New Book: On The Right Track With Dj Ginger Taylor

[Guest]

Excuse my ignorance, is the book just about Wigan?

Good question: do you know, I haven't got a clue. It struck me that it could be the next 'last of the summer wine' set in Todmorden - I checked it out and the assumption didn't look too far out https://www.todmorden.org/

I haven't been sticking up for the book or Ginger (and I wouldn't be so shallow as to try and judge him by the records he broke - what kind of bollocks is that?) It is more to add a bit of reason to the sweeping generalisations and the way people can use this type of medium to make the sort of critical comments that they wouldn't make to someone's face (not because they daren't, but simply because it is rude and disrespectful). This probably goes for making the comments after you've read the book - it is easy to make critical comments, and they're useful to make yourself look clever, but they come at a cost - and some of that is the fact that some people will not see you as clever, they'll only see the self serving and disrespectful aspect.

But I like the idea of Last of the Summer Soul - who would play Russ?

[Baz Atkinson]

Baz, I've been trying to make sense of your comments on this thread:

Are you saying the book is crap or are you saying give it a chance?

I suspect, from what I can piece together, you don't like books, but you're quick to slag them off (even if you haven't read them) because you are more interested in the records and think people are writing books to blow hot air up their own backsides? Is that about it or have I got it way wrong?

SS

Well some good points ,firstly i am not saying the book is crap ,how can I ? Ive never read it ,inrelation to hot air up arse well that made me laugh to be honest ,Ijust think that things have been so well documented over the last 5-10 years that I would question yet another account ,but there again Its entirely up to the indivivdual.

I think people may rush out and buy it my my underlying argument re any account is still the fact that it is one persons account of a purely subjective scene which great emphasis on djs as opposed to the artistes themsevles.

iM GONNA READ IT NOW AND MAKE UP MY MIND THEN COME TO IT AS OBJECTIVE AS IS POSSIBLE!!

BAZ A

PS IF IT IS GINGER HELLO

Edited May 18, 2009 by baz atkinson

[Baz Atkinson]

Good question: do you know, I haven't got a clue. It struck me that it could be the next 'last of the summer wine' set in Todmorden - I checked it out and the assumption didn't look too far out https://www.todmorden.org/

I haven't been sticking up for the book or Ginger (and I wouldn't be so shallow as to try and judge him by the records he broke - what kind of bollocks is that?) It is more to add a bit of reason to the sweeping generalisations and the way people can use this type of medium to make the sort of critical comments that they wouldn't make to someone's face (not because they daren't, but simply because it is rude and disrespectful). This probably goes for making the comments after you've read the book - it is easy to make critical comments, and they're useful to make yourself look clever, but they come at a cost - and some of that is the fact that some people will not see you as clever, they'll only see the self serving and disrespectful aspect.

But I like the idea of Last of the Summer Soul - who would play Russ?

You do have apoint about judging people by the records there broke ,but hasnt history equated the really big names on the scene with the records there have broke?

BAZ A

[Baz Atkinson]

Good question: do you know, I haven't got a clue. It struck me that it could be the next 'last of the summer wine' set in Todmorden - I checked it out and the assumption didn't look too far out https://www.todmorden.org/

I haven't been sticking up for the book or Ginger (and I wouldn't be so shallow as to try and judge him by the records he broke - what kind of bollocks is that?) It is more to add a bit of reason to the sweeping generalisations and the way people can use this type of medium to make the sort of critical comments that they wouldn't make to someone's face (not because they daren't, but simply because it is rude and disrespectful). This probably goes for making the comments after you've read the book - it is easy to make critical comments, and they're useful to make yourself look clever, but they come at a cost - and some of that is the fact that some people will not see you as clever, they'll only see the self serving and disrespectful aspect.

But I like the idea of Last of the Summer Soul - who would play Russ?

Lets get it straight I am not disrespectful to someone because i exercise a choice not to rush to the book store and as for books on the scene well,hand on heart has there been a really objective account of the scene without the romantic connatations? Has there been a book whereyou can say f--k me that hits me hard? I speak as i find to everyone and happy to discuss any issue with passion and enthusiasm ,i come on here to post soul records from a collection boiught over 4 decades and to spread the music as much as possible ,because i belive its the artistes that deserve the credit!!

If i come across self serving I dont mean to and those who know me wll validate that lol,I am asking myself this however why should my comments matter ,im just a modest record collector from the north east of england!

