Green Stax - How Many?

[45cellar]

Do we know how Titles many were produced on this Green Label

& Over which period of time.

Doesn't appear to be more than a matter of months

>>> GREEN STAX ARTICLE <<<

This one has HOLD ON I'M COMING ON FLIP (Double A)

Some Sort of RE-ISSUE, which I found strange as I assume a similar release period

to that of the Green Stax S-242 "I Thank You" Copy, also a RE-ISSUE.

Edited September 17, 2009 by 45cellar

[John Reed]

I remember reading that it was all to do with the change in distributer and who owned the back catelogue and the stax logo, which is why the green releases came out for a while

[Jerry Hipkiss]

I remember reading that it was all to do with the change in distributer and who owned the back catelogue and the stax logo, which is why the green releases came out for a while

Possibly after Atlantic broke the news to Jim Stewart that they, not Stax, owned all the masters? There's reference to that event in Peter Guralnicks book on Southern Soul. Must admit I've never seen these green 'uns before!

[Guest TONY ROUNCE]

Possibly after Atlantic broke the news to Jim Stewart that they, not Stax, owned all the masters? There's reference to that event in Peter Guralnicks book on Southern Soul. Must admit I've never seen these green 'uns before!

I think that's just a coincidence, actually.

The earliest 'new' Stax record to come on the green label is 240 (Albert King - Cold Feet). I think that pretty much all of the releases from 214 to 253 were pressed on both the blue and green labels, apart from 243 (the 'local-only release by the Memphis Nomads). Mind you, that could be wrong, as I have never seen 246 and 247 on green.

There are also WLPs that incoporate the redesign of the green label - I have Mable John's "Able Mable" and JT's "I Ain't Particular" on demos like that.

Stax also redesigned the Volt label at the very end of the Atlantic era, but as far as I know, the only three records that have 'both' designs are 161 (Lynda Lyndell), 162 (Otis Redding "Happy Song") and 163 (The Mad Lads "Whatever Hurts You").

The green versions of earlier releases are just Atlantic's represses of earlier hits, done after Stax had divorced itself from them. I've no idea how many of those exist, but I have seen others beyond Roger's "Philly Dog", I've just not taken too much notice of them. I think the same goes for some Volt hits, I'm sure I've seen "Dock Of The Bay" on one of the later Volt's too...

[mshoals]

I think that's just a coincidence, actually.

The earliest 'new' Stax record to come on the green label is 240 (Albert King - Cold Feet). I think that pretty much all of the releases from 214 to 253 were pressed on both the blue and green labels, apart from 243 (the 'local-only release by the Memphis Nomads). Mind you, that could be wrong, as I have never seen 246 and 247 on green.

There are also WLPs that incoporate the redesign of the green label - I have Mable John's "Able Mable" and JT's "I Ain't Particular" on demos like that.

Stax also redesigned the Volt label at the very end of the Atlantic era, but as far as I know, the only three records that have 'both' designs are 161 (Lynda Lyndell), 162 (Otis Redding "Happy Song") and 163 (The Mad Lads "Whatever Hurts You").

The green versions of earlier releases are just Atlantic's represses of earlier hits, done after Stax had divorced itself from them. I've no idea how many of those exist, but I have seen others beyond Roger's "Philly Dog", I've just not taken too much notice of them. I think the same goes for some Volt hits, I'm sure I've seen "Dock Of The Bay" on one of the later Volt's too...

Are you sure there were green Stax 45s / multicoloured Volt 45s pressed *before* the Stax/Atlantic divorce (May '68)? In the Stax newsgroup I found a quote by Stax expert Rene Wu stating:

"After the distribution deal was concluded in May 1968, Atlantic became the

owner of all Stax/Volt material.

However, the stack of record logo as well as the lightning logo remained at

Stax.

So Atlantic was not able to released records with those logo's. That's why

they introduced the green and multicolored Volt label.

