Are Records Sold On This Site More Expensive Than Average?

[Pete S]

Going by the prices that many sellers place on records sold on Soul Source, I'd say that most of these sellers take the customers for mugs. I see records priced, two, three even four times what they're actually worth. I see VG+ records offered at mint prices, all the time. Does anyone buy off these people? This week I've seen a dozen or so records offered in sales that I wouldn't have minded buying, but most of them are for sale at DOUBLE what I sell them for.

Either people who buy these records are very rich, or just not up to speed on what records are actually worth.

Why would anyone buy a VG+ record for £150 when they could buy a mint one for £125?

Edited September 11, 2009 by Pete S

[Guest smigger]

Going by the prices that many sellers place on records sold on Soul Source, I'd say that most of these sellers take the customers for mugs. I see records priced, two, three even four times what they're actually worth. I see VG+ records offered at mint prices, all the time. Does anyone buy off these people? This week I've seen a dozen or so records offered in sales that I wouldn't have minded buying, but most of them are for sale at DOUBLE what I sell them for.

Either people who buy these records are very rich, or just not up to speed on what records are actually worth.

Why would anyone buy a VG+ record for £150 when they could buy a mint one for £125?

Have not bought a lot of here for the last 6-12 months. Mainly due to silly pricing and the same crap being offered over and over and over again by the same sellers.

[Guest]

buying off here is no different than ebay Pete. sometimes the prices are high, sometimes low. its the grading that pisses me off. although there are some very good sellers on here both price wise and with their grading, its the ones who grade well above the condition that are the thieving gits in my mind.

I wouldn't mind paying a bit over the top for a record i want, as i have done on a few occasions on here - only to find the record crap compared to the EX grading it has been given.

For example,bought one i was after for £60 (£50 would be about right) but it had EX grading so paid the extra to get the record i wanted. when it arrived, it had bad cue burn at begining and hairline crack right through pissed me right off

answer is simple - I dont buy off em again

having said that, there are some very good sellers on here - Baz A for example, even chucks in extra records now and again

Edited September 11, 2009 by mikecook

[Pete S]

Have not bought a lot of here for the last 6-12 months. Mainly due to silly pricing and the same crap being offered over and over and over again by the same sellers.

I'm not going to get into an argument with anyone but there's a record gone for sale on here in the last 3 days for £400 which I sell/sold for £125. One of us has got to be wrong.

[Pete S]

For example,bought one i was after for £60 (£50 would be about right) but it had EX grading so paid the extra to get the record i wanted. when it arrived, it had bad cue burn at begining and hairline crack right through pissed me right off

But how can anyone possibly describe a cracked record as being EX?

[paup-ine]

I think it could be a case of, lets see what can be got in the first instance?

You can always drop the price, but you can't raise it?

You could always offer less?

P

[Pete S]

I think it could be a case of, lets see what can be got in the first instance?

You can always drop the price, but you can't raise it?

You could always offer less?

P

I'm just trying to get to the reason why people offer their records for sale at higher prices on here than they would on a mailing list or in a sales box. Obviously a lot of people don't do that. But it's this VG/VG+ business that puzzles me the most.

[Guest]

beats me Pete - the cue burn alone would have been enough to lower the grade, let alone the crack - neither was mentioned in description

[Ernie Andrews]

Well Pete- I suggested a system that could be put on here when querying price that might help this situation and stop those asking ridiculous amounts for records. No -one wanted to take me up on it

I would even moderate the section.

It was basically an average price deduction system voted on within a timescale that would fix a price on a particular record for say 1 year. This would also be interesting from a research perspective to see how records moved up and down in price.

Basically you would use the same type of vote engine used on Football club websites with a timescale and require a minumum quorum of votes for validating a price.

My gripe about the Ethics - I want my baby back- is a good example but the old chestnut will come out "Supply & demand" My Idea would not be supported by the users of that saying!

Edited September 11, 2009 by Ernie Andrews

[Pete S]

OK then, anyone hazard a guess how much I should ask for this record below? Or rather, if YOU, reader, were selling it, what would you ask for it? It's a very rare and pretty desireable white demo of a record that probably goes for £75 on an issue (or £100 on here), this white demo is VG+/vg++ and it plays great with a few pops here and there.

[Guest jkw]

All I can say Pete is get back to dealing again - fair prices and honest condition ......