BAZ A

[Guest]

Lets get it straight I am not disrespectful to someone because i exercise a choice not to rush to the book store and as for books on the scene well,hand on heart has there been a really objective account of the scene without the romantic connatations? Has there been a book whereyou can say f--k me that hits me hard? I speak as i find to everyone and happy to discuss any issue with passion and enthusiasm ,i come on here to post soul records from a collection boiught over 4 decades and to spread the music as much as possible ,because i belive its the artistes that deserve the credit!!

If i come across self serving I dont mean to and those who know me wll validate that lol,I am asking myself this however why should my comments matter ,im just a modest record collector from the north east of england!

BAZ A

Strange thing is, the one book I've read that is by far and away the most 'objective' account I have read is the one you slated for being too academic - Andy Wilson's Northern Soul: music drugs and subcultural identity. I think I reacted a bit harshly to your comments on Ginger's book because I'd read you thread dismissing Andy's for 'reading like a dissertation'. I'd agree with that, specially for the introduction. I'd also agree that it is impossible to come up with an account of the scene that would find universal agreement. That said, the academic book is well researched, backed with interviews with former members of the scene and, from what I know of that period, captures it without the romanticism and without being partisan (to one crowd or another). It does that by being a genuine attempt to understand and explain the experiences of a group of people who joined the scene and how the scene affected them. To do the latter it sets out the way the scene itself changed. None of the books I have read, mainly because they come from people with a vested interest (in taking something out of the scene or maintaining their reputation) in presenting a view. When we've talked through what we got from the book, those of us who have read it, we came out with the passion for talking about the questions the book answered that we had not thought to ask. In making sense of the lives of others we had learnt something about ourselves and about those around us - specially those 'why the f*** did he end up on that? type questions.

As for the Ginger book: it really lives or dies by the power of his observation. He was in a good position to tell a story from the mid-level DJ level. He still had to make out and deal with all the crap that goes with it. Your opinion of it may matter - to other readers who may be swayed, maybe. But what if you had written it - or what if you had lined up a top gig and you read the post 'forget it Baz is a waste of space, low level DJ with no sounds, it'll be crap? Would you read that and think: aye, fair comment! Or would you think it unfair that someone has rushed to judgement? I am pleased to see you're going to read it (Ginger, what's the royalty payments?). As far 'there are enough already'. Look how many stories of football hooliganism there are: we went to the match, we sang, got pissed and had a fight. The order, the name of the 'team', may change but untimately they are repetitive - and they still sell (I presume). They probably do because they are not objective - that is, they are the accounts of someone's experience of football hooliganism. Where these stories involve a journey, something more than the pissed, fight and fook, they tend to be more interesting ... like the Briston City fan book (is it Bovver ... he's a soul boy).

By the way, we should thank you NE boys for an exciting end to the season!!!

Take care

Sam

[Baz Atkinson]

Strange thing is, the one book I've read that is by far and away the most 'objective' account I have read is the one you slated for being too academic - Andy Wilson's Northern Soul: music drugs and subcultural identity. I think I reacted a bit harshly to your comments on Ginger's book because I'd read you thread dismissing Andy's for 'reading like a dissertation'. I'd agree with that, specially for the introduction. I'd also agree that it is impossible to come up with an account of the scene that would find universal agreement. That said, the academic book is well researched, backed with interviews with former members of the scene and, from what I know of that period, captures it without the romanticism and without being partisan (to one crowd or another). It does that by being a genuine attempt to understand and explain the experiences of a group of people who joined the scene and how the scene affected them. To do the latter it sets out the way the scene itself changed. None of the books I have read, mainly because they come from people with a vested interest (in taking something out of the scene or maintaining their reputation) in presenting a view. When we've talked through what we got from the book, those of us who have read it, we came out with the passion for talking about the questions the book answered that we had not thought to ask. In making sense of the lives of others we had learnt something about ourselves and about those around us - specially those 'why the f*** did he end up on that? type questions.

As for the Ginger book: it really lives or dies by the power of his observation. He was in a good position to tell a story from the mid-level DJ level. He still had to make out and deal with all the crap that goes with it. Your opinion of it may matter - to other readers who may be swayed, maybe. But what if you had written it - or what if you had lined up a top gig and you read the post 'forget it Baz is a waste of space, low level DJ with no sounds, it'll be crap? Would you read that and think: aye, fair comment! Or would you think it unfair that someone has rushed to judgement? I am pleased to see you're going to read it (Ginger, what's the royalty payments?). As far 'there are enough already'. Look how many stories of football hooliganism there are: we went to the match, we sang, got pissed and had a fight. The order, the name of the 'team', may change but untimately they are repetitive - and they still sell (I presume). They probably do because they are not objective - that is, they are the accounts of someone's experience of football hooliganism. Where these stories involve a journey, something more than the pissed, fight and fook, they tend to be more interesting ... like the Briston City fan book (is it Bovver ... he's a soul boy).

