Would You Let The Camera's In?

[Thfcliam]

Was just wondering if people are for or against leting the media in, E.G making documentries and films etc on the "Northern Soul" scene.

The "This is England" documentary on "Youtube" got me thinking about it as I was reading the comments on there and alot of people were against it at the time but now alot of them can see why they did it. It seemed they wanted to keep it underground and most of them would not go when they were filming at the Casino or they kept out the way of the camera;s. for all kinds of reason, gear, etc. All the comments said the people on the videos were divs.

As I am young, would letting the media in, would it attract more poeple to get into the "Northern" scene and get more youngsters into it or would it spoil it? Would it help the scene so it never will die out? What do you all think? I personally would not like it but then again would it help more younger people to get in to the scene when all you oldies get to old ha ha?

[Guest kid mohair]

Was just wondering if people are for or against leting the media in, E.G making documentries and films etc on the "Northern Soul" scene.

The "This is England" documentary on "Youtube" got me thinking about it as I was reading the comments on there and alot of people were against it at the time but now alot of them can see why they did it. It seemed they wanted to keep it underground and most of them would not go when they were filming at the Casino or they kept out the way of the camera;s. for all kinds of reason, gear, etc. All the comments said the people on the videos were divs.

As I am young, would letting the media in, would it attract more poeple to get into the "Northern" scene and get more youngsters into it or would it spoil it? Would it help the scene so it never will die out? What do you all think? I personally would not like it but then again would it help more younger people to get in to the scene when all you oldies get to old ha ha?

I personaly think the less media coverage the better, ie, film crews, cat food adverts, ect, just keeps it a bit special, more underground the better for me. Andy.

[Guest jkw]

I personaly think the less media coverage the better, ie, film crews, cat food adverts, ect, just keeps it a bit special, more underground the better for me. Andy.

On the night(s) in question I didn't go - I actually regret that now....I never missed a Saturday night and that film is all thats left now...

so yes I say let 'em in...

Edited October 10, 2009 by jkw

[Guest Bearsy]

as long as they pay their entrance fee and film people doing what is natural then why not, if it interferes with the night in any way ie, lights on, stop start tunes, get people to move out the way etc etc then NO

Edited October 10, 2009 by Bearsy

[Guest dundeedavie]

any young people watching would be begging their parents not to EVER let them go

[Jumpinjoan]

any young people watching would be begging their parents not to EVER let them go

[Missing Link]

One of the problems with commercial film and television companies is they have to put an 'angle' on their film to sell it. When someone who doesn't understand something properly the 'angle' inevitably gives the wrong impression. 'This is England' is an interesting period peace which, looking back, is important because there is very little film out there which shows how things were (even if it was staged).

A good example of a documentary is the Channel 4 one about the Cleethorpes Weekender though even this had a slight 'angle'.

The only way to make a film is for someone who is part of the scene to do it especially as professional standard video equipment and editing facilities are readily and cheaply available (for example, quite a few cinema movies had been editing using iMovie which comes free with Apple computers or the semi pro FinalCut express).

Whether you could get it distributed or whether it would attract new people is another matter.

[Guest trickbag]

It seemed they wanted to keep it underground

whats underground

ricky.

[Guest dundeedavie]

It seemed they wanted to keep it underground

whats underground

ricky.

all the best things are underground

[Guest]

all the best things are underground

I used to get the northern line to tooting beck it was shit.

[Guest trickbag]

seems my blocked sewage pipes are underground and they stink,

my footings need to go underground thats a pain,money

iv a problem in the garden its a mole, thats underground

,

fcuk me whats next underground.

must be a rave night,at lest thats by word off mouth,

wonder what celler theyll be in tonight.

god knows.

ricky.

[Mach]

Aye....its a bit like, saying would you let somebody into your bedroom with a camera, and then start filming,...well would you ,......i know i would ...

