

- Kev

hi kev thanks for the welcome, my problem is due to the fact i'm half a bloody northerner who says what he likes and likes what he bloodywell says !!full marks for the bootneck quip you saw through my disguise !!

[Telfordsoulboy]

I've bought a few of these & found them spot on; good sound, well thought-out & some really nice tunes.

I'd also prefer the originals on vinyl, but as the few of these there are will be in the hands of a select minority who do this sort of thing for a living, the chances are I'll never get them - hence the CD's in my collection. I liked Tim's because he is so obviously a real soul fan, with a real soul fan's feeling for the music - they weren't just chucked together - and at that price was obviously NOT doing it for the money.

So you who want to can buy vinyl only, whilst those of us who like a well thought out cd at a decent price will continue to buy them, alright

The ideals behind the A La Carte CDs were quoted earlier in this discussion. Great care was taken to stay away from records associated with the legitimate labels, hence the quote above...

This, again as I said earlier, is no justification or excuse. I made very little money from the exercise, and probably, if the truth be known... actually lost money. I still get a big kick from hearing new records, and tried and succeeded to stay away from the tried and trusted sounds and dug a little deeper into the achieves of the music to supply tracks that were forgotten or lost completely; whereas companies like Right Track openly compile CDs that both contain other companies released product and charge unrealistic prices for their content... albeit they come complete with glossy sleeves!!!!

I also notice that the Keighley CDs still being advertised along with a multitude of other scooter compilations from a variety of sources... so why did A La Carte take all the negative flak? Take a look at the 45s for sale on e-bay... are these very dubious looking records on looky-likey labels legal? Is there any justification in charging £14 for a reissue single... does the artist/label/writer benefit...I doubt it very much. So how do these professionally made and distributed records escape the wrath of the northern soul police? If indeed these records are of a dubious nature, than there is a much bigger story than the one behind the guy who makes CDs in his study!

Tim

[Guest PERMAREPERTERRAM]

What part of 'please post an introduction on the following link before posting again' do you not understand???

https://www.soul-sour...-member-shouts/

oooppss,sorry mr/mrs moderator i have now posted an introduction on the member-shouts page, a thousand apologies for my error

[Guest ScooterNik]

Not on the soul side as much, but I collect rare and obscure modern ska cds from around the world. This suffers from an identical problem as the soul scene has traditionally from its very beginnings - small label products with no financial backing, no publicity or airplay that I can use to get to find out what they sound like.

To get around this I have a tendency to download albums on spec, listen to them, decide if I like them, and if I do I then go and hunt them down from wherever in the world they are (You wouldn't believe the size of the ska scene worldwide - I've albums from every country in Europe, Poland, Russia, Japan, all over the US, Australia, South America.... everywhere!)

As a lot of the time we're talking 'only £10' or so for a full CD, but when you're buying a lot of stuff blind, it makes sense to do some background first.

Once I've made my decision, I either bin the CD if I've not liked it, or hunt it down in its original form. Bear in mind that 99% of the time the original product is also a cd, the collector bug is still in me, the ska version of OVO I suppose?

In short, I suspect a lot of people who buy the copied CDs mentioned hereabout will use them as tools to decide whether to buy an original vinyl/legitimate CD if available. I know if I see a CD with three or four tracks on that I like, then I'll buy it as it's usually a good guide to the rest of the album. Usually, not always though.

I can't be alone in this?

[Pete S]

The ideals behind the A La Carte CDs were quoted earlier in this discussion. Great care was taken to stay away from records associated with the legitimate labels, hence the quote above...

This, again as I said earlier, is no justification or excuse. I made very little money from the exercise, and probably, if the truth be known... actually lost money. I still get a big kick from hearing new records, and tried and succeeded to stay away from the tried and trusted sounds and dug a little deeper into the achieves of the music to supply tracks that were forgotten or lost completely; whereas companies like Right Track openly compile CDs that both contain other companies released product and charge unrealistic prices for their content... albeit they come complete with glossy sleeves!!!!

I also notice that the Keighley CDs still being advertised along with a multitude of other scooter compilations from a variety of sources... so why did A La Carte take all the negative flak? Take a look at the 45s for sale on e-bay... are these very dubious looking records on looky-likey labels legal? Is there any justification in charging £14 for a reissue single... does the artist/label/writer benefit...I doubt it very much. So how do these professionally made and distributed records escape the wrath of the northern soul police? If indeed these records are of a dubious nature, than there is a much bigger story than the one behind the guy who makes CDs in his study!

Tim

There's always got to be a whipping boy Tim. I get it when I try to compile an interesting dvd of rare footage unavailable elsewhere - they get up in arms and call me everything under the sun. I'm ripping off everyone from the artists to the tv stations. yet practically none of it is available anywhere, because I've sourced it and collected it and compiled it. But they can't stand me making a fiver a time off it.

[Guest soultan]

is sending a paypal payment as a gift not fraud or illegal too? that seems to be perfectly acceptable behaviour when buying/selling records on here, but someone somewhere is losing out on that revenue.

dont get me wrong, i have used the gift option on payal. i sometimes drive at 55 miles an hour in a 50 zone too, sometimes because i am late, sometimes just for the thrill of it.

think we are all a little prone to be hypocritical sometimes, if we are honest with ourselves.