By the way, we should thank you NE boys for an exciting end to the season!!!

Take care

Sam

Yep valid points ,just a point to note many people did rush to judge and thats their perogative surely? I am prepared to argue my corner and get it out in the open mainly because theirs so much bollocks and vested interest and I get sick of that.I did not slate Andys book i simply said it was reading like an academic account ,and references to disenfranchised youth ,well give me a break,I was at the casino not because I was disenfranchised and my dad worked in the north east coalfield [when we had mines that is] b ut because I liked the music and took the gear not because I was surpressed but because "it was f--king hellish".

As for me been judged if I took a high level DJ spot id say very unlikely ,I dont get to high level soul dos I only ever djd at Burnley,Lowton DDA and the Wilton so far and that is out of passion for the underground and yes valid point but if people do prejudge I would honestly say SO WHAT ,the worlds full of opinions and cliches !!! I would defend myself however so point taken.

Now your analogy with football books is a very good one ,I am currently reading the football factory again which imo is an exciting read imo ,ive read the follow ups and many fall on thier arse ,and yes ive read Bovvers account and its very good !

No thanks for the end to the season I watched my team last night with my old man at the local working mens club Sunderland and I was a nervous wreck lol.Hope this is my view on this closed now ,I will get back to it however when ive read it and ill get Andys full account also and give it justice!

You write well "have you ever thought about writing a book about the northern soul scene"

ATB

BAZ A

[Guest]

Yep valid points ,just a point to note many people did rush to judge and thats their perogative surely? I am prepared to argue my corner and get it out in the open mainly because theirs so much bollocks and vested interest and I get sick of that.I did not slate Andys book i simply said it was reading like an academic account ,and references to disenfranchised youth ,well give me a break,I was at the casino not because I was disenfranchised and my dad worked in the north east coalfield [when we had mines that is] b ut because I liked the music and took the gear not because I was surpressed but because "it was f--king hellish".

As for me been judged if I took a high level DJ spot id say very unlikely ,I dont get to high level soul dos I only ever djd at Burnley,Lowton DDA and the Wilton so far and that is out of passion for the underground and yes valid point but if people do prejudge I would honestly say SO WHAT ,the worlds full of opinions and cliches !!! I would defend myself however so point taken.

Now your analogy with football books is a very good one ,I am currently reading the football factory again which imo is an exciting read imo ,ive read the follow ups and many fall on thier arse ,and yes ive read Bovvers account and its very good !

No thanks for the end to the season I watched my team last night with my old man at the local working mens club Sunderland and I was a nervous wreck lol.Hope this is my view on this closed now ,I will get back to it however when ive read it and ill get Andys full account also and give it justice!

You write well "have you ever thought about writing a book about the northern soul scene"

ATB

BAZ A

I woke up this morning thinking I must apologise to Baz! I realised that the main problem is me not used to this medium. You make a fair point about commenting being the perogative of the contributor, because that's what this is, it's a conversation between people with a common interest representing a range of views. And that is an essential part of the process. The problem with the medium is that it allows too many people to listen in, the comments stay on file, we things that the subject of the remarks will read, when we likely wouldn't say them if they were sat around the table, and worse, stripped of the glint in the eye, the off-the-cuff comment can come across as more cutting than intended. I should have seen that!

I want to see Swish's book! Incidently, for the record, I am pretty sure that Swish was the first to play 'I'm on my way' (contrary to the claims made by others) he played a covered up copy at the Cats. No doubt someone will be able to correct that bit of speculation...

Good luck at the weekend! - as long as you don't lose by five goals you should be okay! Hull have got a tough one - especially if they think it'll be easy because the two R's aren't on the pitch! A draw at best. Your rivals are totally unpredictable: anything could happen and it wouldn't be a surprise.

Cheers

Sam

Edited May 19, 2009 by samsoulster

[Guest]

references to disenfranchised youth ,well give me a break,I was at the casino not because I was disenfranchised and my dad worked in the north east coalfield [when we had mines that is] b ut because I liked the music and took the gear not because I was surpressed but because "it was f--king hellish".

Sorry Baz, just noticed this: I don't think he does say that. If you look closely he's actually criticising the academic accounts that say that! The first bit of the book is having a go at academics who put theoretical accounts over experience.

Just listen at me! Jesus, it's the Ginger and Andy fan club

SS

[Baz Atkinson]

Sorry Baz, just noticed this: I don't think he does say that. If you look closely he's actually criticising the academic accounts that say that! The first bit of the book is having a go at academics who put theoretical accounts over experience.