[Mark S]

No publicity , your either part of it or your not , if your not tough ! sorry if that comes over as a bit harsh but the rare soul/ northern scene was built on people making the effort to seek out the music the venues etc not just being satisfied with the lowest common denominator dross they are force fed by the media .

This scene has been around for 40 years to my knowledge and is showing no sign of diminishing yet , its a unique scene with many facinating facets and kept alive by passion lets keep it that way , lets really keep the faith .

[grantdyche]

I did't agree with the filming at The Casino,But like many people have said before and maybe will again,There is no other filmed evidence,of the venue,So who are we to complain,

I saw the Cleethorpes Doc on channel 4 years ago,and it was worth watching,

The thing about keeping "The scene" underground,yes I was and still am a "It's ours type of person",

But remember back when I and many more of you people reading where on the "Outside",Hoping to get in,

And we did and to prove the fact,many of us are adding posts to this web-site,

I still want it like it was,But many more younger people now want it as it is,I-Pods,Camera phones,Youtube etc etc etc,

God if we had camera phones (Back in the day),

What would we see on Youtube!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Grant

[The Tempest]

Mates brother was there the fri night they filmed and he winged for britain that the cameras turned up , stating the scene was doomed !! ( blah , blah , blah )

He went on that this never happened at The Wheel , carried on for for another few years and gave me all his records & patches , result !!!!

[Guest Gogs]

any young people watching would be begging their parents not to EVER let them go

wish i had done this would have saved me a fortune but having said that i don't regret a moment or a penny that i have spent

[paultp]

As someone has already said, people who want to film Northern Soul normally have an angle so you need to know what it is before deciding.

Someone from the BBC phone me on my mobile when we were doing These Old Shoes and said they would like to come and film. I asked them why and they said they were doing a 15 minute short on "Northern Soul in strange places". Eh? Evidently NS + Tower Bridge was their angle.

I said I didn't see what was strange about playing soul music in a basement in London as it had gone on since the 60's. The lady got a bit tetchy after that and gave the impression that I shouldn't be asking questions as it was the BBC saying they were going to come and film us. I said I was pretty reluctant as we didn't want putting in the public eye.

She then said "So, is it just a load of old blokes dancing round reliving their past then?" after a pause I asked her if that was what they wanted to film and if so why? I reminded her that she had phoned me, thanked her and said goodbye.

At the next TOS I half expected them to turn up and was worried all night in case they did.

So it is a NO from me.

Why record things for posterity? Just rely on your memory - it is always a better experience.

[Guest proudlove]

Lets be honest here--------if people had turned up at early clubs with camera crews they would have been going home without their expensive kit,their clothes,shoes,watches and wallets,and probably their cars.

What goes on now is a sanitized,popularised version of what really went on.

I for one wouldn't go within a hundred miles of any where that was being filmed.

Wigan turned into a disco---------- an embarrasing caricature of the nighter scene that I loved ,bastardised for the media and profit-------the only reason to let cameras in was a cynical marketing ploy---------more exposure=more punters through the door.

That was the night that for a lot of people the niter scene died.

Because of that documentary the"Northern scene" will always be baggies,badges and bar towels-----and maybe for some people it was----------------but for a lot of people it wasn't.

So as you may have guessed the answer is a resounding no from me.

Steve.

[Guest]

Better get used to it,along with ctv in a lot of clubs and new camara tech stuff we probberly wont know till we see 'em on u-tube or some docu' thingy.

But no

[Guest johnm]

loads of pictures, video clips etc.. in the Gallery of various types of nights from today ... so why not?

[Naughty Boy]

Lets be honest here --------if people had turned up at early clubs with camera crews they would have been going home without their expensive kit,their clothes,shoes,watches and wallets,and probably their cars.

What goes on now is a sanitized,popularised version of what really went on.

I for one wouldn't go within a hundred miles of any where that was being filmed.