[Guest Bearsy]

totally agree Pete,

for very rare and hard to find tunes i can understand a seller wanting top dollar but some of the prices for everyday selling tunes is just laughable but even more laughable is when some get sold at those ridiculous prices

[Pete S]

All I can say Pete is get back to dealing again - fair prices and honest condition ......

I never stopped - was going to, but changed my mind and started selling my UK stuff off instead - and with the money I got from them, bought just US stuff again so there's going to be a cracking list out next week

[Simon M]

totally agree Pete,

for very rare and hard to find tunes i can understand a seller wanting top dollar but some of the prices for everyday selling tunes is just laughable but even more laughable is when some get sold at those ridiculous prices

Are you going for minters now Bearsy

[Guest jkw]

I never stopped - was going to, but changed my mind and started selling my UK stuff off instead - and with the money I got from them, bought just US stuff again so there's going to be a cracking list out next week  ' />

Now that I'm looking forward too......

[Guest Bearsy]

Are you going for minters now Bearsy

im always looking for minters but will make do until a minter comes along then sell the rough copy for more than i paid for the minter

[Simon M]

im always looking for minters but will make do until a minter comes along then sell the rough copy for more than i paid for the minter

I still got pictures of your mints that turned out to be VG -

Edited September 11, 2009 by Simon M

[Modernsoulsucks]

Well I can see 45s that I consider overpriced but where is the evidence that they are selling in any great quantity? As Smigger said a lot just go round and round with occasional appearances on Ebay inbetween. There's not many on here that update their sales lists so apart from remembering if it was on previously there's no way of telling. There are lots of ads with no replies on the actual thread but then there is the PM facility.

As for mugs, I think most on here are pretty astute and some not shy in pointing out the more adventerous pricing as can be seen in Pete French's ad for wants.

ROD

Edited September 11, 2009 by modernsoulsucks

[Pete S]

Well I can see 45s that I consider overpriced but where is the evidence that they are selling in any great quantity? As Smigger said a lot just go round and round with occasional appearances on Ebay inbetween. There's not many on here that update their sales lists so apart from remembering if it was on previously there's no way of telling. There are lots of ads with no replies on the actual thread but then there is the PM facility.

As for mugs, I think most on here are pretty astute and some not shy in pointing out the more adventerous pricing as can be seen in Pete French's ad for wants.

ROD

What am actually asking is are some sellers TREATING their customers like mugs with their pricings?

[Modernsoulsucks]

What am actually asking is are some sellers TREATING their customers like mugs with their pricings?

Then perhaps no, they're just drawing attention to themselves as being chancers. And once you have that in your mind you're less likely to buy then or in the future.. Well I am anyway.

ROD

[Mal C]

Spot on Pete, I dont comment any longer on the threads, cause its not nice.... but there are 6 or so guys on here who regually bring "What the F***" to my lips...

That said, I've also had some real bargins, you just gotta be quick...

You might list the better ones, ie the real price against the asked price, no names of course!!! He he

Mal.Cl:ph34r:

[mischief]

Pete the members selling at high prices are they dealers or collectors?

if a dealer.. then they aren't gonna move them on..simple bad for customer services.. if you get a bad name for your self.. on soul source it sticks...

If a collector may be pricing high cause they are not bothered if they sell them or not.. as its from there collection..

"only sell if it I get top dollar"

Just my thought on it...

[purist]

The key point here is condition, and how much below or above the regular venue box price of a decent player & looker should a vg or totally mint record vary.

it seems to me that most 45's ( maybe 3/4 of them ?) offered as recent finds stateside are vg at best, yet people ask, and indeed get a stupidly high price.

I think it's a kind of wishful thinking that sets in especially when in front of a screen, and faced with the ticking clock of an auction. These overly high prices then get transfered to the sales on source, as folk think " well if somebody paid £100 for a rough vg then mine is worth £150"

I also agree that if a collector needs to thin the herd then they are likely to ask up to 50% above the sort of prices you yourself would charge Pete, I know 50% above wouldn't get me to take stuff out of my collection in most cases, but then I'm a collector not a seller

[KevH]

What am actually asking is are some sellers TREATING their customers like mugs with their pricings?