Just listen at me! Jesus, it's the Ginger and Andy fan club

SS

No probs at all and definetly no aplogies you can help me actually what is the publiser for the 2 books I might as well get them on order through the local library lol as id rater keep my hard earned for soul records lol.Your right it is a funny medium to get your head around alelt a powerful one also,as for Sunday its sold out already I uderstand!!

BAZ A

[Guest sarahleen]

Picked up my copy last night at Brighouse,kindly signed by Ginger and Rob.Started the book today its a great entertaining read.Spoke to Ginger outside and he was telling me he was off to the Torquay weekender straight after.The man is still putting himself about,he is He is very approachable and if you talk to him with warmth and respect he gives it back double.a peoples man,a soulies soulie,good luck to him and i hope the book sales pay for a great seat at the champions league final for a champion DJ

[Guest joeythelips]

Oh dear..how ridiculously sad!

Oh dear.. how ridiculously jealous?

[Soulsmith]

Here is some info that I've copied & pasted from another site, which may prove helpful

Reviews

"A really entertaining read -essential stuff for any Northern Soul aficionado"...............Richard Searling

"Very Readable".........Ady Croasdell of Kent Records

Foreword by John Manship

"In the last 34 years I've have had nothing but admiration for a man who is honest, witty, intelligent and sometimes even humble" ....................

[Guest]

you can help me actually what is the publiser for the 2 books I might as well get them on order through the local library lol

BAZ A

I see someone has added endorsements for Ginger's book - publisher details below.

I picked up some similar comments for the Andy's book (same as the back cover). There are more on the Amazon site and on another thread on soulsource.

Furness Peninsula Press

On The Right Track with Northern Soul DJ Ginger Taylor price price £10.99 + £1.50 p/p in stock

by Rob Mckeever.

ISBN 978-0-9553283-3-6

Northern Soul: Music, drugs and subcultural identity

Andrew Wilson Willan Publishing, 2007; pp 214; £42.00, hbk ISBN-13: 978-1-84392-208-7

Frome £21 + pp on Amazon

... this book is rare example of a genuine historical ethnography: combining an external observer's sense of historical change and an insider's account of shared experience. Stan Cohen, London School of Economics

This book is based on a re-engagement with the Northern Soul Scene of the 1970s, and is a fine example of what Jules Henry termed passionate ethnography. Andy Wilson's account gains authenticity not only because he took part at the time but also because, over a decade later, he reconnected with his peers and what that experience means to them. In the process, he adds a new dimension to studies of popular culture and subcultural movements: their highly variable impact on people's lives over time. David Downes, London School of Economics

This is a fascinating sociological study of a neglected aspect of British cultural history, the Northern Soul scene, which in illuminating one particular example of the interplay of friendship, drugs and music shows how much can still be learnt about popular culture by the good use of a 'naturalistic' empirical methodology.

Simon Frith, University of Edinburgh

Sticking two fingers up to the 'academic-criminology-must-be-boring'school of thought, Northern Soul is ... Wilson has produced a fascinating account of the complex relationships between youth subculture in Northern towns, rare soul records imported from the USA, the all-night dance scene, amphetamine use and chemist shop burglaries. Reminiscent of the early work of Stan Cohen, David Downes and Jock Young, Northern Soul has the hallmarks of an instant classic. Highly recommended.

Ben Bowling, King's College, London

Northern Soul is a great book, accessible and engaging, but never slight on analysis. It should have a wide market amongst those interested in youth subculture, social history, drug use, and criminology generally, and I hope it is widely read. It is the type of criminology that deserves to be.

James Treadwell - Leicester University in Probation Journal

There, something for you to go on! But check this thread for more detail (and another fanzine review... Dave Rimmer(?)

Northern Soul: Music,drugs And Subcultural Identity, book for sale (thread heading)

Sam

[Baz Atkinson]

I see someone has added endorsements for Ginger's book - publisher details below.

I picked up some similar comments for the Andy's book (same as the back cover). There are more on the Amazon site and on another thread on soulsource.

Furness Peninsula Press

On The Right Track with Northern Soul DJ Ginger Taylor price price £10.99 + £1.50 p/p in stock

by Rob Mckeever.