Wigan turned into a disco---------- an embarrasing caricature of the nighter scene that I loved ,bastardised for the media and profit-------the only reason to let cameras in was a cynical marketing ploy---------more exposure=more punters through the door.

That was the night that for a lot of people the niter scene died.

Because of that documentary the"Northern scene" will always be baggies,badges and bar towels-----and maybe for some people it was----------------but for a lot of people it wasn't.

So as you may have guessed the answer is a resounding no from me.

Steve.

Yes it did totaly agree plus dont 4get the wigansovulation and totp's .

funny thing and poss proof when i first started on the scene before all these things took place there were about five guys in my area that did northern

after all the commercialisation there must have been around *80* all if not most would have got a wigan membership went once or twice. * been there dun it got t shirt* one or two may have resurfaced in the last 10 years and since gone again.

So my answer is no. However its a shame someone on the scene aint gone round venues and made one from most folks perspective of the scene

Rob

[Guest proudlove]

loads of pictures, video clips etc.. in the Gallery of various types of nights from today ... so why not?

I agree with you to a point,I wasn't dissing personal photos and I think it is a bit of a shame that there isn't more from the early days,the thing that me and many others despised was the blatant exploitation.

[ImberBoy]

The first time I deployed to Bosnia we where very aware of the camera presence and we all saw a film clip of a soldier who was caught in the glare of an ITN news camera, he went on to embarrass the whole of the British forces by saying that every thing was shit, it wasn't and he was just being a knob. Thankfully the news crew realized this and never aired the piece, it is now used as an example of how easy it can be to shoot your self in the foot. An opinion is one thing but an excuse to vent your spleen is another.

The British Forces Broadcasting Services came and filmed me for a complete day interviewing me about The Armed Forces Scooter Club for a program about servicemen serving in Germany and their hobbies.

I was very cautious about them just doing the Mods n Rockers thing and I spoke at great lengths to concentrate on the enthusiast's side rather than the silly Mods n Parkas thing.

It came on after the news and after edits the whole program became an embarrassment, I would never do it again.

[Ady Croasdell]

Some are good some are rubbish, you start off accepting them all, flattered by the interest and exposure and then you get a bit pickier. The best one on the 100 Club was a 10 minute London news item I remember Marva Josie singing Don't. The best on Cleethorpes was Elaine Constantine's one that wasn't ever broadcast.

[Guest gordon russell]

all the best things are underground

THE LONDON UNDERGROUND IS UNDERGROUND and that,s not very good

[Guest gordon russell]

Some things that happen after dark are best spoken in hushed tones only by those who know.This is not for the likes of mere mortals

[macca]

I think Wigan started to 'sell out' well before 'This England'. What about Dave McAleer from PYE being invited to The Casino? Before we knew it we had a UK label called, of all things, 'Disco Demand', a term repulsive to most of us. Russ Winstanley milked it for all it was worth, within 18 months of the first all-nighter. The Wigan's Chosen Few/Javells debacle came in 1974, with Wigan's Ovation hot on their heels in 1975 right? The arrival of the film crews in 1977 shouldn't taken anyone by surprise. I only attended The Casino two or three times that year, preferring St.Ives to an 8 hour cross-country train odyssey. Strangely enough, I find the documentary much more watchable today than back then. In answer to the question about letting in film crews today, I would say no.

[Guest biggray1]

Lets be honest here--------if people had turned up at early clubs with camera crews they would have been going home without their expensive kit,their clothes,shoes,watches and wallets,and probably their cars.

What goes on now is a sanitized,popularised version of what really went on.

I for one wouldn't go within a hundred miles of any where that was being filmed.

Wigan turned into a disco---------- an embarrasing caricature of the nighter scene that I loved ,bastardised for the media and profit-------the only reason to let cameras in was a cynical marketing ploy---------more exposure=more punters through the door.

That was the night that for a lot of people the niter scene died.

Because of that documentary the"Northern scene" will always be baggies,badges and bar towels-----and maybe for some people it was----------------but for a lot of people it wasn't.