Maybe there's a coupe of issues here Pete.Firstly not everyone has the knowledge to find out previous prices/value,or can even be arsed.They may have friends etc, who's opinion they value and take regarding pricing,which may have nothing to do with Price guides.

Secondly as Ernie Andrews points out ,,there's popularity atm.Not 5-10-15- etc years ago,but now.Might not agree with it, but prices on some records are dictated by that. Imo,pricing is a nightmare...if you sell something too cheap folk think you don't know what you're doing - ie: mug.!.

Plus,when times are hard,,and money's tight..........

Grading tho'.....different ball game.Fairly easy to learn ,if you're honest and want repeat sales.?

If you're happy with the deal you've done ,wether over or under priced is all that matters.

Edited September 11, 2009 by KevH

[Dylan]

Going by the prices that many sellers place on records sold on Soul Source, I'd say that most of these sellers take the customers for mugs. I see records priced, two, three even four times what they're actually worth. I see VG+ records offered at mint prices, all the time. Does anyone buy off these people? This week I've seen a dozen or so records offered in sales that I wouldn't have minded buying, but most of them are for sale at DOUBLE what I sell them for.

Either people who buy these records are very rich, or just not up to speed on what records are actually worth.

Why would anyone buy a VG+ record for £150 when they could buy a mint one for £125?

hope you don't mean the 4 i've just sold

thought all those were fair.

I do see some shocking prices as well and used to get worked up about things like that but now juts let it go over my head.

in fact i've juste seen one now.....

[Pete S]

hope you don't mean the 4 i've just sold

thought all those were fair.

I do see some shocking prices as well and used to get worked up about things like that but now juts let it go over my head.

in fact i've juste seen one now.....

I have absolutely no idea what you've just sold!

[Soulboy69]

I've actually got some bargains on here (well, in my opinion anyway!) so it's not all bad but i certainly see your point Pete.

As for buyers paying the 'over the odds' asking price, surely it's the old case of "a record is worth what you're willing to pay for it".

Maybe there should be a feedback system for sellers and their version of record grading.

On that note, i would like to recommend Mark Bicknell. When he says something is "Super Clean", it "IS" Super Clean.

I would recommend this guy to anyone!! Top bloke to deal with.

[Pete S]

I've actually got some bargains on here (well, in my opinion anyway!)

On that note, i would like to recommend Mark Bicknell. When he says something is "Super Clean", it "IS" Super Clean.

I would recommend this guy to anyone!! Top bloke to deal with.

But not a supplier of bargains...

[Dylan]

I have absolutely no idea what you've just sold!

can't have been silly prices then

[Pete S]

can't have been silly prices then

Dunno, don't think I saw the thread.

Hang on a minute

[Pete S]

can't have been silly prices then

I can't comment because I don't know any of the records.

[Munchkin]

Maybe there's a coupe of issues here Pete.Firstly not everyone has the knowledge to find out previous prices/value,or can even be arsed.They may have friends etc, who's opinion they value and take regarding pricing,which may have nothing to do with Price guides.

Secondly as Ernie Andrews points out ,,there's popularity atm.Not 5-10-15- etc years ago,but now.Might not agree with it, but prices on some records are dictated by that. Imo,pricing is a nightmare...if you sell something too cheap folk think you don't know what you're doing - ie: mug.!.

Plus,when times are hard,,and money's tight..........

Grading tho'.....different ball game.Fairly easy to learn ,if you're honest and want repeat sales.?

If you're happy with the deal you've done ,wether over or under priced is all that matters.

have some tunes i would like to sell but coz i cant grade or dont feel confident in grading they been sate in a box for months.......

[Guest]

have some tunes i would like to sell but coz i cant grade or dont feel confident in grading they been sate in a box for months.......

if they have cue burns, hairline cracks, pops & clicks - according to some, they are EX condition

Edited September 11, 2009 by mikecook

[paultp]

have some tunes i would like to sell but coz i cant grade or dont feel confident in grading they been sate in a box for months.......

Neck sticking out here but .....

... the best way to grade records for sale (IMHO) is to grade them so you would be happy with the grade if you received them.

Price is up to you .....

[KevH]

have some tunes i would like to sell but coz i cant grade or dont feel confident in grading they been sate in a box for months.......

Kev,just do it!!.Let me look first tho'..

[Reg Scott]

"Maybe there should be a feedback system for sellers and their version of record grading."