ISBN 978-0-9553283-3-6

Northern Soul: Music, drugs and subcultural identity

Andrew Wilson Willan Publishing, 2007; pp 214; £42.00, hbk ISBN-13: 978-1-84392-208-7

Frome £21 + pp on Amazon

... this book is rare example of a genuine historical ethnography: combining an external observer's sense of historical change and an insider's account of shared experience. Stan Cohen, London School of Economics

This book is based on a re-engagement with the Northern Soul Scene of the 1970s, and is a fine example of what Jules Henry termed passionate ethnography. Andy Wilson's account gains authenticity not only because he took part at the time but also because, over a decade later, he reconnected with his peers and what that experience means to them. In the process, he adds a new dimension to studies of popular culture and subcultural movements: their highly variable impact on people's lives over time. David Downes, London School of Economics

This is a fascinating sociological study of a neglected aspect of British cultural history, the Northern Soul scene, which in illuminating one particular example of the interplay of friendship, drugs and music shows how much can still be learnt about popular culture by the good use of a 'naturalistic' empirical methodology.

Simon Frith, University of Edinburgh

Sticking two fingers up to the 'academic-criminology-must-be-boring'school of thought, Northern Soul is ... Wilson has produced a fascinating account of the complex relationships between youth subculture in Northern towns, rare soul records imported from the USA, the all-night dance scene, amphetamine use and chemist shop burglaries. Reminiscent of the early work of Stan Cohen, David Downes and Jock Young, Northern Soul has the hallmarks of an instant classic. Highly recommended.

Ben Bowling, King's College, London

Northern Soul is a great book, accessible and engaging, but never slight on analysis. It should have a wide market amongst those interested in youth subculture, social history, drug use, and criminology generally, and I hope it is widely read. It is the type of criminology that deserves to be.

James Treadwell - Leicester University in Probation Journal

There, something for you to go on! But check this thread for more detail (and another fanzine review... Dave Rimmer(?)

Northern Soul: Music,drugs And Subcultural Identity, book for sale (thread heading)

Sam

Cheers

BAZ A

[sister dawn]

well I cant wait to get mine, read it and add it to my forever expanding northern soul library.

[Chris Anderton]

I, like many others would love to read a book about the adventures of John Anderson, i really cant think of anyone more deserving of having a book published about Northern/rare soul. Not that John is the slightest bit interested, he cant see what all the fuss is about!

Someone was supposed to be writing a book about record finds in the States a few years back...anyone know what happened to it?

Chris

Edited May 19, 2009 by Chris Anderton

[Guest proudlove]

Totally agree,Swish would certainly have some tales to tell then again there were so many charachters around(imo)in the early seventies that i´m surprised there has not been a hundred books written!! Gloucester/Cheltenham could have one all to themselves.

Right again about Dean Parrish,met him at Hilton Park the night it had been stolen(before it was uncovered)

Steve

May be there should be a book done with chapters from different people from different areas from different eras,if you see what I mean.????

[Bigsoulman]

Whats up with Ginger... am i missing something?... i always have a laugh with him when we meet out... oooh the politics! i never get to know anything, too busy having fun! think i will buy the book.... is that a bad thing to do??... fill me in x

Agreed!, one of the nicest guys on the scene who always has time for a chat and a laugh, looking forward to catching up with him at Cleethorpes this year again

Lenny

[Dave Rimmer]

Has anyone found an on-line shop selling it yet ?

[Chapelisland]

Has anyone found an on-line shop selling it yet ?

Dave the book is avaiable from www.furness peninsula press.co.uk (signed copies if required) with previews and it is also listed on ebay

regards RMc

[Guest]

Has anyone found an on-line shop selling it yet ?

here's a link o order it:

https://www.raresoulman.co.uk/ROB_McKEEVER/artist-browse/bk/1

Same day dispatch they are in stock and selling fast.

[Bigsoulman]

Has anyone found an on-line shop selling it yet ?

Think you will be able to get it at Cleethorpes Dave, and get it signed by the wee man himself at the same time

Lenny

[Guest]

May be there should be a book done with chapters from different people from different areas from different eras,if you see what I mean.????

I wonder if that was Ian's theory with SWONS.. good idea Steve.

Jayne.x

[Guest]

May be there should be a book done with chapters from different people from different areas from different eras,if you see what I mean.????

Great idea - and some stories would probably be open to having 'both' sides of the 'event' told... in that messy way we often get to the bottom of what happened.

Like Swish with Dean Parrish: what was he doing leaving a case full of records with people he did hardly know on Leeds railway station? Some of them weren't even on the Scene...

[Guest proudlove]

Great idea - and some stories would probably be open to having 'both' sides of the 'event' told... in that messy way we often get to the bottom of what happened.

Like Swish with Dean Parrish: what was he doing leaving a case full of records with people he did hardly know on Leeds railway station? Some of them weren't even on the Scene...

Like asking Swish why he is nervous in cars?????