So as you may have guessed the answer is a resounding no from me.

Steve.

Totaly agree Steve,wots more every tosser who was involved or had been involved with the Dj or promotional aspects of the Casino and its like thought it owed them a living..and THEY still do today...get a grip will ya,the Casino has gone and it aint comin back,start looking for a venue that can take its place,run by soulies for soulies..Norther Soul dont owe anybody nowt..its these hanger on.s who thinks it does!

[Shsdave]

Many a true word spoken there...Disco Demand...Why?? Think that late 74 when it wasn't called NS then...But it was good for the memories......

Really ? What was it called then ?

[Guest biggray1]

Really ? What was it called then ?

Its called Disco Demand series..can you call it anything else.

[grant]

Was just wondering if people are for or against leting the media in, E.G making documentries and films etc on the "Northern Soul" scene.

The "This is England" documentary on "Youtube" got me thinking about it as I was reading the comments on there and alot of people were against it at the time but now alot of them can see why they did it. It seemed they wanted to keep it underground and most of them would not go when they were filming at the Casino or they kept out the way of the camera;s. for all kinds of reason, gear, etc. All the comments said the people on the videos were divs.

As I am young, would letting the media in, would it attract more poeple to get into the "Northern" scene and get more youngsters into it or would it spoil it? Would it help the scene so it never will die out? What do you all think? I personally would not like it but then again would it help more younger people to get in to the scene when all you oldies get to old ha ha?

yep, why not

[Ian Parker]

As said earlier. its the only film footage inside that wonderful building. I have very few memories inside the casino so its good to see a reminder.

[Guest proudlove]

As said earlier. its the only film footage inside that wonderful building. I have very few memories inside the casino so its good to see a reminder.

Post number 20--------------as said each to their own------------baggies and circle skirts-------cartoon time.

[Ian Parker]

Ian - Baggies and circle skirts were the fashion of the time. clothing is irrelevant to the thread, its about letting cameras in

Debbie - I do like a bit of vintage clothing, & being a fashion historian for many years i did enjoy seeing the footage of the fashions from the 70s

I dont think i would like to be filmed now at a venue, as its just my social night out, with some good people, listening to good music

But like most of these threads, you cant keep everyone happy all of the time & the odd person likes to be rude as usual

But as they say, each to their own!

Edited October 11, 2009 by parkash

[grantdyche]

I think Wigan started to 'sell out' well before 'This England'. What about Dave McAleer from PYE being invited to The Casino? Before we knew it we had a UK label called, of all things, 'Disco Demand', a term repulsive to most of us. Russ Winstanley milked it for all it was worth, within 18 months of the first all-nighter. The Wigan's Chosen Few/Javells debacle came in 1974, with Wigan's Ovation hot on their heels in 1975 right? The arrival of the film crews in 1977 shouldn't taken anyone by surprise. I only attended The Casino two or three times that year, preferring St.Ives to an 8 hour cross-country train odyssey. Strangely enough, I find the documentary much more watchable today than back then. In answer to the question about letting in film crews today, I would say no.

At the time of the sell out I was maybe aged 14-15,Disco Demand let me hear the records I would never have heard,Was it a sell out.for without the SELL OUT,I would not be typing this I would still be a Glam Rocker,

Give it a break for gods sake Wigan Casino was a club of its time,the same as the "Haccienda in Madchester"How many cd's were made of that club / or bootleg vinyls before it became a no go area

The Casino was / and still is a money maker,and long may it be so in my opinion,

Listen my friends, You and I went there in the many thousands,Why??? Because we wanted to thats all!!!

Now back to the thread---As I have said before NO

Keep the Faith as long as you feel it's worth keeping

Grant

[Mark S]

Consider if you will the consequences of comercialisation when the likes of Kev Roberts and Russ Winstanly thought they were record producers . Remember Wigans Ovation ......................Remember The Soul Masters ...............YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED...................