[Guest Paul]

from what i can see from the replies to this topic the people with an axe to grind are the ones who over the years have spent an absolute fortune on buying the original 45's ,bigger fools them ! i have bought virtualy every cd alacarte have released saving me, if the going rate is anything to go by £100000's of pounds ,the quality of the cd's are very good,and many people like me who are not crazy enough to justify spending what amounts to a sizable mortgage on the real thing are more than happy with that,now there is also a debate on the royalties side of the eqaution,well to all those out there who have spent lets say £2000 ++ on a single i.e most of the moaners/complainers !!,how much of that £2000 ++ went to the artist? the silence will no doubt be deafening,tim everett provided a service to those who wanted it,me included and i for one will be eternaly gratefull to him for it.cheers for that tim

This is an interesting thread but sometimes there doesn't seem to be much point debating the rights or wrongs of specific issues. People have their opinions and some are unable or unwilling to look at things from a different perspective (and I include myself in that sometimes).

So let's stand back a bit and look at the bigger picture....

At the end of the day it's all about the "spirit" of the things we choose to do in life because our individual and collective actions can have dramatic effects on people. And those effects can be good or bad.

Almost everything we buy has to be designed / processed / manufactured / packaged / marketed / distributed / retailed so there are costs involved which need to be recovered before any profit is made.

If we all bought unauthorised reproductions or stolen copies of things all the time (music, clothes, movies, whatever) we would not be supporting the creators or those involved in the manufacture and sale of their products. In fact we would be kicking them right where it hurts. And that's extreme hypocrisy in my opinion.

The truth is that it's usually pretty harmless if just a few people "cut a few corners" once in a while but it can be very dangerous when too many do it too often. Jobs can be lost, lives can be ruined and creativity can be stifled. Obviously those in specialist sectors are most vulnerable.

I have a house and office full of records, CDs, books, magazines, audio equipment, music stuff etc. and I like to think that the people who created those things have earned something (however small) from my purchases so they can continue to create things which I and others might enjoy in the future.

Let's keep the world turning.

[Ady Croasdell]

There's always got to be a whipping boy Tim. I get it when I try to compile an interesting dvd of rare footage unavailable elsewhere - they get up in arms and call me everything under the sun. I'm ripping off everyone from the artists to the tv stations. yet practically none of it is available anywhere, because I've sourced it and collected it and compiled it. But they can't stand me making a fiver a time off it.

That's a different case, but if someone is spending a lot of time and money to do what you're doing legitimately then your sales would be affecting his potential sales and possibly enough that it would make any legitimate production uneconomic. If I collected rare paintings and found some nobody else had through my own hard work and skills, I wouldn't reproduce it for sale, I'd just be happy I'd got it and make it available to whoever had any rights. Surely collecting should be about just that and if you want to take it to a business level then that's another matter and you should play by the rules of the business.

[Ady Croasdell]

The ideals behind the A La Carte CDs were quoted earlier in this discussion. Great care was taken to stay away from records associated with the legitimate labels, hence the quote above...

This, again as I said earlier, is no justification or excuse. I made very little money from the exercise, and probably, if the truth be known... actually lost money. I still get a big kick from hearing new records, and tried and succeeded to stay away from the tried and trusted sounds and dug a little deeper into the achieves of the music to supply tracks that were forgotten or lost completely; whereas companies like Right Track openly compile CDs that both contain other companies released product and charge unrealistic prices for their content... albeit they come complete with glossy sleeves!!!!

I also notice that the Keighley CDs still being advertised along with a multitude of other scooter compilations from a variety of sources... so why did A La Carte take all the negative flak? Take a look at the 45s for sale on e-bay... are these very dubious looking records on looky-likey labels legal? Is there any justification in charging £14 for a reissue single... does the artist/label/writer benefit...I doubt it very much. So how do these professionally made and distributed records escape the wrath of the northern soul police? If indeed these records are of a dubious nature, than there is a much bigger story than the one behind the guy who makes CDs in his study!

Tim

Tim I think you're a decent bloke who did try and stay away from currently licensed labels and when you found out you were out of order stopped. So I'm not sure why you're seemingly defending your actions again. If Ace/Kent charge more for a limited press 45 or CD then the artists, writers, etc get proportionately more too and they are very happy with that. I agree there are a lot of people worse than you out there and we chase them the best we can. i just don't get the "you should be going after the murderers and not worry about the burglars" type of argument. PS That's a simile!

[Pete S]

That's a different case, but if someone is spending a lot of time and money to do what you're doing legitimately then your sales would be affecting his potential sales and possibly enough that it would make any legitimate production uneconomic. If I collected rare paintings and found some nobody else had through my own hard work and skills, I wouldn't reproduce it for sale, I'd just be happy I'd got it and make it available to whoever had any rights. Surely collecting should be about just that and if you want to take it to a business level then that's another matter and you should play by the rules of the business.

But nobody is doing it Ady and nobody has got half the footage I've got, what was wrong with making it available for a very reasonable price, if anyone was to claim ownership then I'd have removed what it was anyway. It does mean that loads of people are missing out on seeing stuff they won't find on youtube and the like though.