My primary reason for joining SS was to expand the opportunity to purchase tunes. My experience has been mixed to say the least and the only mature way of dealing with it is not to use the dodgy dealers again and give a piece of your mind in private.

Surely in the longer term, the only sensible system of sorting the wheat from the chaff is a feedback system (I think there's a thread already in the sales moderation section).

The system would be similar to the bay but tailored toward our needs i.e. grading, packaging, shipping time etc. The risk of unjustified 'bad' feedback could be moderated.

As for pricing issues, if something is priced and graded and you buy it and turns out to be what it says it is then that's just the way things are. We all have to be responsible for doing our research on what's reasonable but selling stuff that is a pig and dressing up as something else is out of order...

Just my opinion...

[Mark Bicknell]

But not a supplier of bargains...

Pete it's no secret that I'm pretty much done with the Northern scene certainly from a DJ perspective and have little or no interest in running or attending soul events anymore basically more out of choice and that I've got other interests and do other things, our business comes first as does family stuff, now I'm not that bothered about owning some of the records anymore so I'm prepared to let some of them go, the money is going into our business and other stuff and I still collect the odd thing here and there, I use the price guides as simply that a guide, the guides compiled by the likes of John Manship etc. not me, also why the hell should anyone give their records away when certain auctions etc. get good prices for them, guess it's about choice, I've sold several records here recently at pretty much the asking price based on rarity and condition, others have not sold and as I'm not really bothered one way of the other if I sell them or not will alway's consider reasonable offers and have reduced prices in private with interested parties and a deal has been struck, it's already been said that you can alway's come down in price but you can't go up, another thing regarding a bargain that's all well and good but constantly some people want something for next to nothing and try it on offering well below even a bargain price, I suggest it's not your business what other people offer records for either they sell or they don't, far too often on here people comment on other peoples sales when it really has nothing to do with them.

I do not wish to fall out with you or enter into a slagging match over this Pete but what I will say is this, I sell my records based on condition, rarity and how much I invested in them in the first place, turns out that many of the records I've sold in the past three or four years have been so called big ticket items, sorry if I've offended you with some of my asking prices recently, I'm not trying it on just simply trying to get a good return on some of the sales records for my own and my family's future and I'm sorry Pete if I see that Manship, Brady, Brown Etc. are getting big bucks or similar prices for certain records them I'm buggered if I'm gonna sell mine for less, half price or bargain basement time sorry but I would be a fool to do so, finally those that don't sell I will simply keep, reduce or haggle a deal with someone on mutual terms and not because you or anyone else say's so, again don't wish to fall out with you but you conduct your business as you see fit and I'll do the same mate.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

[NEV]

Going by the prices that many sellers place on records sold on Soul Source, I'd say that most of these sellers take the customers for mugs. I see records priced, two, three even four times what they're actually worth. I see VG+ records offered at mint prices, all the time. Does anyone buy off these people? This week I've seen a dozen or so records offered in sales that I wouldn't have minded buying, but most of them are for sale at DOUBLE what I sell them for.

Either people who buy these records are very rich, or just not up to speed on what records are actually worth.

Why would anyone buy a VG+ record for £150 when they could buy a mint one for £125?

Only mug i know is soul sam for buying that acetate off you Pete

[Pete S]

Pete it's no secret that I'm pretty much done with the Northern scene certainly from a DJ perspective and have little or no interest in running or attending soul events anymore basically more out of choice and that I've got other interests and do other things, our business comes first as does family stuff, now I'm not that bothered about owning some of the records anymore so I'm prepared to let some of them go, the money is going into our business and other stuff and I still collect the odd thing here and there, I use the price guides as simply that a guide, the guides compiled by the likes of John Manship etc. not me, also why the hell should anyone give their records away when certain auctions etc. get good prices for them, guess it's about choice, I've sold several records here recently at pretty much the asking price based on rarity and condition, others have not sold and as I'm not really bothered one way of the other if I sell them or not will alway's consider reasonable offers and have reduced prices in private with interested parties and a deal has been struck, it's already been said that you can alway's come down in price but you can't go up, another thing regarding a bargain that's all well and good but constantly some people want something for next to nothing and try it on offering well below even a bargain price, I suggest it's not your business what other people offer records for either they sell or they don't, far too often on here people comment on other peoples sales when it really has nothing to do with them.