Quickly everyone underground

[Guest biggray1]

Consider if you will the consequences of comercialisation when the likes of Kev Roberts and Russ Winstanly thought they were record producers . Remember Wigans Ovation ......................Remember The Soul Masters ...............YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED...................

Quickly everyone underground

Bang on Mark...as i said Northern Soul dont owe anyone owt...

[Guest James Trouble]

They should use northern soul for sanitary towel adverts. That would be great

Or dog food.

[Guest espo]

Interesting---what would they use as a backing track?

1.Its woof out there

2.Throw away zone

[Guest James Trouble]

Interesting---what would they use as a backing track?

1.Its woof out there

2.Throw away zone

Pad Out by The Unknown? Catchy funky instrumental.

No one is going to record a documentary about the soul scene today, not in the UK. Don't worry yourselves.

[KevH]

They should use northern soul for sanitary towel adverts. That would be great

Or dog food.

You know what,you're right!!.The cat's got Rubin - what did the dog's get? F all.

OOOOOOOOOOOOWWWWW Bodyform,bodyform for youooooooooooo!!!!

[Shsdave]

Twas called Soul,mate!!(HANG ONTO YOUR HAT!!!)

Webby are you seriously trying to tell me that the term Northern Soul wasn't being used in 1974 ?

Or have I misread your post ?

Dave

[Steve L]

Webby are you seriously trying to tell me that the term Northern Soul wasn't being used in 1974 ?

Or have I misread your post ?

Dave

It was definately Northern here in 74

[macca]

At the time of the sell out I was maybe aged 14-15,Disco Demand let me hear the records I would never have heard,Was it a sell out.for without the SELL OUT,I would not be typing this I would still be a Glam Rocker,

Give it a break for gods sake Wigan Casino was a club of its time,the same as the "Haccienda in Madchester"How many cd's were made of that club / or bootleg vinyls before it became a no go area

The Casino was / and still is a money maker,and long may it be so in my opinion,

Listen my friends, You and I went there in the many thousands,Why??? Because we wanted to thats all!!!

Now back to the thread---As I have said before NO

Keep the Faith as long as you feel it's worth keeping

Grant

Sorry, but I still think the term 'disco demand' was ill chosen.

I don't think any of us went to 'discos' to hear rare soul back in 74/5.

Ian Levine's PYE album was excellent. Nowt wrong with releasing records.

But why did the PYE singles thing go the way it did?

They had a wealth of material there from Wand & Scepter and we got things like The FlintNiks, The Sha Na Netts, Wayne Gibson and Wigan's Chosen Few instead.

Admittedly there were a few decent things, but given the wealth of material it could have been a lot better.

Was it due to Winstanley's tutelage? Rest assured McAleer would have been none the wiser.

Far from giving it a rest, as it were, I stand by my comments. Saludos...

[Guest sarahleen]

Webby are you seriously trying to tell me that the term Northern Soul wasn't being used in 1974 ?

Or have I misread your post ?

Dave

i remember it being used at youth clubs in spen valley and bradford in 1975 , definatley

[Guest POTTERIESPECK]

BLUES & SOUL March - 1975 - FRANK ELSON Column. My views much the same as Frank's 34 years on.

[Guest nhsoulie]

fuck the middle class media and anyone who agrees with it it will mean the end for sure

[macca]

March 1975, a good two years before This England, which shows that

Mike Walker didn't really give a toss about members' wishes on this issue.

[Guest proudlove]

Post number 20--------------as said each to their own------------baggies and circle skirts-------cartoon time.

If this post has upset people I apologise------I really shouldn't post when I've got my grumpy head on.

Steve

[TOAD]

no no no

its bad enough with the trash thats on sale at weekenders and dogdy bootlegs etc

let it fade out on a high than cheapen the whole scene

as for young uns

WHERE ARE THEY NOT ENOUGH TO KEEP IT GOING ! SO FORGET IT