To gain airplay Atlantic released promo copy's of those newly labelled 45's.

( about the same reasons why a record company had one or more sub labels)."

(see also thread https://www.soul-sour...1entry1102523 )

Stax 247 also exists on green:

Some other multi-coloured Volt 45s I have are 117, 138 (Otis Redding) and 160:

[Sebastian]

I have never seen 246 and 247 on green.

I have seen 246 on green, but don't have a scan at hand at the moment.

Here's 247:

WHOOPS! mshoals beat me to it... styrene issue above though, not vinyl.

Edited September 17, 2009 by Sebastian

[Garethx]

These last Atlantic-distributed Stax and Volt releases used the logotypes which had previously existed on the album covers as opposed to the label marques (i.e the stack of records and the multiple lightning bolts for Stax and Volt respectively). Atlantic owned the copyright of the outer album logotypes but Stax had ownership of the label marques which, ironically, it chose not to use on records again. It did however mean that the neon 'stack of wax' could remain above the Stax building in Memphis.

It is my understanding that these records were recorded before the Stax-Atlantic split and released after it. Atlantic itself had been sold to Warner Brothers/Seven Arts at this time, which precipitated the re-negotiation of the Stax/Atlantic deal.

Time shows us it was an incredible oversight by Jim Stewart to sign away the Stax masters in the early 60s, but he was still very new to the record business and couldn't have any idea what a valuable commodity the recorded legacy of, for example, Otis Redding, would one day become. I'm sure if Stax themselves had owned the 1960-1968 masters rather than Atlantic they might have survived the financial travails of the mid-70s.

[Guest TONY ROUNCE]

Are you sure there were green Stax 45s / multicoloured Volt 45s pressed *before* the Stax/Atlantic divorce (May '68)? In the Stax newsgroup I found a quote by Stax expert Rene Wu stating:

"After the distribution deal was concluded in May 1968, Atlantic became the

owner of all Stax/Volt material.

However, the stack of record logo as well as the lightning logo remained at

Stax.

I would never dream of second guessing Rene. But given that 241 - 253 were all released before May 68, and that those records were around on green Stax before the 'divorce' (and that white demos with the 'green' design also exist - as I said, I have several of them) I am sure, yes...

[Barry]

Only thing I've got on it is Mable John's - 'Able Mable'.

[Guest TONY ROUNCE]

For the record, this is when the green Stax 45s were reviewed in Billboard:

241 - Albert King - January 68

242 - Sam & Dave - January 68

243 - The Memphis Nomads - was only released in Memphis and only exists on blue Stax. Not reviewed in Billboard

244 - Otis & Carla - February 68

245 - Ollie & The Nightingales - February 68

246 - Eddie Floyd - March 1968

247 - Johnnie Taylor - March 1968

248 - William Bell - March 1968

249 - Mable John - April 1968

250 - Rufus Thomas - April 1968

251 - Carla Thomas - April 1968

252 - Albert King - April 1968

253 - Johnnie Taylor - May 1968

...so they were all released before the 'divorce' with the possible but unlikely exception of 253...

[45cellar]

Many Thanks for ALL Information, Fascinating stuff.

Here's another VOLT Multicoloured, already mentioned by TONY.

Edited September 17, 2009 by 45cellar

[Guest Gogs]

2 different styles

[Guest Gogs]

poor label but still plays ok

[Guest]

[Kev Moore]

I have Carla Thomas 'Pick up the Pieces' on green stax.

Kev

[De-to]

stax 242

[De-to]

stax 249,

[Kris Holmes]

My understanding has always been that the Green labels were mostly 2nd presses done up by Atlantic of originally blue labelled stuff, so you get things like Green Onions, Tribute To A King, Cold Feet etc on green as legit 2nd pressings of these titles which all originally were on the light blue label. I don't know which ones came out "only" on green as new releases though.