I do not wish to fall out with you or enter into a slagging match over this Pete but what I will say is this, I sell my records based on condition, rarity and how much I invested in them in the first place, turns out that many of the records I've sold in the past three or four years have been so called big ticket items, sorry if I've offended you with some of my asking prices recently, I'm not trying it on just simply trying to get a good return on some of the sales records for my own and my family's future and I'm sorry Pete if I see that Manship, Brady, Brown Etc. are getting big bucks or similar prices for certain records them I'm buggered if I'm gonna sell mine for less, half price or bargain basement time sorry but I would be a fool to do so, finally those that don't sell I will simply keep, reduce or haggle a deal with someone on mutual terms and not because you or anyone else say's so, again don't wish to fall out with you but you conduct your business as you see fit and I'll do the same mate.

Regards - Mark Bicknell.

There was no real need for that very long reply Mark.

He mentioned you and bargains in the same sentence so I commented on that because IN MY OPINION your records are not bargains, which is neither here nor there but was, in the context of that reply. If you get a lot of dosh for your records then good luck to you.

[Pete S]

Only mug i know is soul sam for buying that acetate off you Pete

He didn't buy it off me Nev.

Please do your research.

[Pete S]

have added a not too be taken seriously poll at the top of the topic

[richardf]

The grading issue is a big problem. That is something you have to trust the seller on 100% and it is what they should base their reputation on. It's alright saying you can complain after but then there's always the feeling of mistrust and the possible accusation of, " That's not the copy I sent you".

As for pricing there are various reasons for this. The seller may not be bothered if they sell the tune so will ask a high price. They could also just be taking a punt but it's their decision, no one is forcing anyone to pay the asking price. I must admit though, it is offputting when I see a list that is top heavy throughout.

There's nothing to stop anyone putting in an offer on things, but some sellers do seem to take offence at this. Why I don't know, it has happened to me.

Buyers just need to do their homework, especially on newish soul and house tracks.

The thing that does annoy me, mostly on modern records and especially 12"s is, that often, it is not stated whether they are UK or US releases. Many of these had dual UK/US release often on the same label, but obviously there can be a price differential between the two and more desireability for the US release. (For me anyway)

[Oldfeet]

There are buyers and sellers that are just not up to speed on record values because they don't understand that the quality/grade of a record is significant.

Personally I blame the 'guides'

If JM or TB highlighted a record grading system at the beginning of their 'guides' and included the prices for records in nm, vg+ and vg alongside the mint condition value then those buyers and sellers who struggle to grasp the point might finally get it and make realistic calls on the price of records

[Pete S]

Personally I blame the 'guides'

The price guides are responsible for untold damage to the collecting scene, both for buyers and sellers. Auctions follow on closely behind. People see a ridiculous auction price, brought about by two people bidding on one record, and a day later, they have a copy for sale at what the auction closed at despite it being often hundreds of pounds higher than it's real value, having been bumped up by those two people trying to outbid one another.

[Mach]

Swings & Roundabouts IMHO.

[richardf]

One other thing that does go on, is that people will buy records at the going rate and then mark them up, just for the sake off getting a list out.

Oh and please stop the "books at" nonsense. It's a total irrelevance.

[Pete S]

Swings & Roundabouts IMHO.

Which bit?

[Pete S]

One other thing that does go on, is that people will buy records at the going rate and then mark them up, just for the sake off getting a list out.

Oh and please stop the "books at" nonsense. It's a total irrelevance.

I wonder how many of the book prices really are accurate. Today I looked up Rosalind Madison - Neighbourhood girl on Liberty, a great record but not a rare one, at it's peak I sold it for £100, nowadays I'd ask £75, it's in the latest price guide at £150. This just doesn't make sense.

[richardf]

I wonder how many of the book prices really are accurate. Today I looked up Rosalind Madison - Neighbourhood girl on Liberty, a great record but not a rare one, at it's peak I sold it for £100, nowadays I'd ask £75, it's in the latest price guide at £150. This just doesn't make sense.

Exactly. How many records have actually sold at this mythical book price

I hate it when I see Blah, blah by the blah blahs £300 (Books at 500)

If it books at 500 and the seller thinks that's a fair price, sell it for 500 pounds FFS

[richardf]

sorry bad day at work