[Guest TONY ROUNCE]

My understanding has always been that the Green labels were mostly 2nd presses done up by Atlantic of originally blue labelled stuff, so you get things like Green Onions, Tribute To A King, Cold Feet etc on green as legit 2nd pressings of these titles which all originally were on the light blue label. I don't know which ones came out "only" on green as new releases though.

If you actually took the trouble to read the thread from the begiining, Kris, rather than offering an opinion that seems to ignore everything that precedes it, you will see that none of them only came out on green. You will also see which ones did come out on green (and when they were released), and that the greens between 241 and 253 are not '2nd pressings'.

Sometimes I wonder why I fcuking bother - but for Kris, and anyone else who who can't be arsed to read a thread from the start, let's summarise (again):

241 - 253 - simultaneously on both blue and green, apart from 243 which was only isssued on blue. Not the use of the word 'simultaneously' as in 'at the same time', not as in 'second issues'...

Any other earlier numbers - green stock = repressess of titles that were originally available on blue, after the blue label stock ran out.

There are also white label demos of several of the numbers between 241 and 253 that use the 'green' design (only being demos they are in black and white).

Could I make myself any clearer?

[Kris Holmes]

Thanks for clarifying that Tony.

[Guest SteveJohnston]

If you actually took the trouble to read the thread from the begiining, Kris, rather than offering an opinion that seems to ignore everything that precedes it, you will see that none of them only came out on green. You will also see which ones did come out on green (and when they were released), and that the greens between 241 and 253 are not '2nd pressings'.

Sometimes I wonder why I fcuking bother - but for Kris, and anyone else who who can't be arsed to read a thread from the start, let's summarise (again):

241 - 253 - simultaneously on both blue and green, apart from 243 which was only isssued on blue. Not the use of the word 'simultaneously' as in 'at the same time', not as in 'second issues'...

Any other earlier numbers - green stock = repressess of titles that were originally available on blue, after the blue label stock ran out.

There are also white label demos of several of the numbers between 241 and 253 that use the 'green' design (only being demos they are in black and white).

Could I make myself any clearer?

Tony that's made things real easy thanks now if you could just do the same with the entire look at your box? threads as I can't be arsed to read them from the start

Steve J

[JOE TORQUAY]

if anyone collects green ( 4 ) or blue stax this guys has a few ending tonight

https://shop.ebay.com/muzicrewdj/m.html?_trkparms=65%253A12%257C66%253A4%257C39%253A1%257C72%253A1205&_ipg=&_trksid=p3911.c0.m14&_sop=1&_sc=1

[Garethx]

Tony's post clears up any confusion I might have had about the sequencing of these releases.

[Guest SteveJohnston]

253 going to play this in my next spot.

[Guest]

253 going to play this in my next spot.

You beat me to it Steve .....was just scanning this as I was reading. Its been one of my plays for ages off and on, amount of folk who dont know this one.

Edited September 22, 2009 by Guest

[Anoraks Corner]

For the record, this is when the green Stax 45s were reviewed in Billboard:

249 - Mable John - April 1968

251 - Carla Thomas - April 1968

Oddly enough last weekend I came across some copies of these two titles...both blue and green variants side by side in the same box of discs...all mint and unplayed. I didn't buy them, mind!

[Guest Perception]

253 going to play this in my next spot.

Great stomper this one, should be played out a lot more, if only it was rare it would get a lot more attention!

[45cellar]

253 going to play this in my next spot.

Great stomper this one, should be played out a lot more, if only it was rare it would get a lot more attention!

Johnnie Taylor - I Aint Particular - Stax -

[R]51924[/R]-(Clip from Refosoul Archive)

Nice One

Edited September 23, 2009 by 45cellar

[Jerry Hipkiss]

Johnnie Taylor - I Aint Particular - Stax -

[R]51924[/R]-(Clip from Refosoul Archive)

Nice One

Might have to dig my UK issue out later to refresh my memory!